00:00At the United Nations General Assembly, Poland delivered Moscow a blunt warning, quote,
00:04We will do whatever it takes to protect our citizens.
00:08Earlier this month, Russian aircraft violated Poland's airspace, of course it's a NATO member,
00:13as well as that of Romania and Estonia, all within the space of 10 days.
00:19As many as 21 Russian drones entered Polish airspace.
00:23Two weeks ago, Romania scrambled its fighter jets just a few days later,
00:27after a Russian drone breached its airspace during an attack on neighboring Ukraine.
00:33And last Friday, Estonia saw three Russian fighter jets violate its airspace for some 12 minutes.
00:41A short time ago, Polish Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Radislav Sikorsky
00:46told me that Russia was waging a hybrid war on multiple fronts.
00:52The temperature, I think we can reliably say over here right now, is quite hot,
00:57given concern, your concern and the concern of other NATO allies, about Russian air incursions.
01:04You have said, others have said, that if Russia violates airspace again,
01:09you might very well shoot down their jets.
01:11Would Poland shoot down Russian jets if they violate Polish airspace once more?
01:15First of all, note that it's all one way.
01:18You haven't heard about Polish or the NATO aircraft or drones violating Russia's airspace.
01:24So it's clearly Russia conducting its hybrid war, which contains other forms of assault,
01:35arsons, flammable parcels, assassinations, DDoS attacks, and so on.
01:41And we think that they sent 21 drones into Poland deliberately, and we have proof for that.
01:49And that, of course, is a breach of our sovereignty.
01:53Of course, we appreciate allies, but in the end,
01:56we will do whatever it takes to protect our citizens and their property.
01:59And there are procedures for that.
02:01You know, our air forces are in touch.
02:04But if pilots don't obey the commands of ground control,
02:10if they are intercepted and they don't obey commands,
02:15well, I'm afraid we will do what it takes to protect our citizens.
02:19Okay.
02:19And that includes shooting at both unmanned and perhaps manned aircraft?
02:24Well, we know what would happen if Cuban MiGs would fly over Florida, don't we?
02:29Understood.
02:30Do you feel that Russia understands this message from Europe right now?
02:35Because Russia, as you know, has a history of testing the limits
02:39and pushing when it doesn't meet resistance.
02:43Do you think NATO right now is showing sufficient resistance?
02:46Well, it just learned that it has reached the limit.
02:51President Trump said yesterday when he was asked
02:54if a NATO nation were to fire on a Russian aircraft, would he support it?
02:58And he said, yes.
02:59Do you believe that Poland has the American president's full support in this?
03:04We were very satisfied with the response of our allies.
03:08We invoked Article 4 at Brussels.
03:12Article 5, as you know, has only been invoked once
03:15in defense of the United States after events in this city.
03:20And several allies have rallied around with deeds
03:24and actual assets, anti-aircraft assets and fighter jets.
03:29And I hope Russia sees that there would be a unified NATO response.
03:35President Trump described the war in Ukraine in quite different terms
03:38in his social media posting yesterday,
03:41saying that he now believes Ukraine can win
03:43all the territory Russia has captured back.
03:48Significant change in your view?
03:50Well, that would be, legally speaking,
03:53the easiest way of ending the war.
03:55Ukraine just reclaiming its internationally recognized border.
03:59And also, it's the border recognized by Russia
04:02in their bilateral treaty.
04:05And President Trump is famous for backing the winner.
04:09And I hope he sees from his intelligence briefings
04:12that Ukraine, having won the war at sea,
04:16is actually now being very effective
04:19at hitting at Russian oil refineries.
04:25Ukraine has developed its own long-range drones,
04:28its own ballistic missiles,
04:30and the Russian capacity to wage this war is declining.
04:35There was a phrase, though, in his posting that stood out.
04:38And he said that Ukraine can win
04:40with the help of the European Union.
04:42He did not say with the help of the European Union
04:44and the United States, was that significant to you?
04:47Do you think he was signaling this is Europe's war?
04:51I think President Trump is not giving himself justice
04:54for what he's doing.
04:55Ukraine, the United States,
04:57is still providing intelligence, information,
05:00Starlink's 25,000 terminals paid for by Poland
05:04and effectors for Patriot missiles
05:07that defend Ukrainian cities and attack arms and others.
05:10But it's true that Europe,
05:13which is often accused in this country of being a freeloader,
05:16actually has delivered most of the financial assistance to Ukraine
05:22and actually now delivers most of the military assistance as well,
05:27including in purchases from the United States.
05:30And we need to provide Ukraine for the medium term.
05:34Ukraine is planning for two to three years.
05:36And if Putin concludes that he cannot win this war,
05:42it's then that he will make peace.
05:44Do you believe that President Putin's view of the war might be changing?
05:49If President Trump's assessment has changed,
05:51based on whatever he's hearing from,
05:53including the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelensky,
05:57do you have any indication that Putin no longer believes he's winning?
