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MEDI1TV Afrique : L’impact de l’âge sur la prise de décision- La "Mindfulness" pour l’épanouissement des jeunes? - 13/01/2024
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00:00 [MUSIC PLAYING]
00:03 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:05 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:08 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:11 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:13, Mindfulness.
00:21 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:24 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:46 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:48 [SPEAKING FRENCH]
00:52 Mustapha, thank you. And next to me we have Massamba, you are a coach and also a trainer, a coach in personal development.
01:00 - Yes, yes, yes. Thank you, it's me who thanks you. It's a real pleasure to be here today.
01:05 - Alfa, thank you to a familiar of Generation News, you are a journalist. Thank you for responding to our invitation.
01:11 - Hello, Selmi. Hello to my fellow debaters and thank you for the invitation.
01:17 - Very well. We are talking about mindfulness. You may have already heard this word or not.
01:22 So we're going to talk about it. I start with you, Massamba.
01:28 We know that mindfulness is full consciousness. But with your own words, can you tell us what it is exactly?
01:35 - Indeed, mindfulness is the practice of full consciousness, which allows the human being to become aware,
01:44 in order to be able to flourish. Because we cannot speak of flourishing without self-knowledge.
01:51 Because we cannot live in happiness without aspiring to be able to manage our emotions, our thoughts and be at peace with ourselves.
01:59 Hence the importance of this practice, which has been known for a long time by Buddhists,
02:04 and today which is a necessity, a key to be able to flourish fully in one's life.
02:11 - Do you agree or do you have another definition of this word?
02:16 - Absolutely. I think Massamba has very well elucidated the theme.
02:20 Full consciousness, as we are used to seeing it, to become aware.
02:24 When we talk about mindfulness, it is to become aware of one's actions, to have a control over one's life.
02:30 This is how we will be able to access the flourishing, to become aware of one's actions,
02:35 to have self-knowledge, to know oneself first, it is very important.
02:39 To also have self-confidence, to have control over one's life, over one's actions.
02:44 So if you lack these notions, we can think that you may have this problem,
02:49 to be in full consciousness, to be aware of your actions and your results as well.
02:54 For example, this is a very important theme and I think we will be able to really talk about it.
02:59 - Alpha, I would also ask you the same question,
03:03 to see if you share the opinion of Mustafa, of Massamba, regarding mindfulness.
03:11 - Yes, they have well laid out the background, I agree with them.
03:16 Maybe I will just try to add that it is a practice that is either known or unknown,
03:24 but I think we all practice it.
03:26 Yes, we can be aware that it exists precisely through research.
03:32 That is why we ask people to read, to get informed, to discover.
03:36 It allows you to have a mastery of the concepts that we practice,
03:45 but we do not know what it is.
03:49 - In English, it is the word that poses a problem, as you say, we practice it on a daily basis.
03:56 - Absolutely. - Without knowing it.
03:58 - I think we do it consciously or unconsciously.
04:01 There are people who do it consciously.
04:03 For example, the practice of yoga, which is a practice that can be assimilated with spirituality.
04:11 The coach spoke earlier about Buddhists.
04:16 You see, for example, these people, when they are sitting alone,
04:19 that is, in an environment that is quite calm, quite peaceful,
04:23 they concentrate, they close their eyes and they spend a rather serious time of concentration and meditation,
04:32 which may be for the purpose of, I don't know ...
04:38 - To find peace, inner peace. - Yes, exactly.
04:41 That is the expression, to find inner peace.
04:44 For example, we also do it in Muslim culture.
04:49 - Meditation. - Meditation.
04:51 Sometimes you can see someone who retreats.
04:53 Often we have spoken in the history of Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him,
04:58 of a cave in which he went to take refuge to worship God.
05:03 - Okay. - Yes.
05:04 So in worship, even of God, sometimes we need this practice of mindfulness.
05:10 - Very good. So I like what he is saying.
05:13 This refers to this form of mindfulness.
05:19 However, there is also a part that we call formal and informal.
05:25 As he said earlier, meditation is much more formal.
05:30 And when I was doing research, I realized that there is also this aspect of formal and informal.
05:38 I don't know if you share this opinion. What do you think?
05:41 Indeed, you know, I think what you need to understand first,
05:45 is that when we talk about the human being, there are two fundamental dimensions.
05:49 Spirituality and physics. Everything is spiritual before being physical.
05:53 That is to say, when the human being lives, by concentrating on the outside, he is in survival.
06:00 But to live, it is not bad, you have to be in contact with yourself.
06:04 So this part that you call informal, it has the quintessence of the human being.
06:11 Because when we do meditation, as Alpha just said, prayer has a meditative effect.
06:18 All this is to be aware, to go inside ourselves, in order to be able to flourish in life.
06:28 In other words, to be in contact with our soul.
06:33 The goal of this, Mustafa, is to seek the inner peace, as Alpha said, and to know yourself.
06:43 Is it important today to know this mindfulness? What is it in the end?
06:50 What are we looking for? Are we looking to be fulfilled?
06:53 Indeed, it is the fulfillment that we are looking for, and it is difficult to obtain it,
06:57 given the evolution of the world today, given what is happening every day,
07:00 with stress, with problems and everything.
07:03 So it is actually to seek the fulfillment.
07:06 And I think there are several ways, as Alpha and Masamba said,
07:10 several ways that we can use to go towards this fulfillment,
07:14 including prayer, meditation, introspection, asking questions about yourself,
07:19 making a self-assessment, going to see a psychiatrist.
07:22 All these are methods that allow us to find ourselves.
07:25 Because at some point, when we are always running, we are always working,
07:28 we are in business, we are in fields, at some point, we forget,
07:31 we end up not being able to find ourselves.
07:34 And to be able to be saved, you will have to find yourself,
07:37 to take care of yourself, physically, psychologically.
07:40 Because we usually take care of our clothes, perfume, beautiful glasses, a beautiful car,
07:45 and we forget what is most important, it is us, in fact, this inner peace that we have.
07:50 For example, sometimes you see a poor man who has nothing, but who is happy, who lives well,
07:54 who is satisfied with what he has. You see a rich man who is always depressed, always nervous,
07:59 because he does not have this full consciousness of himself, he does not know himself,
08:03 he does not flourish inside, which is why it is good to practice what is called meditation,
08:09 prayer, to ask yourself questions, to travel, to decompress, to go out from time to time.
