- 5 weeks ago
The Washington Nationals have had a tough couple of weeks since August started. Paul Toboni is optimistic that a few changes, especially moving CJ Abrams to second base, could help turn things around. Do you think the Nationals could still make a playoff push?
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00:00is Paul Timoney, President of Baseball Operations for the Nationals.
00:03He jumps on the Rude Guest Hotline.
00:05Rude's the most reliable heating and air-conditioned products in the DMV.
00:08Hey, Paul.
00:09What's going on, guys? How are you guys?
00:11Paul, I might be wrong, but I think you're one of the guys I've seen
00:14out at Commander's Training Camp, and if you're not,
00:18I still want to ask you this question because sometimes you'll see these pictures
00:20of GMs or coaches from one sport checking out another sport.
00:25What does that do for you, or are you just there as a fan?
00:31No, yeah, I was out there.
00:33AP was awesome and invited us out, so Blake and I headed out there,
00:37and it was awesome.
00:39You know, I think it does a couple things.
00:42Like, one, you're able to just pick up on certain things that, you know,
00:47we face in baseball.
00:50You know, things as small as, like, hey, how you work a schedule on a day like that,
00:55which is a crazy day, and there's so many moving pieces in the NFL.
00:58I kind of liken it to spring training.
01:01So, you know, hey, like, why do you structure your practices the way you do,
01:05and, you know, how do you communicate with the players on what you're going to do
01:10that day, so on and so forth, and everything in between.
01:13So, and then I think there's this other piece where just being in D.C.,
01:18I think it's cool to have those relationships, whether it's with AP or Will
01:21or whoever, it's a fun thing.
01:26You know, we talk about it like the cross-pollination of D.C. sports is a cool thing,
01:30and it's part of the reason why, you know, you'll see my kids rocking commanders gear,
01:35wizards gear, so on and so forth.
01:37Did you grow up a 49er fan?
01:39Yeah, big-time 49er fan.
01:40Yeah, yeah.
01:41How long have you known Adam?
01:44You know what, I met him for the first time, I think during COVID.
01:48We were thinking through basically, like, how to run our scouting groups.
01:53I was with the Red Sox, he was with the Niners, and so we hopped on a call then,
01:57but didn't really spend time with him until, you know, I got this job.
02:03Gotcha.
02:03That's cool.
02:04Yeah, he's a good dude.
02:06So, just getting back to what's going on with the Nats right now,
02:10everybody's talking about C.J. and moving to second.
02:14He's obviously a little resistant to it, and he's not making any qualms about that.
02:19He doesn't really feel comfortable with it or doesn't want to do it.
02:22What is sort of your thinking from the organizational perspective?
02:26Yeah, I'm curious as to your guys' thoughts, but, you know, Blake and I,
02:30this has been a series of conversations over the course of the last few weeks,
02:35and what Blake and I talk a lot about is, like, hey,
02:39we always want to do what's best for the organization,
02:45but, you know, and I said it yesterday,
02:47like, we also don't want to be one of these organizations that does it
02:50without, you know, care and empathy for the player.
02:55And, listen, the bottom line is, like, C.J.'s been a shortstop his whole life.
03:00It's a huge part of, you know, his identity as a baseball player.
03:05And so, while, hey, like, we think it makes us a better team right now,
03:10that doesn't mean we just decide to roll with it and shove it down his throat.
03:14We obviously want to have conversations about it over time.
03:17And I'll say it, like, C.J. has been freaking awesome.
03:22Like, when we had those meetings, he's been great.
03:25He's asked great questions.
03:25He's, you know, I think he's understood everything.
03:30But, yeah, like, man, there's a part of this that, hey, when this move is made,
03:37yeah, it upsets you a little bit because it's a huge part of who he is.
03:42Right.
03:42But what I will say is, like, how he's handled, you know, being upset has been great.
03:49Like, he's, like, he's said it to us.
03:51He's like, yeah, man, I'm not thrilled about this.
03:54But at the same time, like, listen, I get it.
03:56It's about the team.
03:57It's about the Nationals.
03:58And so let's go.
03:59So he understands why he's being moved.
04:03I mean, technically, can you explain technically what he's been doing wrong
04:07for the last couple years?
04:09And I don't know how much you want to get into it, Paul,
04:12but it's not all fielding.
04:14It's throwing, too.
04:15The one game when Brady House was playing first, you remember that game.
04:18I can't remember who you guys were playing.
04:20But routine ground ball right up the middle, he was kind of playing towards the bag.
04:25Just an easy throw to Brady House, but he kind of overthrew him.
04:30And what is it technically that he's not doing right?
04:34Yeah, you know, I think, first of all, I'll say, like, he has made strides.
04:40But I think he hit the nail on the head.
04:42Like, a lot of it is throwing.
04:44And CJ's so darn athletic, he gets to balls out the, like, outer edges of his range.
