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The Market Place with Daryl Kwawu on JoyNews (1-8-23)
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NewsTranscript
00:00 Good afternoon, welcome to the Marketplace.
00:02 My name is Darrell Crowell.
00:03 Thanks for being with us this afternoon.
00:05 Coming up, government in a telephone
00:07 with independent power producers
00:09 of a proposal to restructure the over $1 billion, all them.
00:13 - In our position, non-emphatically
00:17 regarding the debt restructuring,
00:19 that we are not open to that.
00:22 We are open to a discussion,
00:24 discussing the payment plan of our areas.
00:29 - Also coming up, finance ministry begins process
00:31 to restructure pension funds worth 31 billion Ghana cities
00:35 in final phase of domestic debt exchange program.
00:38 Last, government expects positive results
00:45 from most of the economic policies undertaken
00:47 to stabilize the economy, but some experts are skeptical.
00:51 - Now we are using revenue,
00:53 total revenue to pay compensation and interest.
00:57 Even when we default with interest.
00:59 So where are you going to get a borrowing?
01:01 Even now domestic markets.
01:03 - Thanks for being with us.
01:06 Details coming up.
01:07 (upbeat music)
01:11 (upbeat music)
01:13 (upbeat music)
01:16 - Thanks for being with us.
01:41 First up, government is in a tough war
01:43 with the independent power producers
01:44 of a proposal to restructure the over $1 billion, all them.
01:48 John Hughes is learning a proposal for debt exchange
01:51 has been presented to the six IPPs for study and approval.
01:54 And some have already committed to the deal.
01:56 In all, government is hoping to restructure
01:58 over $2 billion or 23 billion cities debt
02:02 in the energy sector.
02:03 Despite the moves by government,
02:05 chief executive of the Chamber of Independent Power Producers
02:09 Ellie Plim at TocMoco says
02:11 they will not restructure the debt.
02:14 - We've made our position known emphatically
02:16 regarding the debt restructuring
02:18 that we are not open to that.
02:21 We are open to a discussion,
02:23 discussing the payment plan of our areas.
02:28 You know, when we are talking about debt restructuring,
02:31 it's a question of what you want to restructure.
02:35 We have made our position known that our areas in questions
02:40 relates to the cost of our services.
02:43 And also we indicated that our areas are actual obligations
02:49 that we have owed to our stakeholders,
02:53 particularly the lenders.
02:55 Again, suggesting that implies that IPPs
02:58 have some free cash flow over there
03:02 for which we are pressing them to accept a debt restructure,
03:06 which is actually not the case.
03:08 So for debt restructuring,
03:10 we are sure, I'm sure to tell you
03:12 that is not a position that IPPs will accept.
03:16 - All right, on Zoom with us is Dr. Isi Usulimana,
03:26 who is an energy strategist,
03:28 also chief executive of Eureka,
03:31 an energy consultancy firm.
03:33 Great to have you.
03:34 We're going to be talking about the media budget in a bit,
03:37 and matters concerning the energy sector.
03:40 First though, your reaction to this latest development
03:43 to do with the restructuring of debt owed IPPs.
03:47 Does it appear a good deal
03:48 tackling the indebtedness of the IPPs?
03:51 - Yeah, good afternoon to you, Darren,
03:56 and good afternoon to our chairs,
03:57 your voice in Ghana and across the globe.
03:59 Thank you for having me.
04:00 This is very interesting,
04:02 and I find it still unfortunate
04:06 at this moment in time,
04:07 this task has gone on for almost two months now,
04:10 and there seems not to be any sign.
04:13 And I find it very worrying,
04:14 because at the end of the day, Darren,
04:16 there's always a saying that if two elephants are fighting,
04:19 it is the grass that suffers.
04:21 The grass here is where the poor place in Ghana.
04:24 If they are not able to come up with a deal
04:27 in all this while, for almost two months,
04:30 then when are they going to come to any deal?
04:32 So that's my worry, the worry part of it.
04:34 But the way I see it,
04:36 it's almost looking like they want one,
04:38 one party wants to make the move,
04:40 and the other party is not willing to make any move.
04:42 And so in such a situation like that,
04:44 somebody has to extend their helping hand.
04:47 And in this case, they have to look at the poor place,
04:49 who is supposed to stand to benefit?
04:52 Is it the government?
04:53 Is it the IPP?
04:54 Or is it the poor place of Ghana?