08:16 And silence also plays a role in this sense.
08:19 I would like to come back to this aspect, informal and formal evil.
08:24 So meditation, as I said earlier, informal evil, is that there are no rules.
08:33 And when we talk about evil, where there are rules, formal evil,
08:39 does not it precisely join religion, as you said earlier?
08:43 And if this is the case, it means that for this informal evil, everyone has his own rules.
08:49 It means that we can adapt things by ourselves to have this inner peace.
08:54 And it is quite normal, I think there is no problem with that,
09:00 since we are different, we have different reactions, we have different emotions,
09:06 we have different points of view, so everyone can try to practice it in their own way,
09:16 or at least in the way they understand things.
09:19 What is good here, is that we are circumscribing the expression in science.
09:29 That is, we are going to bring out the expression today, and everyone who is interested will be able to understand what it is.
09:36 But I think it is very old, it does not start today.
09:40 Maybe the vulgarization of the expression is unknown, or has just been known, it depends.
09:50 It depends, since in my research I have seen that it does not date from now, we are not talking about the 1900s.
09:57 But when we take the aspect of spirituality, for example fasting is for me the best way to practice this mindfulness.
10:09 Because we, Muslims, we say to ourselves, when you fast, you should not lie.
10:15 That is, we teach you ways that you must perpetually continue.
10:20 That is precisely the philosophical aspect that I draw from fasting.
10:25 We tell you not to lie, when you fast, you do not lie.
10:28 But when you fast, that is, you do not eat until a certain period, in any case.
10:34 These are practices that must be continued.
10:39 We show you that during this period, we ask for it, but it is a habit of life, it is a behavior,
10:45 it is an attitude of values that must be continued to preserve.
10:50 Yes, a way of life, a lifestyle. Masamba, always in that sense.
10:56 Today, people think a lot more about their past, their future, and forget their present.
11:04 So with this method, we should think about our present, enjoy these instant moments, of what we are living.
11:14 Is it the same way that you see things? Do you share what I am saying?
11:21 Yes, I share and support this idea.
11:26 Because happiness exists only in the present moment.
11:30 The past does not exist anymore. The future does not exist yet.
11:35 So everything that exists is the present moment.
11:38 So the way of fulfillment will pass by living in the present moment.
11:43 Now, how to achieve it?
11:45 There are several techniques that we apply, for example, in individual therapies.
11:49 We are talking about psychotherapy.
11:51 There is meditation, religious prayer, as you said earlier, fasting.
11:56 But there are also many other practices.
11:59 But everything that we do is to allow the human being to be in contact with himself.
12:04 This is what pushed the Swiss psychiatrist Carl Gustav Jung to say,
12:08 "Those who look outside dream, those who look inside awake."
12:14 Because the solution to all our problems lies deep inside us.
12:18 This is also what pushed religions, ancient wisdom, and initiatory sciences to support self-knowledge since the dawn of time.
12:27 "Know Thyself" is the first philosophical teaching, and it is the way.
12:32 And precisely, is this fulfilment limited to ourselves?
12:35 When we see people around us who are happy, I think we are also happy.
12:40 Maybe not everyone will share this opinion.
12:42 Mustafa, for you, does fulfilment stop with yourself?
12:47 Or do you also support others? Do you encourage others to be fulfilled?
12:51 Absolutely. I think we can be fulfilled by giving smiles to others.
12:55 Personally, that's what I do. I am a trainer. I am fulfilled in this.
12:59 So you are an entrepreneur, you are also a trainer.
13:02 Absolutely. I am in both.
13:04 The reason is that when I do it, I find myself, I feel good, by doing good to others.
13:09 So for me, the best way to be fulfilled is to give service to others.
13:14 The one who is born not to give service to someone, who is born to do nothing for society,
13:19 is a danger to the population.
13:21 Because we should not be born and leave like that, zero.
13:24 But if we succeed, we are fulfilled, we succeed.
13:27 Yes, but how do we succeed?
13:28 Are we going to judge this person today?
13:29 But how do we succeed?
13:30 To be a billionaire, for example, if we talk about finance, we will have to do business, we will have to sell.
13:35 And what is the role of an entrepreneur?
13:37 It is to solve problems.
13:38 You solve problems, you give smiles to people, you treat people, you are a doctor, it depends.
13:43 You solve problems, you have a remuneration.
13:45 Here, it is the entrepreneurial allocation.
13:47 Absolutely.
13:48 Mustafa, as an example.
13:50 Alpha would like to react.
13:52 Yes, a little reaction on the basis of what Mustafa is developing.
13:56 If we leave the professional aspect, the entrepreneurial aspect, to speak individually,
14:03 for example, someone who succeeds among people who are unhappy, for example.
14:08 Or someone, for example, who manages to be the first in the class, knowing that there are people who have not succeeded during the exam.
14:16 How can this failure happen?
14:19 Because can these people feel the joy that you feel?
14:23 You may have congratulated or encouraged them, but can this encouragement not be perceived as a mockery?
14:30 Absolutely.
14:31 Yes, this friend comes to me because I didn't have one, he tells me, "Yes, next year it will be fine."
14:35 While he could have failed.
14:37 This is where, in my opinion, the definition of the failure is located.
14:44 It is first yourself.
14:45 There is the environment too.
14:49 The example I gave here is to show that in this need to flourish,
14:59 we can hurt others by thinking that we are doing things right.
15:03 Because it is certain that we cannot fail an exam and start laughing and dancing.
15:08 Just as we cannot succeed in an exam.
15:12 For example, I experienced this with my baccalaureate.
15:14 When a friend gets his baccalaureate, he no longer tries to understand how...
15:20 How others have failed.
15:22 No, it's extreme joy.
15:23 But if he is happy, I don't see the harm.
15:26 Yes, but what I'm saying is that he is happy, but there is his environment.
15:31 You see people who are there, they cry, they take them by the hand, they fall.
15:35 You understand this reaction a little.
15:38 Sometimes you express immense joy, you know that you are happy when you come home,
15:42 but on the other hand, there is someone in front of you,
15:44 maybe you even know that she is crying.
15:46 So if we want to talk about mindfulness,
15:50 can we talk about full consciousness in this case?