04:51It's just about thinking up his top and bottom half and delivering throws on target.
04:55And so, you know, we think that, you know, playing second base will ease that burden for him.
05:03But at the same time, a piece of this is, like, you know, you guys have seen us play the
05:08infield.
05:09Being able to, and you saw it last night, like, being able to play him at shortstop.
05:14And, you know, with CJ at time, let's say in the next, whenever it ends up being the next week,
05:23the combination of those two guys, those two positions, I think will lead us to a better position than how
05:28we're currently constructed.
05:30So, Paul, is it too harsh and or premature for me to say, like I did earlier on today's show,
05:35that this move could be the opening salvo of divorce proceedings between CJ Abrams and the Nationals?
05:43He's not going to say that.
05:44It's just way too early for that.
05:47Yeah, no, I mean, I, first of all, like, I get your guys' jobs and I get how that could
05:53be received that way.
05:54But I think if you guys were in the meetings with, you know, CJ and Blake and I, I think
06:00you'd realize, like, the vibe is way different.
06:02And, you know, like, if you read Twitter or read articles and people are, you know, throwing opinions out there,
06:12like I said, like, I could get how that narrative could get out there.
06:16But it's not close to the vibe that is actually taking place.
06:20Yeah, I think what you said previously, though, is important because that message doesn't necessarily get out,
06:26like, from your perspective and, you know, when you guys sit down in the meetings and that he gets it.
06:30Like, it's not something he loves, not something he's excited about, per se,
06:34but he does understand it and he is about the team first.
06:37Like, that, you know, he gets it.
06:40It's a great vibe.
06:41I feel like that message doesn't get out there enough.
06:43Why is that?
06:45Sorry, the message of what?
06:46Well, just that CJ's, like, he understands and he's a team guy.
06:51And it's not something he dreams about, you know, necessarily being a second baseman or another position.
06:56I mean, it's an ego hit.
06:56You know what I mean?
06:57At the very least.
06:58But what you said, that he gets it, he understands it, and he's been great.
07:03Why?
07:04That perception is not necessarily out there.
07:06Right?
07:07The perception is, from my perspective, is that he's pissed.
07:10He's pissed.
07:11Yeah.
07:12Yeah.
07:13No, no, I totally hear that.
07:14And I think it's part of my job to communicate that to everyone because, listen, if CJ comes out there
07:22and says it himself,
07:23he probably looks like an idiot.
07:25You know what I mean?
07:25Yeah.
07:27Yeah.
07:27I, you know, I was similar to Blake.
07:30Like, we want people feeling that as his teammates have felt it because if we don't do it, then you
07:37start to ask, like, who's going to do it?
07:38And, you know, if CJ does it or if his agent does it, it just, I don't think it hits
07:43the same because it probably comes off, like, you know, disingenuous.
07:47And maybe it does when I do it.
07:48I don't know.
07:48But, yeah, I just, yeah, I want folks to feel that because, you know, like most of these conversations, or
07:58all these conversations, you know, the fan base isn't in the room.
08:02It isn't in the place office, right?
08:03So, it's honestly, it's, these conversations, I think, happen a lot more than people realize, right?
08:09Whether it's, like, a starter getting relief work or someone changing positions or someone being moved in the batting order,
08:15whatever it is, right?
08:17This one's just a little bit different in that it's CJ and, you know, it's a move that, you know,
08:23he's doing not for the first time in his career, but for the first time in a while.
08:26So, I think that's the other piece is, like, these conversations happen quite a bit and it's part of our
08:34jobs.
08:35So, we just try to do it in a way where we're communicating as well as possible and then going
08:41from there.
08:42Paul, what kind of a defensive player is Seaver King?
08:47Yeah, he has been, Seaver's been awesome lately.
08:51You know, he's probably got still a tick under 50 games at AAA, but it was a little rocky in
08:58AA and then he was making strides.
09:01And then when he got to AAA, he's really been great.
09:06And he's a great athlete.
09:10Getting back to his days at Wake, like, he just flies around the field in all facets.
09:15But now he's looking at, like, this, you see the makings of a really polished defender that, yeah, he's been
09:23really good.
09:24And I think he'll be able to play short.
09:27I think he'll be able to play second.
09:28I think he'll be able to play third.
09:30Shoot, he could be a great center fielder as well.
09:32Okay.
09:33He's a fun athlete to have around.
09:34As you know, the fans are desperate to see him.
09:37Can you say today on the show, let's make some news,
09:40that there's going to be a September call-up where we're at least going to get a little look-see,
09:43give him a little taste?
09:47I can't today on the show.
09:50It's obviously, you know, it's not to say it won't happen.
09:52But like I just said, like, he still only has 40-something games in AAA.
09:57Yeah.
09:58And so we just, we want to make sure to kind of thread the needle, which no one does it
10:02perfectly.
10:03But of a...
10:04Yeah, how do you know when they're ready?