04:56 So what I want to add is that,
04:58 I mean, debt restructuring is not anything bad,
05:01 especially if it will lead to sustainability
05:03 of the economy,
05:04 and then, but that should not also impact the IPPs
05:07 to the extent that they will be knocked out of business.
05:10 So this has to be very clear.
05:11 So what I think is, Dara,
05:13 like the chief executive rightly mentioned,
05:16 I think things are not very clear.
05:17 I'm talking about the IPPs, chief executive.
05:20 I think things are not very clear.
05:21 Maybe they are not sure which part of the debt
05:23 they are going to restructure.
05:25 So probably we have to segment it.
05:27 Maybe government has to make commitment
05:29 that I want to pay this aspect of the money,
05:31 and then restructure this.
05:32 I believe that's what is not happening.
05:35 I don't think it's just saying,
05:37 I want to restructure 100% of the debt
05:39 when you have not made any commitment.
05:41 So going forward,
05:41 what I want to urge government to do
05:43 is to extend some kind of good fee
05:48 in making available some portion of what is due debt.
05:53 If that is the case,
05:54 then maybe 80%, maybe at least 10%,
05:57 at least less structured than 70%.
05:59 Other than that, it looks like we're in inertia.
06:01 And what I also see within the IPPs,
06:03 I don't know, I don't want to say
06:04 whether they are cracks or whatever,
06:06 because on one hand,
06:07 government is saying some of them are okay,
06:09 and they are signing on to the restructuring.
06:12 And on the other hand,
06:14 the chief executive is saying they are not doing that.
06:16 So the IPPs, what I want to urge them,
06:18 they have to work in unison,
06:20 and they have to have united front.
06:22 Other than that, I mean,
06:23 this task is going to go on for God knows when.
06:26 And the development, I will be frank with you,
06:27 I'm not very pleased at this many times
06:30 that we don't have any insight.
06:32 And the high time they come to an agreement,
06:34 the better, you know, for the population of Ghana.
06:37 - Well, one of the issues we were hoping to hear
06:38 in the media budget was a clear plan
06:41 in tackling the debts of the IPP.
06:45 The debt has hit $2.2 billion,
06:49 and government has indicated that
06:51 is willing to comply with the cash waterfall mechanism
06:55 working dictates.
06:56 So how is that helpful in dealing with the debts
06:58 of the IPPs?
07:01 - Yeah, so that is just a part of it.
07:04 And I think that's also key.
07:05 And I was, that's one of the things
07:07 that I saw in the budget that gladdens me.
07:10 Because over the years, I will tell you in fact,
07:14 that what has contributed,
07:15 I mean, one of the components that has contributed
07:17 to where we are in terms of this quantum of debt
07:20 is the abandonment of the cash waterfall mechanism.
07:25 Because what it was set up to do,
07:27 we needed to have dedicated some amount of money
07:31 into this model, so that a power that given up will be paid.
07:36 But I think over the years,
07:37 money that have gone into the model,
07:39 it found itself into other areas.
07:43 You know, and that temptation is always there.
07:45 When money is available,
07:47 and you don't channel it to the right source,
07:49 it's going to find itself some use other places else.
07:52 So if the government is committing to coming back
07:55 to the cash waterfall mechanism,
08:00 I think it's the right way to go.
08:01 And that was one of the areas that I believe,
08:04 among other factors, is one of the things that would help,
08:07 you know, to minimize the debt burden.
08:10 Apart from the fact that we need to improve our efficiency
08:12 in all the value streams,
08:14 at least what we have collected,
08:17 we need to be able to channel it to key areas.
08:19 And one of the key areas is to make sure
08:21 that we meet some part of the money
08:23 due by the IPPCR.
08:28 - All right.
08:29 Yeah, you commented government for its focus
08:33 on the gas uptake issues,
08:35 but then you disappointed those no clarity
08:40 on the future of the thermal oil refinery.
08:42 - Yes, that's a fact.
08:46 And let me start with the gas uptake mechanism.
08:49 I know discussions are underway
08:51 to be able to ensure that,
08:54 because going forward,
08:55 TALO is going to commercialize their gas fields.
08:57 I mean, the gas that is coming from their fields.
08:59 You know, over the years,
09:00 TALO, we have so much opportunity.
09:02 TALO had given us over 200 billion cubic feet of gas,
09:06 and that was free.