15:54 Is it applied or not for someone who has obtained his baccalaureate,
15:58 but who ignores a little the others who have failed?
16:00 Yes, so that's to show the limits of mindfulness.
16:03 These are the limits of mindfulness.
16:06 There are details to be made because I am not in phase with him already.
16:10 When we talk about the environment,
16:12 it's not what happens to us that makes us unhappy.
16:15 It's the way we perceive what happens to us.
16:18 There are things, it's our spring as human beings.
16:21 There are things, other things that are the spring of God.
16:24 Now the way to manage this subtlety, this interaction with others,
16:29 the reality in which we live, the trials that come to us,
16:32 that's what creates our condition of being.
16:35 Because happiness, unhappiness, all you can say,
16:38 depends on the intrinsic relationship that we have with ourselves.
16:41 What happens here.
16:43 And sometimes there are things that can happen that we did not expect.
16:46 Of course.
16:47 That's what I mean, the mental, emotional, behavioral register
16:50 determines the character of the human being.
16:52 Now, how to manage these things that you say that happen to us?
16:57 It's where happiness or unhappiness is.
17:01 The way to manage the things that happen to us.
17:04 The way to understand.
17:06 Success is in everyone.
17:08 Indeed.
17:09 I am not sure I am convinced.
17:12 His language, his language, he, we listen to you.
17:15 We talked about emotions.
17:17 We will let him speak.
17:19 I insist, I am convinced of this.
17:23 Because for a long time I have accompanied people too.
17:26 So I think that I am able to know if the practice of full consciousness
17:32 can help all human beings to flourish.
17:35 What is it?
17:37 By becoming aware of these acts, of these actions,
17:40 everything that we pose as actions, is that it?
17:42 First, it is to be aware of our inner patterns,
17:45 of how we function.
17:47 That is to say, I am talking about the cognitive, emotional and behavioral dimension.
17:51 This is what will allow us to be able to put our unconscious,
17:55 our shadow areas, to know how we can change,
17:59 change our mind.
18:01 Because it all depends here, the way we think.
18:04 This is what creates our condition of being.
18:06 But there is also a point.
18:08 I will finish.
18:09 What he said is that the same techniques do not work for everyone.
18:13 We must probe the consciousness of the human being to know
18:16 what will allow him to practice full consciousness.
18:19 But still, there will be techniques that will allow everyone
18:23 to be able to find themselves.
18:25 Yes, I would like Mustafa to react.
18:29 Mustafa, you say you agree with him.
18:32 When he was talking earlier, you said you agree with him.
18:35 I would like to know what you think.
18:37 I do not agree with what he said about the environment.
18:41 When I talk about fulfillment, as we say,
18:44 a word has more meaning than a context.
18:46 There are contexts where we can really flourish.
18:49 But in our real life, do we have a life that we dream of?
18:52 Do we have this life that we want?
18:54 If we enter into this debate, I think we will never finish.
18:57 Because happiness has its own perception of happiness.
19:00 My happiness can be different from yours,
19:02 different from Masamba's.
19:04 So each person has his own perception of what makes him happy,
19:08 what makes him fulfilled,
19:10 what makes him really satisfied with his current life
19:12 and what he is doing.
19:14 The reason for which, when we enter into this sense,
19:16 maybe we will spend nights talking about it.
19:19 It is not the definition of happiness, it is the definition of fulfillment.
19:22 I am not talking about happiness.
19:24 Even fulfillment depends on the person.
19:26 It depends on what we think, what we do.
19:29 But when we are fulfilled, when we are fulfilled instantly,
19:32 we have happiness instantly.
19:34 We cannot talk about fulfillment without talking about happiness.
19:36 This is what we need to understand.
19:38 We can never talk about fulfillment and talk about happiness.
19:40 This is impossible.
19:42 The reason why I alluded to happiness.
19:44 For example, someone who just had his baccalaureate degree,
19:47 he is happy, happiness is there, he smiles, he forgets everyone.
19:50 Instantly, he is fulfilled.
19:52 The emotion is no longer present.
19:54 So the manifestation is an important element.
19:57 It is central.
19:59 It is a central element.
20:01 We will let Alpha react.
20:03 It is a central element.
20:05 Why is it central?
20:07 Because emotion is part of self-control.
20:09 There is an emotional intelligence.
20:11 Yes, we will let him react.
20:13 You who gave this information.
20:15 What is it called?
20:17 The fulfillment, he said, is happiness for some,
20:19 for others it is freedom.
20:21 It can be happiness, it can be freedom.
20:23 It includes several factors
20:25 that can be included in the account.
20:27 But here, what I was saying,
20:29 in this mindfulness,
20:31 you talked about knowing yourself.
20:33 And in this knowing yourself,
20:35 let's also talk about fulfillment
20:37 and the environment.
20:39 I think my answer was much more based on the question that Sirmi had asked.
20:47 Is it that when we are fulfilled,
20:51 others must also be fulfilled?
20:55 Or in any case,
20:57 this fulfillment must be contagious.
20:59 That's what I was saying.
21:01 I was saying that this fulfillment must be framed.
21:03 Our happiness is not everyone's happiness.
21:05 Just like our misfortune is not everyone's misfortune.
21:07 So I was just saying,
21:09 can we accompany others?
21:11 Encourage others to be fulfilled?
21:13 Is it in the same sense?
21:15 It's in the same sense that I was talking about someone who had this exam.
21:19 Yes, but you have to make a difference.
21:21 When I say encourage others,
21:23 there are people who don't trust themselves.
21:27 For example,
21:29 there are people who don't trust themselves,
21:31 don't have self-esteem.
21:33 And you feel clearly that this person needs your advice.
21:37 At this moment, you can help them to flourish.
21:41 Because if the person manages to understand all these aspects in their life,
21:45 they will be able to get by and make good decisions in their life.
21:49 Which means that mindfulness acts in the family, personal and even professional life.
21:57 Exactly, Masamba.
21:59 It's true because,
22:03 as I said at the beginning,
22:05 and as Alpha just highlighted,
22:07 when he talks about the environment,
22:09 it's to answer your question, of course.
22:13 It's not what's happening around you that makes you unhappy or happy,
22:17 but your way of perceiving it.
22:19 I think I made it clear.
22:21 Now, we need to know how to accompany the human being.
