- 2 weeks ago
Olympic gold medallist and Australian Rugby Sevens star Ellia Green retired from elite sport, welcomed his first child and publicly transitioned all in the space of three months. It was a period of intense media scrutiny that left him feeling vulnerable, but holding his newborn daughter on his chest provided the exact clarity he needed to drown out the noise and remember exactly who he was.
Ellia joins hosts Rob and Marcus to share his unique journey to fatherhood, opening up about the intersec
Ellia joins hosts Rob and Marcus to share his unique journey to fatherhood, opening up about the intersec
Category
🛠️
LifestyleTranscript
00:00I'm holding a newborn for the first time, I've got to change a nappy.
00:03Is there any kind of transfer of skills that kind of you leaned on there?
00:08Um, yeah, I mean, I would kind of like, like hold her like a rugby ball when I was like
00:15under like this.
00:19It just became second nature. I couldn't help myself, it was just second nature.
00:24Hi, and welcome back to another episode of Daddy's, a podcast about life on the other side of kids.
00:29I'm Rob from Man of Many.
00:31I'm Marcus from Man of Many.
00:32How many times did it take you to do the intro, Rob?
00:35Three times.
00:35Yeah, I like the first one where you testy popped, and then the second one, I don't even know what
00:40that was.
00:40But the third one, you nailed it.
00:42No, yeah, did I say I'm Marcus from Man of Many?
00:44Okay, I'm Marcus from Man of Many also.
00:47And look, we've got another dad in the room.
00:49You know how when there's another dad in the room and you feel like the dad vibes?
00:53Well, I'm feeling Olympic vibes today.
00:56Okay, so like Zeus-like.
00:59Zeus-like, yes.
01:00So let's introduce Elia.
01:04Elia, welcome to Daddy's.
01:06Thanks for having me.
01:07Oh, thank you for coming.
01:08Can you please give out-
01:09Can you see your introduction one more time?
01:10Sure.
01:11Yeah.
01:11Yeah.
01:12With the pause, with the five second pause.
01:14Hello.
01:15Bye.
01:16I think he's too.
01:17I think he did too.
01:18I was like, all right, fine.
01:20If Elia tells me what to do, I'll do it.
01:21So Elia's already got the vibe.
01:23Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:24You give Rob a shit.
01:25Elia, introduce yourself for our kind of listening and viewing audience for me, please.
01:31Because like normally when someone's about to get up and do a keynote speech, the person
01:36gets up and it's like, today's guest is this, and they list the whole kind of resume.
01:40And I find that daunting and a little bit cringy.
01:44So I thought, why not let the person actually introduce you?
01:47How about you let him do it?
01:49Okay, yeah, cool.
01:50Elia, please.
01:51So as my name's Elia Green, I'm 33 now.
01:56Yeah, 33.
01:56And I was born in Fiji, adopted there by my Polish mum and English father.
02:05My dad, sorry, my brother also adopted from Fiji, different island though.
02:08And we were raised in Australia.
02:10And then we lived, yeah, firstly on the central coast and then in everywhere really.
02:17But since I started my sevens career playing for the Australian Rugby Sevens, I've lived
02:23in Sydney, which is where I live now.
02:25And yeah.
02:26And why we're here today is my most important role, which is I'm a dad as well.
02:32So I have a five-year-old daughter and her name is Waitui.
02:37Amazing.
02:37I think you've downplayed your sevens career.
02:41You are an Olympic gold medalist.
02:41There is a lot to say and like tell us about yourself.
02:44Like I'm like, this could be like five hours or five minutes.
02:48It was a very broad question.
02:50You're right.
02:50Let's skip like a lot of parts.
02:52Let's talk about your Olympic career because you are incredibly impressive and your career
02:56has been incredibly successful.
02:59So give us a few kind of highlights of the kind of journey from starting to right now.
03:05Starting to finish?
03:05Yeah.
03:06Okay.
03:06We'll go back to my childhood.
03:08My highlight of my like sporting achievements in my childhood was definitely making my first
03:14international meet, which was the World School Games in Qatar.
03:18And I made it for the 100 meters and the relay because I was initially a sprinter training
03:23at the Institute of Sport in Melbourne.