09:07 That has come to an end.
09:08 And so they have to commercialize the next phase of it,
09:12 which means that government has to make some commitment.
09:14 And if you notice over the years,
09:16 in the oil fields, for instance,
09:17 and I'm saying they should negotiate in good faith
09:20 so that it will be a mutual beneficial situation.
09:22 Because if they don't negotiate in good faith,
09:24 and it doesn't become a mutual beneficial situation,
09:27 it's going to impact our oil production
09:28 and also our revenue flow.
09:30 And I'm saying that because in oil production,
09:32 especially if you have associated wells,
09:34 gas and well that comes with gas,
09:36 you need by all agency and by all means
09:40 to be able to display the gas in order to pay the oil.
09:43 2009, TALO suffered drastically in terms of their production
09:46 because of gas uptake issues.
09:47 And the reason that there was sacrifice in a way
09:51 because we had to compete with ENI.
09:52 And so TALO was like free and we're not taking it.
09:55 And that actually impacted their production.
09:56 So going forward, it's very passionate to me, Daryl,
10:00 because we need gas for our power generation.
10:02 If there's anything that is impacting our power generation
10:05 at this minute, it is gas.
10:07 And so if you have gas availability,
10:08 let's negotiate very well, get a good deal,
10:10 and let's not repeat old mistakes,
10:13 the old negotiations that didn't guarantee
10:16 any benefit, we don't have to repeat that.
10:19 - All right, just 30 seconds.
10:21 I just wanted to touch quickly on fuel prices
10:24 because we are just getting indication
10:26 that some oil marketing prices,
10:29 oil marketing companies rather have increased prices
10:32 at the pumps, a diesel, a little diesel and petrol
10:35 going for 12 CDs, 95 PSWs.
10:38 Quick thoughts on that.
10:39 - Yeah, so it's typically what we've been talking about.
10:45 So this moment we asked what is, where is good for oil,
10:49 where we have only been talking about.
10:51 So typically what is happening now, Daryl,
10:53 is just because of international dynamics.
10:55 And that's why we are seeing that this market is very wild.
10:58 Last time I attended the interview,
11:00 I stated categorically that I didn't expect
11:02 these oil prices to go beyond 80 in recent times.
11:06 But a lot of things have happened.
11:08 China consumption is beginning to pick up.
11:11 So even not even this quantitative tightening
11:15 within the market that was able to hold it.
11:17 And yet oil is now flattened around the 80s.
11:19 In fact, that's crossed a little bit around the 80s.
11:22 So this international dynamics
11:24 is what is directly feeding into our pumps.
11:27 And that's why I always say that we have to have a cushion.
11:29 I mean, we can't live by the dictates
11:31 of international dynamics.
11:32 If we don't have a cushion like a refinery,
11:34 we are always going to be impacted
11:37 when this market shift in any direction.
11:39 So yes, it's unfortunate, but that's the reality.
11:42 The international market is not that favourable
11:45 at this minute time, that all.
11:46 - All right, thank you so much, Dr. Isisulemana,
11:49 the Energy Strategist, also CEO of Eureka,
11:52 an energy consultancy firm.
11:55 Now, government has begun the process
11:56 to restructure the country's pension funds
11:58 with 31 billion cities.
12:00 It's therefore inviting holders of these bonds
12:02 to exchange it for a new set of government papers.
12:06 Here's more from George Afe.
12:08 - The finance ministry in a statement
12:12 noted that the invitation is intended
12:14 to enable pension funds to preserve
12:17 what government describes as their patrimonial value
12:21 whilst exchanging eligible bonds
12:23 for papers that offer more potential liquidity.
12:27 The offer is targeted at pension funds
12:29 that have been invested in government of Ghana bonds,
12:32 the ESLA PLC, and the Darche Trust PLC.
12:36 The offer we started from yesterday
12:38 is however expected to end on the 18th of this month.
12:41 However, the Ministry of Finance maintains
12:44 that it may extend the offer subject
12:46 to how the exercise goes.
12:48 Government earlier this year announced
12:50 that it has reached an agreement
12:52 with the public sector workers
12:53 on how it should handle their pension funds going forward.
12:57 However, it is not clear for now
12:59 whether all the various unions are on board
13:01 to respect these proposals that government has tabled
13:04 in its fresh debt exchange program for the pension funds.
13:09 - Meantime, government says it is expecting
13:11 some positive results from most of the economic policies
13:14 undertaken to stabilize the economy.