06:01Because that's what I've been hearing from European leaders for some time.
06:04Well, Vladimir Putin invaded on hyper-optimistic assumptions.
06:09Remember that there would be a coup in Kiev,
06:11that these are just misguided Russians who will welcome his invasion,
06:16that it will be a three-day special military operation.
06:20Actually, he's been trying to conquer Donbass for 10 years now.
06:25Not exactly the definition of victory.
06:27So after 20 years in autocratic power,
06:31you know, you only have yes-men around you.
06:33And, of course, they tell you what you want to hear.
06:35So he might actually not have the precise picture of what's going on.
06:40But I think the difficulties in his economy are real,
06:44and he's having to notice that.
06:47As you know, the U.S. is conducting a review
06:50of its forced deployments around the world, including in Europe.
06:53Are you concerned that the U.S. will reduce its military presence in Europe?
06:58Well, the U.S. has a very good deal in Poland.
07:00You have a Stasis of Forces Agreement
07:02by which we contribute $15,000 per annum to every U.S. soldier in Poland.
07:08So it's actually cheaper for you to keep them in Poland
07:11than to exercise them in Poland.
07:13And our president was in the White House two weeks ago,
07:15and President Trump told him they're staying,
07:18and if you want more, we might consider that.
07:21And I've also already spoken about this to the Department of War,
07:27and they're confirming it.
07:29That's for Poland. How about for NATO?
07:31Well, troops should be where the threat is,
07:34and the threat is on the eastern flank.
07:37When you look at the Baltic states,
07:39do you believe that they are getting the defense and support they need
07:44to head off the Russian threat?
07:45Because, as you know, when you speak to Baltic leaders,
07:47they feel that they are particularly vulnerable to Russian military action.
07:51And they are.
07:52You know, remember, Russia deported 10% of their population
07:57into the Gulag in the 1940s,
07:59invaded them many times in the past.
08:01So they have every reason to fear a much more powerful neighbor.
08:05But we are doing air policing over the Baltic states,
08:09and Germany is building up a tank brigade in Lithuania.
08:14So I think Russia would be very foolish to attack NATO.
08:18As you know, President Trump repeated during the UNGA
08:21that he wants to see Europe stop buying all Russian oil
08:25before he imposes additional sanctions on Russia.
08:29I spoke to the Hungarian foreign minister earlier.
08:32Good.
08:32And I asked him this question, and he said, we can't.
08:36He said, we're dependent on Russian oil.
08:37That's just not true.
08:39The oil can be brought by a pipeline via Croatia from the Adriatic Sea.
08:45And Hungary had better do it,
08:46because actually the Ukrainian army is bombing the Russian pipeline,
08:51including the pumping stations.
08:52And the commander of the unit, which is doing it rather successfully,
08:56is actually an ethnic Hungarian officer in the Ukrainian army.
09:00So do you believe this can change?
09:03Because to date, that reality hasn't changed.
09:05And as you know, Hungary has actually increased its imports of Russian oil in recent years.
09:09Despite urgent pleas from the rest of the EU.
09:13But the prime minister of Hungary is a declared member of the MAGA movement.
09:17So we are hoping President Trump brings this matter to his attention effectively.
09:23But before we go, one of the messages from Trump's address to the UNGA
09:29seemed to be demanding that Europe and the world follow his domestic policies,
09:36one of which is stopping immigration,
09:40the other of which is abandoning any green technologies or any environmental effort.
09:46Well, in this sense, Europe is different from the United States.
09:49You know, you are a huge country.
09:51In some European countries, we already have economies running on renewables only.
09:58For example, Norway on hydro and Denmark on wind power.
10:02We just don't have the space to do this kind of large-scale oil and gas pumping
10:08that you can do in the United States.
10:10And on migration, for example, Poland has built a big and beautiful fence,
10:16440 kilometers on our border with Belarus,
10:20where they were pushing migrants across our border.
10:23It's 98% effective.
10:26And we believe that for the freedom of movement inside Europe to be functional,
10:32the perimeter has to be protected.
10:35In that sense, we agree with President Trump and we've already done it.
10:38We're going to be doing it.
10:39We're going to be doing it.
10:39We're going to be doing it.
10:39We're going to be doing it.
10:40We're going to be doing it.
10:41We're going to be doing it.
10:41We're going to be doing it.
10:42We're going to be doing it.
10:42We're going to be doing it.
10:43We're going to be doing it.
10:43We're going to be doing it.
10:44We're going to be doing it.
10:45We're going to be doing it.
10:46We're going to be doing it.
10:47We're going to be doing it.
10:48We're going to be doing it.
10:48We're going to be doing it.
10:49We're going to be doing it.
10:50We're going to be doing it.
10:51We're going to be doing it.
10:52We're going to be doing it.
10:53We're going to be doing it.