03:24And that's how I started off.
03:26My career was training from five years old to basically 18 when I moved to Sydney for rugby.
03:34But initially I wanted to be a fastest 100 meter sprinter in Australia.
03:39Hopefully the world.
03:41How fast did you get?
03:42Not fast enough.
03:44So, yeah, I was like 11.2 when I was first 16, but it was enough to get me to
03:51the world
03:52titles.
03:52And so I got my first world ranking at 17.
03:55Huge.
03:56It's faster than me.
03:57Might I ever tell a story about my running career?
04:00Go on, man.
04:01In grade five, I was-
04:02We can just go race outside.
04:03Yeah.
04:04I reckon I could be 11.2.
04:06No, I was really fast when I was in grade five, but then I had an accident.
04:09I got into States, had an accident, and I couldn't do it.
04:12But, yeah.
04:14Are you bragging about your grade five?
04:15Yeah, I was really-
04:16And I won a speech competition and a maths competition as well.
04:20Yeah.
04:20This is all very relevant.
04:21He's an athlete and an athlete.
04:22This is the stuff we'll cut out later.
04:25Let's move into TMI, yeah?
04:26Okay, great.
04:27So, Elliot, we explained to you prior to the cameras rolling that we like to kind of overshare
04:34on this podcast.
04:36And today's is really about-
04:38We've got a joint story, don't we, Brian?
04:40We do.
04:41We went to the movies together.
04:42We went to the movies together.
04:43Kind of.
04:44Not really.
04:44Well, we were in the same movie theater.
04:45We went to the same movie.
04:46Yeah.
04:47What did we see?
04:48Paw Patrol.
04:48Paw Patrol something or other.
04:50Something about dinosaurs.
04:50And my daughter was very excited.
04:54Like, she loves the concept of going to the movies and getting the popcorn and sitting
04:57in the really comfortable seats.
04:59But as soon as the movie starts, she goes from her seat, grabs onto me, it's cuddle time,
05:06there's sobbing.
05:07It's like, can we leave at halftime?
05:09Can we leave at halftime?
05:10And so, I think we saw 20 minutes of the Paw Patrol movie in between like crying but then
05:16being engaged and then it was a very confusing experience.
05:20And I didn't want to be the dad who's like, no, you will stay and you'll watch the whole
05:23movie.
05:24And a similar thing happened when I took her to The Lion King.
05:28Dropped about 500 bucks on two tickets.
05:30I was like, she'll love this.
05:31500 bucks.
05:32I'm rounding up that it was in the 400s.
05:35And we lasted until Be Prepared, which I think is like 15 minutes in.
05:41Arguably the highlight.
05:42Best song.
05:42Well, yeah.
05:43And just, I don't know how to really deal with that.
05:48Like, because it's a money pit, obviously.
05:50So, maybe I'll just stop spending money on those kind of things.
05:53I had a similar experience.
05:54Okay.
05:55Tell me.
05:56Well, so I was living in the United States for a bit in Philadelphia.
06:00And I thought it'd be a really cool surprise for my daughter to go to Sesame World, like
06:07where Sesame Street is filmed.
06:10And, um, I even arranged to like her to have a private dining experience with Elmo.
06:16And then, and like, how does that work?
06:21Like the whole thing was like, how does he, how does he pick up the knife from four?
06:24Very easily.
06:25Yeah.
06:25It's just straight down the gob.
06:27Like, I don't know where, I don't know if it went to the side or I don't know where
06:30the food went, but yeah, Elmo was huge.
06:32First of all, like Elmo was enormous.
06:34Oh, as in like physically?
06:36Yeah, huge.
06:37How big are we talking?
06:38Um, at least seven, eight, four.
06:41What?
06:42In my mind, Elmo's three feet.
06:44Elmo was huge.
06:45And I don't know if like Elmo's been like taking supplements or whatever.
06:50Elmo was huge.
06:52And so I think like I was just about as scared as what my daughter was because she was terrified
06:57of Elmo.
06:58Like, especially when like Elmo's walking towards us and like we're going to have lunch with
07:03Elmo.
07:03And then it was like, she just, she didn't want to borrow it.