13:17 Presenting the mid-year budget in Parliament,
13:19 the Minister of Finance, Ken Oforiata,
13:20 said Ghana will soon produce more domestic goods
13:23 to replace imported ones.
13:25 Here's more in this report.
13:27 - Dating Parliament on the policy measures
13:29 implemented so far in the 2023 budget and fiscal year,
13:32 Mr. Oforiata showed that efforts are being made
13:35 to stabilize the economy.
13:37 According to him, many of the policies
13:39 will begin to yield results soon.
13:41 - We have turned the corner,
13:43 and more importantly, we are determined
13:46 to continue down that path.
13:48 Soon, we expect the measures taken
13:50 result in economic activity greater
13:53 than anything experienced in the history
13:55 of the fourth republic.
13:56 Our plans and programs should soon lead
13:59 to a sustained increase in domestic production,
14:01 including manufacturing and farming,
14:03 and the creation of a new economy.
14:05 - The Finance Minister also hinted of plans
14:07 to collaborate with the private sector
14:10 to ensure a friendly business environment
14:12 to attract both local and foreign investors.
14:15 - Develop the framework for the V20 Climate Prosperity Plan
14:19 to attract climate investment from the private sector,
14:22 and instituted the Mutual Prosperity Dialogue
14:26 to crowd in domestic and extend our private investment
14:29 to the private sector.
14:31 - The Minister of Finance, Ken Oforiata,
14:33 also hinted of plans to collaborate with the private sector
14:36 to attract local and foreign investors.
14:39 - The Minister of Finance, Ken Oforiata,
14:41 also hinted of plans to attract local and foreign investors.
14:44 - Despite the challenges faced with revenue mobilization,
14:47 government has decided to stay away from requesting
14:49 for more funds.
14:50 However, the Minister announced a reduction in appropriation
14:54 from 207.7 billion citizens to 206 billion citizens.
15:01 - Minister of Finance, we're proud, grateful you could join us.
15:04 I want to first start with your view of the media budget
15:07 presented by the Finance Minister yesterday.
15:09 - Good afternoon, and thank you for having me.
15:13 Good afternoon to your viewers.
15:15 If you ask me, this budget speaks to reality.
15:20 I will say that government is now admitting
15:24 that its policies were not working in the past,
15:30 especially admitting to reduce the GDP growth
15:35 to your 1% percentage points.
15:38 This is very important.
15:41 There was one also admission by government
15:45 in the way the accounting is done.
15:47 People are not paying attention to it,
15:50 but to me, it's very significant.
15:53 The government admitted that now the accounting process
15:56 is going to be done based on commitment basis.
15:59 And what it means is that they are going to use
16:01 our cruel concepts in recognizing all kinds of liabilities
16:06 into the budget preparation.
16:10 That will really help us to ascertain
16:12 the real levels of debt levels
16:16 and be able to compute and know the actual figures.
16:19 So these are my thoughts for me.
16:23 And in this year state,
16:24 the government is admitting to reality
16:25 that their policies in the past did not work
16:28 and they are now going to work to be able to make sure
16:31 that the economy come back to normal.
16:35 - Well, the finance minister is being criticized
16:37 for saying that we've turned the corner
16:39 and things are improving.
16:41 And at the same time, revising our GDP estimates.
16:45 - I mean, the fact is that where did we see the turn?
16:49 The turn happened, or where did we see the change
16:53 in the financial economic activities of Ghana?
16:56 That was pre-COVID.
16:59 So if the finance minister want to say
17:01 he has turned the corner,
17:03 then it means that the economy by now
17:05 would have gone back to the pre-COVID figures.
17:08 Then see a further reduction thereafter.
17:12 Then I'm sure that you will accept that
17:14 he can say that he has turned the corner.
17:16 But as we have seen,
17:17 the economic indicators are not the same
17:21 as 2019 economic indicators.
17:24 So probably maybe he was speaking to give hope
17:28 to Ghanians for us to have fit in the economy
17:31 and still contribute our quota.
17:33 But we have not got into the stage
17:36 where we can see that the economic situation
17:39 has turned around.
17:40 If you look at the figures coming from Ghana's
17:43 at-risk service,
17:44 we've seen that it's still moving up a little bit.
17:50 So if I were the finance minister,
17:51 I would wait to have some figures
17:54 that were pre-COVID financial indicators.