22:24 But all the approaches, whether spiritual, religious,
22:27 whatever you want, cognitive and behavioral therapy,
22:30 whatever you can use,
22:32 the pen and the all that,
22:34 it's in a dynamic to allow the human being to be centered.
22:38 But sometimes I still understand Alpha's position.
22:42 It's true that we defined the word,
22:44 we forgot this practice, mindfulness,
22:48 but the question is, does it allow us to go towards fulfillment?
22:53 That's the question.
22:55 We haven't talked about the disadvantages of mindfulness.
22:57 Does mindfulness have disadvantages?
22:59 He is convinced because he accompanies young people.
23:02 We haven't talked about the advantages, but can it have disadvantages?
23:05 Indeed, it can.
23:07 Because if the human being has not understood who he is,
23:11 imagine, you told me about fasting.
23:13 I come and I start fasting to practice mindfulness.
23:16 First, I need to know how I function.
23:19 Programming, because we are programmed since our first year of birth.
23:23 Now, knowing our programming, our mental, cognitive register,
23:28 I mean, emotional and behavioral register,
23:30 will allow me to know how I can apply this awareness.
23:34 So, Mustafa, you're going to help us, for all these people who follow us.
23:38 What do they have to do to be fulfilled?
23:40 Do they necessarily need mindfulness or is there something else?
23:44 As we said earlier,
23:46 mindfulness is a term that we have already named, but we have not created.
23:51 It has existed since the dawn of time.
23:53 Most of the terms you see today are just terms we named.
23:57 They are not terms we created overnight.
23:59 This is what we do every day.
24:01 Some people do it.
24:02 It's like doing business and not knowing the existence of the word entrepreneurship.
24:06 I think everyone does mindfulness.
24:09 Everyone can do it, but maybe in a different way.
24:12 Some do it by praying, some do it by meditating,
24:15 some do it by doing something they like, etc.
24:18 By working, etc.
24:20 So, each person has their own way of practicing what we call mindfulness.
24:24 There are people who received it in their education.
24:27 They did not make any effort.
24:29 They did not make any effort to read a book, to watch a movie.
24:33 It is a gift from education that we have transmitted.
24:36 It is a practice that allows them to know themselves.
24:40 Do we still have to encourage this at school?
24:43 Alpha, what do you think?
24:45 I think it must be the sense.
24:49 When we go to school, it is precisely to know ourselves.
24:53 To know and practice.
24:55 Whether we say it or not, as I said, consciously or unconsciously,
24:58 a student can say to himself, "I am good at French. I am good at math."
25:02 For example, it is a state of consciousness.
25:05 But is it because you are bad at math that you cannot succeed?
25:09 You cannot succeed in transcending this fear or this idea that you have?
25:14 This is the role of the teacher, for example.
25:16 Through practice, through his functioning,
25:19 and the tips he gives to his students,
25:21 for example, that is where it becomes interesting,
25:24 and that is where some succeed, and that is where some teachers fail.
25:27 You have other teachers who encourage you, who motivate you,
25:30 and today you have one out of twenty in math,
25:32 but no, next time you can find yourself with 15, 17.
25:36 Sometimes they even give you an exercise to give you a minus
25:39 in this subject that you thought you were bad at.
25:43 Just like there are other teachers who tell you, "No, no, you are bad,"
25:46 and who even throw the sheet.
25:48 And that helps to demotivate this student and to think that,
25:51 that is why I said, school is the role of school.
25:54 Teaching is also pedagogy, it is also a skill.
25:57 Precisely, the mindfulness is very, very important.
26:00 We have reached the end of this first part.
26:02 What we can learn from this mindfulness is that we are looking for an inner peace
26:07 to be fulfilled, but not only.
26:10 Also, we must give a smile to all those around us.
26:14 See you later.
26:16 [Music]
26:33 Welcome to the last part of this show.
26:36 I am still with my guests, Alpha, Moussamba and Moustapha.
26:40 We are going to talk about a hot topic, I will tell you like that,
26:44 how does age impact our life decisions?
26:48 I'll start with you, Moustapha.
26:51 You are very young, I'm not going to ask you your age.
26:54 Do you think about it?
26:57 Do you think about age?
26:59 When you move forward, do you say, "I have to make some decisions"?
27:02 Absolutely.
27:03 So that's very important because age matters a lot.
27:06 Even though there are things that we have to do at a certain age
27:10 and things that we can no longer do when we are at a certain age,
27:13 but when we are entrepreneurs, for example, I take my case,
27:16 it's good to take into account your age.
27:18 Because there are a lot of things, if you want to succeed early,
27:21 you will have to start very early, maybe at the age of 10, at the age of 15.
27:25 So there are a lot of choices that we make every day that impact.
27:29 It has an impact.
27:30 It depends on the age we have, for example, someone who is 70 years old.
27:34 He can make choices that are not going to be beneficial for him
27:37 because he has exceeded the age to be able to do it.
27:40 Someone who is 20, 25, between 18 and 35 years old.
27:43 There you are in the process of construction.
27:46 As I often tell my students, between 18 and 35 years old,
27:50 that's when you're going to build your future.
27:54 You have to be aware of it.
27:56 You have to be aware of it, make really well-judged, well-dosed decisions
27:59 that will be the result of your future.
28:02 But what do we call good decisions?
28:04 Does it depend on the person?
28:06 Alpha?
28:07 Yes, mainly.
28:08 It's always about being aware,
28:10 that we have to guide our choices.
28:14 As he said, when I'm 70,
28:17 can I still do what I did when I was 18?
28:23 Can we do it now? I don't think so.
28:26 Even if, I have to say, for some, age doesn't exist.
28:30 Age doesn't exist.
28:32 It's a barrier that has been put up to show people
28:36 that they shouldn't dream, that they shouldn't continue to hope.
28:40 Age doesn't exist, what? It's just a number.
28:43 For some.
28:45 In love, for example, you see, it's like we say,
28:48 love has no age.
28:50 You can see someone who is 70 years old
28:53 who marries a 25-year-old girl.
28:56 And him, in his understanding,
29:01 he's not going to be able to do it.
29:03 It's a choice.
29:05 It's a choice of life.
29:07 And I think that someone normally wouldn't have judged that.
29:10 Someone wouldn't have said that it's good, it's normal.