07:07And yeah, like I said, it was like 800 US to get the whole experience of like, I don't
07:12know if it was about exactly that, but it was as expensive, but just the experience, you
07:16know, but then you're like, she was more interested in just like checking out the stores and stuff.
07:20And like, I think the, the lunch was too much.
07:23Like.
07:23I think you need to let them enjoy what they want to enjoy in those experiences because
07:28I've had similar things where like being able to watch something on TV and it's fine.
07:33But like the real life kind of never meet your heroes kind of thing.
07:36Yeah.
07:37And it is just instantly not too much overwhelm.
07:40Yeah.
07:40Yeah.
07:40And we went to movie world recently and you know, all the characters are walking around
07:44and then they do, it's very Marvel themed movie world at the moment.
07:48So no, I will DC.
07:50Oops.
07:51That'll upset me.
07:52That's okay.
07:52Um, so lots of like, you know, your Superman's, your Batman's, all that kind of stuff.
07:56Cool.
07:57Great.
07:57Love that.
07:58But also like the Joker was hanging around.
07:59The penguin was hanging around.
08:00We weren't so into that.
08:01And then there was a parade and they all kind of, uh, you know, come down the main street
08:06of movie world and it's a good guys first.
08:10Great.
08:10Love it.
08:11And then the bad guys come out, not into that, freaks out, runs away, tears, tantrums, whole
08:16thing.
08:16So now she's afraid of parades.
08:21I mean, I'm afraid of how boring a parade could be.
08:24She said, when we went to Paw Patrol on the weekend, she said, I hope there's not a parade.
08:28In the movie?
08:29Yeah.
08:29Oh.
08:30She's terrified.
08:30That's weird.
08:31Like normal, kids normally get a clown.
08:33No, parades.
08:34Parades.
08:34We hate parades.
08:35I think it's that, um, it opens up the, when does the innocence get lost?
08:41Because like, I don't think Beno really understands bad guys versus good guys.
08:48And is it my job?
08:50Is it our job to introduce her to that concept and go, no, sit down, watch this movie.
08:55You will watch the bad guy being an asshole and then the good guy's winning.
08:59Like, is the fire wrong?
09:00Oh, we're right into bad guys and good guys.
09:02No, we're all into, we're in a real superhero phase.
09:04Beno's really innocent.
09:06I don't mind that.
09:06That's beautiful.
09:07I think I'll keep that for as long as possible.
09:09Um, that was TMI.
09:10Okay.
09:11So let's get into it.
09:13Um, we mentioned gay man, single dad.
09:17How would you describe your kind of journey into fatherhood, Elia?
09:23That's a big question.
09:24I think that so many things come to mind.
09:26Um, but I would just say I'm a very proud dad.
09:30Yeah.
09:31Like, yes, I've also transitioned.
09:33Like, uh, I wasn't sure if you were going to throw me as like trans dad or, you know,
09:38or any label, but I don't, I don't particularly like identify as any like specific label behind
09:44the dad, just a very proud dad or Tutu's dad, which is my daughter's nickname.
09:49Yeah.
09:50And I think that's it.
09:50I mean, you can kind of choose that label yourself.
09:53Right.
09:53But I think there is this overarching, yes, I said you're a gay dad.
09:57Yes.
09:57I said I'm a single dad, but we are all just dads.
10:00Yeah.
10:01Just dads.
10:01And I think that kind of, oh, this is going to sound really like profound and then a bit
10:06soppy, but it kind of binds us together in terms of this shared experience and everyone's
10:12experience and how we kind of got here is a little bit different, but in essence, our
10:18role or our job or our privilege is to be a dad.
10:22We share that.
10:23Actually, one thing I did think of was that I always had this, like, I would always get
10:28really upset when people would say like, oh, so who's your real dad though?
10:33Or who's your real mom?
10:35Because I am adopted.
10:36And so that would be really offensive to me.
10:39Like, I would think like, well, my, my real parents are, you know, Yolanta and Evan, that's
10:45who adopted me.
10:46But I, I, I've never heard, um, I would find really hard to, um, hear when someone say like,
10:53oh, so is that your real mom or this?
10:55I'm like, yeah, my real mom.