17:58 Then I'll be able to use the term turning the corner.
18:01 - Well, so the government did not ask for more money
18:06 as expected,
18:08 but the finance minister announced a 21 billion
18:12 city cut in total spending for the next half of this year.
18:16 How significant is this?
18:18 - I mean, this is very important.
18:20 You know, we have all been talking about
18:22 government reducing its expenditure.
18:26 We noticed from the budget that the government revenue,
18:29 projected revenue,
18:30 and also we are not sure of attaining the same revenue.
18:35 So what is the prudent thing to do
18:38 is to make sure that your expenditure is reduced.
18:40 If you ask me,
18:41 I will still expect government to work hard
18:44 to reduce the expenditure even more than the 21 billion.
18:49 And that has been stated.
18:51 Indeed, if you really want to achieve the set target
18:55 for the GDP growth,
18:56 that is the 1.2% or 1.5% that you have said,
19:01 this will require a further reduction in expenditure
19:05 so that they will be able to achieve that set target.
19:08 If not this set target,
19:10 if they continue with expansionary projects,
19:15 this cannot be achieved.
19:16 - So I want us to listen to the former finance minister.
19:20 He has cautioned that the nature of the mid-year budget
19:23 shows that government may not meet its revenue target again
19:27 in the next half of this year or in this second half,
19:30 as we saw in the first half of this year.
19:33 And Mr. Tekwe says government's inability
19:35 to go to the international market to borrow
19:37 also makes the situation dire.
19:40 Listen to him and I'll take your views on the other side.
19:43 - It's a country that has been doing tax reforms
19:46 since the 1980s with VAT and everything.
19:49 We lack the time to continue.
19:51 But if you have regulated a VAT
19:54 and you want to, for example,
19:56 removing a debt fund and NHIL from the base
20:01 and then denying input tax credits and refund to businesses
20:07 and it's increasing costs and causing inflation.
20:10 If you want to come back to the old structure in the VAT,
20:15 you have to do it over a period of time
20:18 because otherwise you are going to be set
20:21 your December scenario if you rush it.
20:25 So that's why I said we are in a structural mood.
20:29 And let me also reemphasize,
20:30 so that is revenue expenditure.
20:34 There's a chance to reduce, you know,
20:37 flagship projects and even you can see in this review,
20:39 a long list of them.
20:41 Now we are using revenue,
20:43 total revenue to pay compensation and interest,
20:46 even when we default with interest.
20:48 So where are you going to get a borrowing?
20:51 Even now domestic markets, no residents are visited.
20:55 So where are you going to do the borrowing to support this?
20:58 Because all your revenue,
20:59 I can bet between now and the end of the year,
21:02 and given that we don't have the assets, you know,
21:05 to borrow from the bond market,
21:09 domestic and external markets,
21:11 they get something from only multilaterals basically,
21:15 which will be substantive.
21:17 It means that you are not in a position yet,
21:21 you know, to even borrow to support those initiatives
21:24 in the next one year.
21:26 And remember there is a cap.
21:27 There's a cap as we have 500 million
21:31 annually commercial borrowing.
21:33 That's all you can do for commercial borrowing
21:36 with the exception of, you know,
21:38 the soft ones like the World Bank and the IMF,
21:41 you know, African Development Bank, you know, which flowing.
21:44 Otherwise, if you want to do something substantive,
21:47 you have to go and get a waiver,
21:49 you know, from the IMF board.
21:51 Right, these are the really, we've done IMF program.
21:54 So we should bring those things,
21:55 experiences into perspective,
21:57 because they are not going to change.
21:59 - That was the former finance minister,
22:03 Setekwe, do you agree with him?
22:04 - I think he's right on point.
22:09 What he has mentioned is true.
22:11 He is speaking from experience,
22:13 and the data also speaks to it that
22:15 from the rate things are going,
22:17 it's likely that we will not be able to achieve
22:20 the set revenue target.
22:22 So in economics and in finance,
22:25 there's something called the living care.
22:28 Sometimes when you increase your tax rates so high,
22:32 it gets to a point it becomes disincentive.
22:35 So that is where we have got into.
22:38 The tax rates in Ghana are very high,
22:41 and people are rather instead of seeking ways
22:44 to avoid or evade a payment of taxes.