29:13 It's too much, as I just said.
29:15 You say?
29:16 Yes, it's a judgment.
29:18 It's a judgment that...
29:20 It's the reason why, during the first part of this show,
29:23 I was talking about the environment.
29:25 Our environment, sometimes,
29:27 it's good or bad.
29:29 For example, someone, as I said,
29:31 who marries a 25-year-old girl, you're 70 years old.
29:33 If it's love that guided your relationship,
29:36 how can someone get involved?
29:38 That's what I was saying, what we call by "good decision".
29:41 For a person, if you have to go in your direction,
29:43 a person can say to himself,
29:45 "I'm 70 years old, I don't see myself marrying a 25-year-old girl."
29:48 But I want to clarify something.
29:50 We are here in the human sciences too.
29:52 That is, it's not the exact sciences.
29:55 When we talk about love,
29:57 you see a lot of people who defend this idea.
30:00 As I said, "No, it's normal, they love each other."
30:03 Even if, on the other hand, we can say, "No, the girl married him."
30:06 Because the good man has money.
30:07 It's an old man who has money.
30:08 That's why the girl accepted him.
30:09 But, for example, if we look at the political environment,
30:12 you see that it's a factor that people use
30:15 to eliminate others.
30:17 And in most constitutions, there is this factor.
30:20 We say, "We are candidates, we can be candidates from 35 years old."
30:24 But the age limit in some countries is 70 or 75 years.
30:29 These are strategies to exclude certain people.
30:31 These are political strategies,
30:33 sometimes they don't really have a reason to be.
30:36 A young man can be 35 or 40 years old,
30:38 he takes the country, he drives it to the drift.
30:41 I take, for example, the example of this president,
30:43 without citing his name, who is a military man,
30:46 who took a state course,
30:48 who took power at 25 years old.
30:50 He became president at 25 years old.
30:52 But where he took his country,
30:54 I think it really wasn't desirable.
30:57 And even his fate now,
30:59 well, maybe I don't want to judge.
31:02 Masamba will react.
31:04 Since we started this show, he hasn't spoken yet.
31:07 Masamba, we're talking about age.
31:10 Should we make decisions early, when we're young?
31:14 As he said earlier, 15 years, 16 years, 18 years, 20 years.
31:18 Maybe when we reach 30 years,
31:20 35, 40 years, it will be too late.
31:22 Absolutely.
31:23 That's why we're talking about childhood,
31:26 youth and old age.
31:28 There is what we call biological logic.
31:31 That is, the human being,
31:33 its functioning, the biology of the human being,
31:35 of the child is totally different
31:37 from the biology of the adult,
31:39 or even of the old, of the elderly.
31:43 So, there are these decisions,
31:47 we have to make them when we're young,
31:50 when we're hot-blooded, when we're hyperactive.
31:53 That is, it is in youth that the future,
31:56 as Coach Prophet Musafa said,
31:59 it is in childhood, where you are good,
32:03 that you build your future.
32:05 Reaching that level will not be impossible,
32:08 but very difficult.
32:10 But it's not just in that sense.
32:12 I agree with you, but there is also another meaning.
32:15 When you get older, you become even more mature,
32:18 wiser, and you can make good decisions.
32:21 Yes, of course.
32:22 That's very clear.
32:23 Sometimes we can make the most important decisions
32:26 in our lives at the age of 60, at the age of 70.
32:29 As I said earlier, I liked it.
32:31 There are areas where age is just an illusion.
32:34 In love, age is just an illusion.
32:36 When you are 70, you can marry a 25-year-old woman.
32:39 And in entrepreneurship, for example,
32:41 I tell those I train,
32:43 that is, age does not matter.
32:45 As long as you live and are in good health,
32:47 you can achieve, change the world.
32:49 There is a structure, which I will not name,
32:51 that everyone knows at the international level.
32:53 The owner founded it at the age of 70.
32:56 I know who it is, but we will not say his name.
32:58 Absolutely, we will not say his name.
33:00 So I can tell you that sometimes it is never too late.
33:02 Maybe he could say to himself, "No, I've worked all my life.
33:05 I will not wait to be 70 to start a business."
33:08 So for him, age was not a barrier.
33:10 And as he said earlier,
33:12 some people say, "No, it's too late.
33:14 I can't be a good person anymore.
33:16 It's over for me."
33:18 While in reality, we can always go back.
33:21 We can always find ourselves.
33:23 In entrepreneurship, you are right.
33:26 But there is also a physiological aspect.
33:28 For women, things change.
33:30 When you marry a 70-year-old woman,
33:32 who is 25 years old, it's not a problem.
33:34 Wait, there are some.
33:36 There have been many cases like that.
33:38 People who have married,
33:40 I will give you a case that everyone knows.
33:42 Yes, yes, we can allow you to speak.
33:44 No one can deny me.
33:46 The case of the Prophet Mohammed,
33:48 it is about him.
33:50 He married his wife,
33:52 who was older than him.
33:54 This is an example to show
33:56 that it is not a fatal element.
33:58 It's not fatal.
34:00 No, it's not fatal.
34:02 That's why I said it.
34:04 But there is a gap.
34:06 If a young person wants to have children,
34:08 he will not have children.
34:10 No?
34:12 You are very young,
34:14 and you want to marry a woman
34:16 older than you.
34:18 The gap, for example,
34:20 of 40 years,
34:22 this woman will not give you children.
34:24 It means that a joint decision is needed
34:26 if the young man decides
34:28 not to have children.
34:30 Fortunately, you are talking about wanting.
34:32 Just as there are people who do not want to have children.
34:34 Take the case of the one who runs France now.
34:36 In my knowledge,
34:38 he does not have children.
34:40 Is it the children who interested him
34:42 when he married?
34:44 He said to himself,
34:46 "This woman can lead me to get what I want."
34:48 That's why I said
34:50 that life is quite complicated,
34:52 human beings,
34:54 we are different,
34:56 and everyone has his own way of seeing the world.
34:58 In some countries,
35:00 a young man who lives with an older woman
35:02 is seen as a bad person.
35:04 We must talk about the sociological aspect.
35:06 This is the most important aspect.
35:08 In our families,
35:10 we make you understand that when you get to have
35:12 a child,
35:14 at least in my family,
35:16 I say it openly,
35:18 maybe it starts to change.