10:56I don't know any other mom or real dad, you know, that my real dad is the only dad I
11:00have.
11:01And that's right.
11:02Cause there's, I mean, I've not experienced that, but you do hear of people kind of going,
11:06maybe they get to 18 and it's like, oh, I'm going to go find my biological parents
11:11from whatever, maybe there's some closure there or whatever it might be.
11:14But you've never really had that kind of desire to go because you pity your parents as your
11:20parents.
11:21Yeah.
11:21Yeah.
11:21A question we get sometimes, which I hate is, um, who's the mom and who's the dad?
11:28She's just got two dads.
11:30Yeah.
11:30Yeah.
11:30And that's all she's ever known.
11:32And that's all she, and she, and that's the thing that I think blows people's minds is like,
11:35she knows she's different in the sense that like, she has two dads.
11:39We've talked, we've talked about it since she was born.
11:41Like some people have two dads, some people have two moms, some people have a mom and
11:44a dad, all this kind of stuff.
11:45And she just goes, I've got two dads.
11:47And she doesn't think anything of it.
11:48But for people who have never experienced that, it kind of blows their mind that there
11:53are other types of families out there that are just, if that's the way you were raised
11:59and that's the world you were brought up in, then you don't know anything else.
12:03Right.
12:03And there might be a tendency for people to kind of apply their lens onto that situation
12:08going, oh, well, then you need a female figure in your life if you had two dads or it's like,
12:13why haven't you gone and find it?
12:15Like, I think, I mean, I don't know how to speak to that with too much authority, but I
12:23thought the lens thing was pretty clever.
12:24You should keep that in.
12:26You're being very sensitive.
12:28Yeah.
12:28And so taking your kind of transition story and it's, you're going to probably educate
12:38us as to kind of how your views may have changed, but kind of throughout that journey, I think
12:46you've mentioned before that you always felt like you had this kind of, not a desire to
12:51be a dad, but it was like, this is kind of where I want to land.
12:55Can you talk us through that kind of journey?
12:57Yeah, sure.
12:58I think I'd never thought that I would have kids for starters, like even like throughout
13:05my whole career, like 10 plus years playing sevens, like I was starting to think of my
13:11retirement, you know, especially after getting injured so many, so many years in a row after
13:17probably 25 and even the thought of retirement of what am I going to do after rugby, being
13:24a parent, having a kid was never on my list.
13:27And yeah, and I just, and not that I didn't want kids, it's just didn't seem like something
13:33that was going to happen for me in the near future or even when I retired.
13:39However, when my partner at the time, you know, and I did speak about children, I knew
13:48in fact that I would never be a mom.
13:52And as soon as, you know, I was brave enough to, you know, have this conversation even with,
14:02at the time that like, yeah, I could never see myself as a parent.
14:07But I think the reason why is because I didn't think I would ever be a mom.
14:10And that's the way the world sees me at this stage, like, and that's, yeah, that's honestly
14:15how it felt.
14:16But straight away when I thought about, like, how would I feel if I was a dad and I was
14:23in
14:24my skin as me, like, it's instant joy.
14:28When my daughter was born, I was going through a really difficult stage mentally myself.
14:32And my story about transitioning had just gone very public, both in Australia and overseas.
14:41And I, it was kind of out of my control.
14:44A lot of the articles being written and things said that I felt really vulnerable and I kind
14:51of just shut down.
14:52But one thing that did give me so much courage and made me remember who I am was when I
15:02would
15:02hold my baby on my chest.
15:05And I can remember, like, it was yesterday, I thought to myself, like, I never want you
15:11to think that I was too scared to tell the world that I'm your daddy.
15:17No.
15:20It's really not.
15:21I'm on a podcast.
15:22Yeah.
15:22It's that connection that you have with your daughter or that we all have with our daughter
15:29as well.
15:30We all dance here.
15:32It does, it does shut up that noise.
15:35And I can kind of imagine what your kind of story being blasted across the world would
15:41have felt like.
15:42But I think there's this real power in having your daughter or our daughters kind of becoming
15:49almost the center of our universe where you think, okay, nothing is wrong when I'm holding
15:55our kid.