10:06I know, that's like the age-old question.
10:08And I think it's all unique to the individual.
10:14And you kind of just look at the season, their game, and how you think it's going to transfer to
10:21the big leagues.
10:23And then just try and predict, like, all right, this is how it's going to go.
10:28And we're not always great at it, but we try and do our best to make sure that guys are
10:33ready so they don't come up, it goes really bad, and then they've got to go back down and go
10:38through that deal, which honestly, like, the large majority of young prospects go through anyway because they're getting so hard
10:44at the big league level these days.
10:46We just, we want to do everything in our power to make sure these guys are prepared.
10:50Joined by the president of baseball operations for the Washington Nationals, Paul Taboney.
10:54So we've gotten to see Jackson Kent pitch a couple of times.
10:57It seems like he's struggled to find the zone regularly.
11:01What have you seen from your 23-year-old prospect?
11:06Yeah, no, I think you hit it.
11:08In AAA, really, over the course of his career, he's done a really good job filling up the zone.
11:14In these first couple starts, I think he's just been a little erratic, and he would tell you that.
11:19You know, I think the first start, I chalked a lot of it up to, you know, just the nerves
11:24and the adrenaline of your first major league start.
11:27This one yesterday, I think he had times where he was syncing up his delivery really well, and then times
11:32where he was rushing through it a little bit.
11:34And, you know, you saw a couple 3-0 counts and then walking guys.
11:39And we just haven't seen that really at all.
11:43Yeah, during his time in the minor league.
11:45So it's going to course correct at some point.
11:48Hopefully his next start here.
11:50And then, yeah, we'll be getting a much better version of him.
11:53So how's the clubhouse right now after, you know, on July 28th, you guys were two games above .500.
11:59I believe you guys were actually in the three wildcard spots.
12:04And now, you know, it's been tough.
12:0660-67.
12:08Lost 14-19.
12:10You know, Wood's been out.
12:12Abram's getting moved.
12:13How's the clubhouse right now with Blake?
12:15Yeah, it's honestly one of the things I appreciate most about this team is even when we're in the middle
12:23of these little skids,
12:24the clubhouse is good.
12:26And that's not to say they're, like, okay with losing.
12:28No, it's far different from that.
12:30It's just they're able to show up every day and get there working and, you know, not have that vibe
12:38that, you know,
12:39sometimes you see in sports where it's like, man, we're never going to win another game.
12:43You know what I mean?
12:43And they're working and they're ready to roll.
12:47They bring great energy every day.
12:49And I think it's a testament to Blake and the rest of the staff, too.
12:52They're bringing great energy every day as well.
12:55So, man, it's not something that I really ever worry about.
13:00After the deadline, you guys probably remember, but we were in a little skid and I was in Philly with
13:06them.
13:07And you wouldn't have thought that, you know, we were on a 3, 4, 5-game losing streak.
13:11They're just the same guys every day and it's what I appreciate about them.
13:16Paul, good stuff.
13:18Appreciate the insight.
13:19That's Paul Ciboni, president of Baseball Ops for you, Washington Nationals.
13:22Thanks, buddy.
13:22It's going to win tonight.
13:24Yeah, appreciate you guys.
13:25All right.
13:25Thanks, Paul.
13:28All right.
13:28There you go.
13:29Try to get him to commit to Seaver King.
13:31Not going to commit to it yet.
13:33Cakes brought up the D word, the divorce word.
13:36I mean, he's painting a different picture.
13:40I like the question, but he's never going to say, yeah, he's not going to be renegotiating.
13:47When he said, hey, we have these talks and, you know, it's not something he identifies himself as a shortstop.
13:54This is really, you know, difficult for him potentially, but he gets it and he's been amazing.
14:00I actually believe him.
14:02I believe him.
14:03I don't think he's in there pouting.
14:05He can be a professional and still be upset about it.
14:09Yeah, exactly.
14:11I don't think he wants to do it.
14:13But CJ's got to look in the mirror and go, I'm not very good at shortstop defensively.
14:18I'm just not.
14:19I'm sure he thinks he can get better, but I'm sure he understands that I'm responsible for this.
14:23I mean, the numbers are what they are.
14:25And by the way, Nunez, I like Nunez, but he ain't that great either defensively.
14:30No, he's much better at swiping bags than playing defense.
14:34And so I don't know what their plan is.
14:35Yeah, but they have prospects for down the road.
14:37It might be a couple years down the road or short steps.
14:38No, I get it.
14:39And I know that's what they're going to do.
14:40But, you know, moving Nunez over to take Abram's spot and moving him to second, flipping him around.
14:46I mean, I don't know how much better you're getting defensively.
14:49I'm sure they've seen some analytics which say that it'll be a worthwhile move.
14:53Okay.
14:54Well, Nunez is the second on the team in errors.
14:56Coming up next, we'll open up EB's entertainment page.
15:00Don't go anywhere.
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