35:20 Yes, there are changes because
35:22 modernity has settled in,
35:24 and has begun to sweep away the old.
35:26 But, for example, young girls
35:28 make you understand that
35:30 when you are in puberty,
35:32 you are ready.
35:34 You are ready.
35:36 Men also.
35:38 When you are 22, 23, 24,
35:40 you need a woman.
35:42 There is an age.
35:44 Whether it is in books
35:46 or in religion,
35:48 there is no age.
35:50 We don't say to Muslims,
35:52 "At 25, you must get married."
35:54 It doesn't exist.
35:56 I don't know about Christians,
35:58 but it's not the case with Muslims.
36:00 Christians don't forbid
36:02 young people,
36:04 younger people,
36:06 to marry older women.
36:08 I'm talking about age.
36:10 Is there a fixation?
36:12 For example, "At 25, you must get married."
36:14 Is it written somewhere?
36:16 On a professional level,
36:18 we will talk about another aspect.
36:20 On a professional level,
36:22 there are some employers
36:24 who say that they prefer
36:26 to employ young people.
36:28 They are very intelligent.
36:30 We won't say that those who are
36:32 older are not intelligent,
36:34 but they come with good ideas,
36:36 fresh ideas.
36:38 They prefer to hire young people.
36:40 How do you think
36:42 about this way of doing it?
36:44 As I usually say,
36:46 no one has any legitimacy
36:48 about what is in the individual's conscience.
36:50 It is a personal choice.
36:52 You decide,
36:54 you have your own company,
36:56 you decide whether to hire
36:58 young people or old people.
37:00 But one thing is certain,
37:02 youth is a biological issue
37:04 and it is more active.
37:06 But also,
37:08 old age has positive aspects.
37:10 As you just said,
37:12 it is experience.
37:14 Experience makes the difference.
37:16 It's all a matter of choice.
37:18 In Africa,
37:20 old marmots also prepare
37:22 the right sauces.
37:24 Yes, yes, go on Alpha.
37:26 I don't want to be vulgar,
37:28 but I am well educated for that.
37:30 But there are people
37:32 who are called old marmots.
37:34 Yes, yes, they are old,
37:36 they are old,
37:38 but if you look at their attitudes,
37:40 their behaviour,
37:42 you ask yourself,
37:44 but not long ago,
37:46 I saw a video on Facebook,
37:48 very sincerely,
37:50 maybe I will try to show it to you later,
37:52 a woman who came for an interview
37:54 and asked an old man a question.
37:56 You saw it.
37:58 It was viral, yes.
38:00 A man allows himself to say things to a woman.
38:02 He is old, he is old.
38:04 Yes, it's like he said earlier,
38:06 I don't know if it's Alpha,
38:08 that age is a number,
38:10 it's just an illusion.
38:12 There are young people who are mature.
38:14 He is 20 years old,
38:16 but when he expresses himself,
38:18 you feel like he is 40 years old.
38:20 There are also adults,
38:22 for example, he is 40, 45 years old,
38:24 but you ask yourself questions,
38:26 why does he express himself like that
38:28 when you expect a mature person?
38:30 As you said,
38:32 age is a barrier.
38:34 Here in Africa, we don't understand that.
38:36 In politics, to be president,
38:38 you have to be 35 years old.
38:40 I think it's someone who got up one day
38:42 and thought it was normal,
38:44 who voted for it in the assembly.
38:46 Maybe it's an experience,
38:48 we've lived a lot of things.
38:50 We can't give a power,
38:52 I say to myself like that,
38:54 you may contradict me,
38:56 the management of a country
38:58 to a 20-year-old.
39:00 How many times have you seen
39:02 people who are 35,
39:04 40, 50 years old,
39:06 be president and destroy their country?
39:08 There are a lot, we've seen it.
39:10 I specify to Semi,
39:12 there were young princes
39:14 who were 15, 16, 17, 18 years old.
39:16 They are responsible.
39:18 They know how to...
39:20 For example, the young prince of Morocco,
39:22 I saw this video.
39:24 It's extraordinary.
39:26 Everything also goes with education.
39:28 The education we give to children.
39:30 Do you see yourself as a young man
39:32 of 20 years old
39:34 in Africa,
39:36 governed?
39:38 Or let's say, presided?
39:40 It's a very difficult question.
39:42 Because there too,
39:44 there is another aspect,
39:46 I think, that has also been resolved
39:48 in the Muslim religion.
39:50 That is, if age
39:52 is not taken into account
39:54 in certain
39:56 considerations
39:58 of life
40:00 among Muslims,
40:02 there is also an aspect
40:04 where age comes back.
40:06 For example, ageism.
40:08 Among us, for example, Muslims,
40:10 from the age of 40,
40:12 I think it is from the age of 40
40:14 that he became the messenger
40:16 he was.
40:18 There is also this question.
40:20 For certain responsibilities,
40:22 I completely agree that we cannot put a young man...
40:24 - It takes experience.
40:26 Education, experience.
40:28 We assume that this person is responsible.
40:30 - We assume
40:32 that at this age he can be responsible.
40:34 As I said,
40:36 there was a president at 25 years old,
40:38 I don't mention his name,
40:40 but I say that he was 25 years old.
40:42 I am no longer 25 years old.
40:44 But the way he governed
40:46 was extraordinary.
40:48 We are in Africa, we do what we want,
40:50 we have women, we have money,
40:52 we have power, we have everything we want.
40:54 We do as we want.
40:56 - So, Masamba,
40:58 we are still talking about age.
41:00 - I would like to clarify,
41:02 if I may, that Kabdul A'iwad,
41:04 the former president of Senegal,
41:06 had mentioned it.
41:08 He said that if he had been president
41:10 at 75 years old,
41:12 he could have made achievements
41:14 that the Senegalese would have been proud of.
41:16 - But it depends.
41:18 When A'iwad says "a little younger",
41:20 he doesn't mean 18 or 20 years old.
41:22 - No, not that.
41:24 I mean, this age,
41:26 Mandela, Nelson Mandela,
41:28 who came to power at the age of...
41:30 He understood that he couldn't do everything
41:32 he wanted to do at the age of 4,
41:34 he retired.