15:57And it's incredibly, yeah, it's incredibly moving.
16:01I think I was going to cry on it.
16:04It was always going to happen eventually.
16:06You were always going to be the first one to cry.
16:07And I guess it's beautiful.
16:09And so during that time, and I think, like, the mental health side of things that you mentioned,
16:15I think is quite important.
16:18And look, there's the stereotype that men maybe don't talk about their feelings as much,
16:23and maybe they keep it inside.
16:25And so maybe I should cry.
16:27But how did you kind of, did you have people around you to kind of support you through that?
16:37Was it your kind of daughter that was your kind of guiding light?
16:41Or just talk us through the kind of mental health side of things.
16:44Because I think it's something that, I mean, I've struggled with and I've needed to rely
16:48on people.
16:49And so I'm interested to see how you kind of got through that, if that is the correct
16:55phrase.
16:56Well, it was a very difficult time, to say the least, because I think you just did a lot
17:02of, like, big things in my life in just a short space of time.
17:07I just finished filming a reality TV show at the time.
17:13And then my daughter was born, and then I'd also transitioned all in the space of three
17:18months.
17:19Whoa.
17:19So I left the country with the Fiji just to reground myself because I was really struggling,
17:28I guess, with just so many massive things happening in my life, even though a lot of them was
17:37self-made by myself.
17:39I just don't think that anything can really prepare you for retiring from something that
17:47has been your whole life.
17:48It's the only job I had worked since I was a teenager and then retiring at 29, 28, I think
17:55I was.
17:55And then also nothing can prepare you for becoming a father.
17:59And I've never, I haven't really seen the, experienced what it's like to have a father.
18:07My father passed away when I was two and, yeah, raised by just my mom who took on both roles.
18:14I'd say the closest thing to a father would be my mom's, like, family friends, like, father
18:22figures who played a big role, or even my older brother who has been a huge part of my life
18:30and, you know, just growing up together.
18:34So my role into becoming a father for the first time was, it was definitely scary.
18:40Like I, up until that point, I hadn't even, never even held a newborn, I don't think, or
18:45even changed a nappy.
18:46I had no experience.
18:47Well, that's it.
18:48Like, dads will be like, oh, I've got to change a nappy for the first time.
18:51But like, the holding a newborn and like, the, what a, like, I would say that were you
18:57prepared to be a dad?
18:58No, I think that's the thing is, right?
18:59Like, such three very different journeys to fatherhood, but that actual universal experience
19:04of holding a baby for the first time and changing your first nappy is just universal.
19:08And that's kind of slightly terrifying, no matter what your story is.
19:12Well, yeah.
19:12And if you add everything else that was going on in your life, I mean, I thought I struggled
19:17going, who is this tiny little human that I am now responsible for?
19:21And why does it keep pooing and crying and weeing?
19:25And like, I struggled.
19:29Yes, very much.
19:30Oh God, that first night when she first cried, I remember we were in the hospital and suddenly
19:34at 3am she starts crying and both of us like leapt out of bed and just like looked at each
19:40other like, we don't know what to, we don't know what to do with this thing.
19:43We have no idea.
19:45But you just, you have to keep going, right?
19:47And I don't want to draw this terrible parallel that like elite sport, I mean, you're a gold
19:53medalist at a very physically demanding sport.
19:57How, have you been able to kind of borrow from that experience and go, okay, I'm holding
20:03a newborn for the first time.
20:04I've got to change a nappy.
20:05Is there any kind of transfer of skills that kind of you leaned on there?
20:11Um, yeah.
20:12I mean, I would kind of like, like, hold her like a rugby ball when I, like under like this.
20:21It just became second nature.
20:24And then when it was time to change a nappy, I would just, yeah, I do like a, I pass
20:29there
20:29from left to right on to the table.
20:32And then I couldn't help myself.
20:34It was just second nature.
20:36That's so good.
20:37But what about also like, uh, we, something we've talked about on the podcast before is
20:41like one of the unexpected things for me going through international surrogacy, the way we
20:46did was the, out of that process, we formed this like really lovely international community
20:53of people who helped us to, to become a family, right?
20:56My daughter's born in Canada.