22:48 And this is one of the reasons why we've seen
22:51 a sharp reduction in the revenue for,
22:55 we cannot go to the international market
22:57 because we don't have the ability to pay.
22:59 So as for that one, it's not something that we can,
23:02 we can really have a discussion on it, as he mentioned.
23:06 I'm sure if I were the government,
23:08 I will still continue with the tax revenues measures
23:12 that were implemented with a compliance approach,
23:15 and get the GRE officers to go on the field,
23:18 stay in offices of companies and manufacturing firms
23:22 and institutions to make sure that
23:25 the people are being compliant and paying the right taxes.
23:28 That is the only way probably to increase the revenue.
23:31 If government fails to do that,
23:33 I mean, it's going to get worse in our revenue form.
23:36 Because once the tax rate goes high,
23:38 all players will start to thinking of
23:41 how do we avoid or evade tax.
23:44 And so, and where we have gotten to a 22% of our VAT tax,
23:49 corporate tax being increased,
23:52 we've seen the financial sector
23:53 not very significantly improved.
23:57 So these measures will really,
23:59 are going to affect revenue generation,
24:01 so unless it is through compliance.
24:03 One other significant thing, the property tax,
24:06 we have not seen it really significant.
24:09 If government can ensure that individuals
24:13 who own assets, properties,
24:15 start to pay the property tax,
24:17 this can also increase the tax revenue in Ghana.
24:21 - All right, just a minute.
24:24 I want to ask you about one of our top stories today
24:26 to do with a government indicating
24:29 that it has begun the process of restructuring
24:32 the pension funds worth 31 billion CEDs.
24:36 What are the implications?
24:38 - This was to come, just that it was delayed.
24:43 Implication is that it's going to affect
24:46 payment of pensioners, their due,
24:51 when a lot of people go on retirement.
24:55 That is the implication.
24:57 So, and probably we may also see,
24:59 because of restructuring in the pension fund
25:03 processes in Ghana,
25:06 I'm sure SNITS through it may also have to come out
25:10 with a strategy to be able to find a sustainability.
25:13 If not, we may also see SNITS posing a significant losses
25:18 in the coming years,
25:20 which is really going to affect the financial sector
25:24 and also pensioners.
25:25 So that is the major issue I see,
25:29 that at the end of the day,
25:31 the individual pensioner is the one going to suffer.
25:34 For us who are very young,
25:36 we may not see the impact now,
25:39 but those who are already on pension
25:41 or preparing to go on retirement,
25:44 we may see that they will be suffering
25:47 from getting their funds paid to them
25:49 when they go on retirement.
25:51 - Thank you so much, Professor William Sipwa,
25:53 he's Associate Professor of Finance
25:55 at the Andrews University in the US.
25:57 Before we go, ratings agency Fitch
26:00 has affirmed Ghana's credit rating at restrictive default.
26:04 The rating is coming after the country received
26:06 an international monetary fund program in May,
26:09 unlocking the funds board approval
26:11 for a $3 billion three-year extended credit facility.
26:15 Here's more in this report.
26:17 - Fitch downgraded Ghana's rating to restrictive default
26:21 from C on 21st February, 2023,
26:24 following the expiration of the Great Spirit
26:26 for a missed Eurobond coupon payment.
26:29 According to the rating agency,
26:31 the country has since made progress with official creditors
26:34 for a restructuring of its external debts
26:36 under the G20 Common Framework.
26:39 It said authorities are looking to restructure
26:41 $20 billion of external debt,
26:44 including official bilateral debt,
26:46 Eurobonds, among others.
26:48 It continued that,
26:49 financing assurances have been provided
26:51 by the official creditor committee
26:53 at its first meeting on 12th May,
26:55 unlocking the IMF board approval
26:57 for a $3 billion three-year extended credit facility.
27:01 Fitch therefore expects the committee
27:03 to reach an agreement with the government
27:05 by the end of 2023,
27:07 and a treatment of private creditors' claims
27:10 on comparable terms by mid-2024.
27:13 The IMF estimates the financing
27:14 from external debt restructuring
27:16 must amount to $10.5 billion between 2023 and 2026.
27:24 Like we indicated, fuel prices have gone up.
27:27 Petrol or diesel selling at 12 cities, 95 pesos a litre.
27:30 You can read more on our website,
27:32 myjoyonline.com/business.
27:34 My name is Darrell Powell.
27:35 Thanks for watching.
27:36 We will be back same time tomorrow.
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