41:36 But we know that Mandela,
41:38 from every point of view,
41:40 I'm not saying he's irreproachable,
41:42 but he's a great man.
41:44 - He was a leader,
41:46 he left a great history in Africa
41:48 and even in the world.
41:50 Masamba, I would like you to react
41:52 to the professional world.
41:54 The choices we make,
41:56 does age also impact our decisions?
41:58 When we are young,
42:00 we can have fun changing jobs.
42:02 We are in a company,
42:04 we realize that we are getting older,
42:06 we are 45, 50 years old,
42:08 can we still do it,
42:10 keeping this habit of changing companies?
42:12 - Indeed,
42:14 everything depends on the person,
42:16 what we aspire to be,
42:18 become or have.
42:20 But,
42:22 obviously, age will impact,
42:24 must systematically impact our choices.
42:26 Because there is,
42:28 as I said earlier,
42:30 biological age.
42:32 For young people,
42:34 the advantage they have
42:36 to make certain decisions
42:38 that will guide their lives,
42:40 the old man has already lived.
42:42 So, obviously,
42:44 it systematically impacts our choices.
42:46 And if we can now exploit
42:48 the opportunity we have
42:50 compared to our age,
42:52 we will be able to achieve
42:54 our goals and reach a certain level.
42:56 - But changing companies,
42:58 shouldn't we also take into account
43:00 that we are 20, 25, 30 years old,
43:02 we can say it is acceptable.
43:04 But when we reach 45, 50 years old,
43:06 will we continue to do it?
43:08 - It all depends on what pushes you
43:10 to change companies.
43:12 I cannot be the devil's advocate,
43:14 someone who wants to change,
43:16 I don't know why.
43:18 - But retirement also happens.
43:20 - But I agree with you
43:22 that age can play a role there.
43:24 But maybe the person is right,
43:26 because we don't know why they want to change.
43:28 But if you are young,
43:30 you are in the place where you are,
43:32 you learn, it is not important to change.
43:34 So there are many factors that come into play
43:36 to be able to judge the choice.
43:38 - It's your opinion,
43:40 but should we rather think
43:42 about entrepreneurs?
43:44 An entrepreneur, let's say an employee
43:46 who is in a company
43:48 and he knows that he is 45, 50 years old,
43:50 let's say even 65 years old,
43:52 he decides to stop because he has a goal,
43:54 he wants to create his company.
43:56 Is it still positive?
43:58 - Of course.
44:00 - But someone who has no project
44:02 and he says to himself,
44:04 he allows himself to change companies.
44:06 Oubia, do you want to react?
44:08 - Yes, of course.
44:10 What you say is what I was going to say earlier.
44:12 For me, it would be a failure
44:14 to work until the age of retirement
44:16 to help someone realize their own dreams.
44:18 We have dreams, we have projects in mind,
44:20 we have things we want to do,
44:22 we want to participate in the evolution of society.
44:24 It's not good for someone to work
44:26 from 20 years old or 18 years old
44:28 to 60 years old for someone.
44:30 At some point, as you said,
44:32 you have to retire because you are getting old.
44:34 And today, here in Africa, for example,
44:36 we know how the salaried workers are.
44:38 It's a bit difficult.
44:40 Before the end of the month, you have already finished your salary.
44:42 The reason why at some point,
44:44 you have to pick up the crampons,
44:46 try to do something
44:48 where you find something that belongs to you
44:50 and you will help other people
44:52 realize their own dreams.
44:54 But it would be really not desirable
44:56 to see someone working all his life
44:58 for someone.
45:00 Always waiting for the salary.
45:02 We never know a billionaire who is a salaried worker.
45:04 Most of the people today who own the economy
45:06 of this world are entrepreneurs.
45:08 So it doesn't mean that everyone
45:10 has to start, but rather, at some point,
45:12 you have to know how to retire a little,
45:14 put your own thing.
45:16 Because when you are in a company,
45:18 you learn how to function,
45:20 how to master it,
45:22 so that maybe later on, you can launch something similar.
45:24 But everyone is not an entrepreneur.
45:26 We agree.
45:28 It is true that we encourage Africans to start,
45:30 but as you say,
45:32 everyone is not an entrepreneur.
45:34 I would like you to react
45:36 for a person
45:38 who has no idea
45:40 of starting
45:42 and this person
45:44 has no entrepreneurial project.
45:46 Can this person
45:48 change companies
45:50 knowing that retirement is soon?
45:52 You have raised an important point.
45:54 It is the aspect
45:56 of planning
45:58 and the aspect of
46:00 how can I say it?
46:02 It is planning.
46:04 You have to have a professional framework.
46:06 Many of us don't have that.
46:08 We are in a company,
46:10 we get up, we earn
46:12 our salary at the end of the month.
46:14 We think it will last.
46:16 We saw companies
46:18 that closed like that
46:20 and the employees were there
46:22 with their eyes open.
46:24 You have to have a career plan.
46:26 Whether you are an entrepreneur
46:28 or not.
46:30 I have a career plan.
46:32 I am a journalist,
46:34 but I don't want to be a journalist
46:36 until I am 50 or 60.
46:38 Can you share your career plan?
46:40 It's a secret.
46:42 You can keep it.
46:44 We will see.
46:46 I am not generous.
46:48 I will keep it for myself.
46:50 Another aspect
46:52 is the divine aspect.
46:54 There is God.
46:56 We can also make our plan
46:58 as we say, God proposes, God disposes.
47:00 We can also have a career plan.
47:02 At 30, I will be here.
47:04 At 35, I will be there.
47:06 Everything is a question of acceptance.
47:08 Will the Lord
47:10 even keep us until this period?
47:12 Maybe we will disappear.
47:14 We can still have a career plan.
47:16 Yes, I often hear that.
47:18 For example, when someone dies,
47:20 I often hear from friends
47:22 that he left
47:24 but he had so many projects.
47:26 He wanted to travel,
47:28 he wanted to do this, he wanted to do that.
47:30 Do you remember a friend who died
47:32 and worked for the organization?
47:34 I don't know the name of the organization.
47:36 He was a very intelligent journalist.
47:38 I saw him as a president of Mali.
47:40 It really shocked us.
47:42 He left us.
47:44 It was not easy.
47:46 At least, what we can learn from these people
47:48 is that they showed us
47:50 that we should dream.