20:57And so we've got family in Canada, you know, her surrogate lives in Canada, her biological
21:02mother lives in Canada.
21:03Um, we've got some other parts of the network all over the world and it's this really beautiful
21:08community that we didn't expect to grow out of this process.
21:11You know, we, we went in just hoping to start a family, the three of us, and suddenly we
21:15actually have this family around the world.
21:18You having spent almost your entire life in sport, which is its own kind of community.
21:24Did those, did your teammates, did they kind of come along with you on that journey where
21:28they must've been really supportive as well or?
21:30Yeah, I can, I can remember actually telling my team.
21:33teammates that like, um, was having a baby and, you know, my teammates, like they generally
21:39don't really know what I'm up to mostly.
21:41Like they're like, I don't know where Elliot is, don't know who is, what Elliot is doing,
21:46you know?
21:46So when I, I did this, how I did it was I was running a team meeting.
21:51Yep.
21:51So we, when we're doing, um, meetings, we analyze a team, um, from, I think this day was,
21:58I was doing Canada and, um, you like, you pick out the key players, the, the team's weaknesses,
22:05strengths, all that.
22:06And yet I had to make a slideshow.
22:08So what, what my coach said is like, make it look like you're starting off the, your presentation
22:14of Canada and, or whatever the team was, and then just put a, put a picture up of like
22:20your, um, you know, your news and just put it like that.
22:26Cause it did with, this was, um, unexpected.
22:31Sorry.
22:32Sorry.
22:32That's how I did it.
22:33Like that's how I told, um, my team.
22:36Yeah.
22:36That's actually how it happened.
22:37And then, um, on that topic of like feeling of community and, um, how children, uh, you
22:44know, bring so much happiness, but also bring out, bring us back together as well as recently
22:49had a Rio reunion.
22:51And, um, I saw actually a lot of the players, babies for the first, some for the first time.
22:57And a lot of my teammates have, have kids now or are pregnant as well.
23:03Um, so I think, uh, that was only a couple of weeks ago.
23:06So I think just to see that side of life, like now we're all doing, um, you know, life
23:12very differently and parents like that was really special.
23:16And I, like some of the kids were running around the field.
23:19Um, they had set up Allianz Stadium with like, uh, a picture of us from Rio and, um, it
23:25was just, it was really nice.
23:27And yeah.
23:28Oh, random question.
23:29Is that, is that real?
23:30Is it a candle or something?
23:31I'm pretty sure that's a candle.
23:35We could.
23:36I'm pretty sure it's real.
23:36Yeah.
23:37I think we're allowed.
23:38Yeah.
23:38Um, you can be our first, this could be the first drink poured on.
23:42We, we love, we love whiskey at Man of Many.
23:44Our audience loves whiskey.
23:46It's funny the man that doesn't drink pouring the drinks, but like, just treat me like a
23:50waiter.
23:52Brilliant.
23:52I knew this would happen eventually.
23:56Is it kind of a smell?
23:57I don't know.
23:58Yeah, that's real.
24:01Excellent.
24:02Okay.
24:03Dan's do whiskey.
24:05I mean, how much do I pour?
24:06It's been a while.
24:07Is that too much?
24:08That's probably enough.
24:09Okay, cool.
24:10How do you like, how do you like it?
24:12Neat or?
24:13Yeah, neat.
24:14Neat.
24:14There you go.
24:15You don't really, whatever.
24:18Yeah, definitely neat.
24:19Just sit in the office.
24:21Oh, wait for me.
24:22Cheers.
24:22Cheers.
24:23That was rude.
24:23Pleasure.
24:24Pleasure.
24:25I've never understood the looking in the eyes when you cheers thing.
24:28It's intimidating to me.
24:30Not bad.
24:31No?
24:32Yeah.
24:35So I think this is a great time to continue the mental health conversation.
24:40I won't tell the audience what time it is.
24:42We've just had, no, it's not breakfast time.
24:44It's a decent hour.
24:45It's a Friday afternoon, so this is fine.
24:48The mental health, like I've always been quite into the idea of, okay,
24:54how can I better myself?
24:56How can I turn up better as a father, as a person, whatever it might be.
25:01For the first time, I was having a conversation with a mate yesterday
25:04who's got young kids.
25:07And she was talking about her kid having anxiety.
25:12And, like, she's around Beano's age, so, like, five years old.
25:16What was her being anxious about?
25:16I'd never gone, oh, yeah, a five-year-old can get anxious.
25:20But the more, obviously, I think about it, like, the little people,
25:24like, growing into little humans with thoughts, feelings,
25:28and all this kind of thing.
25:30So I'm wondering how you guys, have you thought about it?
25:36Have you kind of, does your experience allow you to therefore go, okay,
25:40with my daughter, when she's experiencing this, how do I kind of help out?
25:45I mean, it's a big question, but you've got your whiskey to kind of, yeah,
25:49kill the inhibition.
25:50Yeah, have another sip, yeah.
25:54I, unfortunately, well, not unfortunately, very fortunately,
25:57but unfortunately for this conversation,
25:58I'm absolutely just someone with quite good mental health.
26:02For the most part.
26:03I mean, look, we all have our moments, right?
26:04But, like, I don't have that many problems.
26:07My problems aren't that big.
26:08I'm sorry.
26:09Well, please, excuse yourself while Elliot and I have a chat then.
26:13Elliot, what about you?
26:15Are you a little bit less, I don't know.
26:20I don't know what you're trying to ask.
26:22I asked a question.
26:24Elliot, do you have an answer?
26:28I'm just thinking because, as I said, everything's been such a new experience,
26:34you know, like I wouldn't even listen to my own advice sometimes.
26:37So, but, you know.
26:39It's kind of true for all of us, though.
26:40I would say being, you know, being, like, a dad is, it's the best feeling in the world,
26:47you know, and since she, my daughter was born, you know,
26:53her coming into my life has been the best thing that's ever happened to me,
26:56you know, as well as, you know, my best decision for myself being transitioning.
27:01And she makes me the happiest, like, every time I see her, the way she looks at me,
27:05she, like, grabs my face and, like, the noses are touching and it's, like,
27:11her rough way of being so affectionate with me and, like, I love it.
27:16It's exactly how I am.
27:18I'm, like, a bit rough with when I'm cuddling someone and she's exactly like that with me.
27:24So, in terms of, like, knowing about mental health, being aware of it with my daughter,
27:31I mean, she's, I'd say I'm definitely, I go off my intuition with her and I lead by her
27:39and just kind of support her how I can based on how she's reacting or what she needs.
27:47And every day, like, every experience with her is a little time I learn something new,
27:54not only about her but about myself.
27:58And my mum used to say that she loves that I'm, like, one of the most patient people
28:04she's ever known in her life, you know, and so, like, that's definitely one of,
28:09I think, my biggest strengths is my patience with situations like this
28:14or throwing myself into the unknown is just being content with not knowing
28:19and being patient with her has always been a key for me.
28:22And that, I mean, is a beautiful answer because Rob and I have spoken about people always come
28:28up to us and say, and, like, I'll say, oh, Bino's perfect.
28:30And it's like, oh, wait until she's a teenager.
28:33And, you know, response is kind of going, well, live in the moment and learn as you go
28:40because I have a tendency to kind of project into the future and go, like, even in a week
28:45where something might be coming up and I'm like, okay, how am I going to handle it with Sabrina
28:49or whatever it might be, but the kind of patience and the presence that you mentioned,
28:55I mean, I have learned patience incredibly so over the last five years.
29:03I'm not sure if I've told this story before, but, like, I used to get really frustrated
29:07when Bino wouldn't go to sleep.
29:10And I mean, just, like, and you get her to sleep and then you put her down
29:12and she'd wake up again.
29:14And I caught myself in it going, Marcus, you're not, as soon as you leave that room
29:19and she's asleep, you're not going to go cure cancer.
29:21You're not going to go run a marathon.
29:23You're going to plop on a couch.
29:25So what is 15, exactly, what's 15 minutes an hour with your child?
29:31Which I think, I mean, it's a bit of a stretch, but maybe that has kind of folded
29:37into the rest of my life in terms of if Rob is annoying me at work,
29:41like, I'll take a deep breath and.