47:52 God left us to continue
47:54 the work they started.
47:56 He left us. We talk about what they did
47:58 but we also say that he had projects.
48:00 He left. He left his projects.
48:02 And we who live,
48:04 should we have projects?
48:06 Should we dream or should we just stay
48:08 and wait for our turn to come
48:10 to leave?
48:12 This is the great mystery of death
48:14 which is not the subject of the day
48:16 but which, in my opinion,
48:18 is sometimes a subject
48:20 that we read at an early age.
48:22 I am young, I live,
48:24 I am old, death is coming.
48:26 That's why I said
48:28 that this is the great mystery.
48:30 Age is the great mystery of life, just like death.
48:32 Yes, precisely. It is not the subject
48:34 but I think you are not out of the subject
48:36 because when we get old, we are afraid
48:38 and we say to ourselves that we will die soon.
48:40 This is not our case, God is watching over us.
48:42 Moustapha,
48:44 do you see things
48:46 in the same way as Alpha?
48:48 When we get old, we are a little scared.
48:50 We have our projects,
48:52 we may not realize them
48:54 but I think we should always dream.
48:56 Indeed. And here, what we should do
48:58 is to prove our faith.
49:00 In fact, we should have faith.
49:02 It is not for nothing that the basis of all religions
49:04 is faith.
49:06 We are told sincerely
49:08 that we should have faith, believe in something
49:10 despite the absence of any proof.
49:12 You set your goals,
49:14 in your head, imagination
49:16 is the main spring of all human activity.
49:18 It is the main source of man.
49:20 If we destroy this faculty,
49:22 man's condition will mobilize
49:24 at the level of the beast.
49:26 God gave us an imagination
49:28 to aspire
49:30 to become something.
49:32 This aspiration guides us
49:34 and pushes us to realize our goals.
49:36 We should always dream
49:38 while keeping faith
49:40 that it will happen.
49:42 But after all,
49:44 as you said, man proposes,
49:46 God disposes.
49:48 We should not go to death.
49:50 It is the spring of God.
49:52 I have to do what burns in my heart
49:54 and I let God decide what is best.
49:56 I don't know.
49:58 Moustapha, you also have a reaction
50:00 to what we are saying.
50:02 Are you afraid of death?
50:04 You say, "Yalabana" in French.
50:06 Help me a little.
50:08 God is great.
50:10 I share your opinion.
50:12 We can have projects,
50:14 we can plan everything,
50:16 but we don't even know
50:18 if we will get out of here.
50:20 Let's hope it will not happen.
50:22 We do programming,
50:24 we do planning,
50:26 we do our calculations.
50:28 Everything is fair in our calculations.
50:30 But sometimes God intervenes.
50:32 Even in your own work,
50:34 sometimes you plan everything.
50:36 We really have believers on this set.
50:38 I like it.
50:40 Yes, that's it.
50:42 Divinity and faith are everything.
50:44 Someone who does not have faith,
50:46 well, it's them who will ...
50:48 that is, people who destroy the country
50:50 politically, etc.
50:52 If you see,
50:54 they are not good people.
50:56 I would like you to encourage
50:58 a young African
51:00 who is struggling to start
51:02 who says, "I am in a company,
51:04 I am good, I have my salary,
51:06 I don't think about starting
51:08 even if I have an innovative idea. "
51:10 Exactly.
51:12 So for that, it is to remind him
51:14 that maybe for him, he is in security.
51:16 Most of the employees,
51:18 they are well settled, they have a good salary,
51:20 it is security.
51:22 Every month, money comes in.
51:24 During the COVID, there is ...
51:26 Alpha.
51:28 How many people have lost their jobs
51:30 because of COVID?
51:32 Many companies have closed
51:34 and these people who work there,
51:36 will they have the chance to be recruited elsewhere?
51:38 And yet they have loads,
51:40 they have to eat,
51:42 Dad is here, Mom is here,
51:44 they have a wife.
51:46 So to tell you that salary is not security,
51:48 even entrepreneurship is not security.
51:50 But entrepreneurship, I think,
51:52 is not about receiving wages,
51:54 but learning how the structure works.
51:56 We should not be salaried
51:58 and it is limited only to what we do,
52:00 writing or teaching something like that.
52:02 But let's try to understand the mechanisms,
52:04 how the company works,
52:06 so that in the end, at 40 or 35 years old,
52:08 we launch a similar company,
52:10 or even one that innovates.
52:12 And that's what will allow you to be free,
52:14 to be financially independent,
52:16 to travel, to do whatever you want.
52:18 Because when you are salaried,
52:20 it is complicated.
52:22 We have reached the end of this last part of the show.
52:24 And I will give you the opportunity
52:26 to wish the best wishes
52:28 to all these people
52:30 who have been following us for a long time.
52:32 And we arrived in 2024.
52:34 We could not do it last time,
52:36 but you will do it now.
52:38 I will start with you, Massamba.
52:40 You can wish the best wishes
52:42 to all these people who are watching you
52:44 and also your family in a few seconds.
52:46 My best wishes to all of you
52:48 in this antenna.
52:50 To you too, and especially to my family
52:52 and my dear mother.
52:54 Very good. Mustafa?
52:56 My best wishes to everyone,
52:58 to you, to this community that is watching us,
53:00 as well as to all the media staff on TV.
53:02 It is a pleasure.
53:04 To my family as well, my father, my mother,
53:06 who are everything to me.
53:08 So my best wishes to everyone.
53:10 Good health, prosperity, success in everything.
53:12 Thank you very much. Alpha?
53:14 Yes, I will of course be open like the others.
53:16 Best wishes to everyone watching us.
53:18 We can start with that.
53:20 Give thanks to God, the Almighty,
53:22 who has left us life.
53:24 And for 2023,
53:26 we wish that he will leave us
53:28 still alive in 2024.
53:30 And for the years to come,
53:32 a hundred years.
53:34 We hope so.
53:36 And thank you for the invitation.
53:38 I wish 2024 to be a radiant year
53:40 for everyone and a year of success.
53:42 Thank you very much.
53:44 You forgot all those people who follow you on social media.
53:46 So it doesn't matter.
53:48 You understood, it's the end of this show.
53:50 Génération News.
53:52 See you very soon and be well.
53:54 Portez-vous bien.
53:56 [Music]