29:48So, like, we've talked about this before on the show, like,
29:51the importance for me of finding other gay dads that we could be friends with
29:55so that Billy could see that there are other kids just like her
29:58growing up with two dads.
29:59Do you have a kind of similar community around you of sort of trans dads
30:02that helps you to sort of, I guess, figure out who you are
30:06and make sure that Waitui feels, you know, a sense of identity as well?
30:09Yeah, for sure.
30:11I know two trans dads in my life that are close friends of mine,
30:16and seeing the way that they parent their children has just been beautiful.
30:22And I've always been a strong believer of, you know,
30:26you can't be what you can't see.
30:28And it's not to say that I don't think that I could be a bad, sorry,
30:32it's not to say that I don't think that I could be.
30:35Why is that a tongue twister?
30:36I could be a dad if I didn't see other trans dads because I've kind of invented
30:41my own role as what I am to her myself of what I know.
30:48However, knowing these two beautiful people, our dads as well,
30:53has been like meant a lot just to see that.
30:57And prior to transitioning even, I didn't know any other trans people personally
31:04in my life.
31:05So I was also kind of going into that, you know,
31:10I don't want to say on my own, but just, you know, this is who I am.
31:14And so like I wasn't, I knew I could kind of get information and things online
31:20and follow other trans like influences or just, you know,
31:24that spoke about their experiences.
31:27But yeah, at the end of the day, like I knew that I just,
31:31I was going into making a decision that I knew was exactly, was for me.
31:37And so that is pretty much like what I would say is when in becoming a dad,
31:42I haven't experienced having a dad, like other than two years old onwards.
31:48And I didn't really know there was no like book or anything, you know.
31:54So I just, like, I just kind of went in with my eyes closed and,
32:00and yeah, little did I know it was exactly who I've always,
32:05who I've always meant to be, which is her father.
32:08That's a really sweet answer.
32:09Oh man, I had a follow-up question a bit.
32:11How can, how do you not end the podcast on that beautiful thing?
32:14I think now, do you want to go out with a dad joke now?
32:16Um, yes, please.
32:18Um, so dad jokes.
32:20Yeah.
32:20My big plan is that we're going to get all of our guests,
32:23give us a dad joke.
32:25And then eventually we're going to publish Man of Many's 100 dad jokes.
32:29Um, our intern, uh, Irvin, once again,
32:32gave us another banger.
32:34He's not a dad, but like, he apparently just has lots of dad jokes.
32:37Yeah.
32:38He doesn't know this yet, but I've improved his joke.
32:41Um, okay.
32:42I think I've improved it.
32:44So why does a cow get angry about the fact that it has hooves?
32:54I know it's, it's tough.
32:56Dave knows.
32:57Because he's lactose and intolerant.
33:02I think he butchered that.
33:04You think so?
33:04Yeah.
33:05Say that again.
33:06Yes, he's what?
33:08Okay.
33:08Take two.
33:12So why does it, I think the fact that you don't get it suggests that it is a dad joke.
33:16Um, why, why does a cow, no, wait, wait.
33:23Oh yeah.
33:23Why does a cow get angry that it has hooves?
33:29You fucked it up again.
33:30Okay.
33:31Sorry.
33:31Okay, Rob.
33:32Hey, I'm going to do it for you.
33:37Yeah, yeah, yeah.
33:39Uh, why, why, why do cows get angry that they have hooves and not feet?
33:46Because they lactose and they're intolerant.
33:49Lactose intolerant?
33:49Lactose intolerant?
33:50Anybody?
33:51Did you guys just copy the same joke?
33:52Well, no, he tried to improve it.
33:54I just tried to do it better than his version.
33:55Do you know whose fault this is?
33:57Irvin.
33:57Yeah.
33:58Irvin the intern.
33:58Once again, letting us down.
34:00If you were going to ask me a joke on this podcast, I was just going to ask you to
34:04leave
34:05me alone.
34:05Oh.
34:07There's a dad joke.
34:09Beautiful.
34:09Done.
34:10What a way to wrap things up.
34:11Thank you so much for being on it.
34:13Like, just brilliant.
34:16Loved it.
34:17Great chat.
34:17Did you have a good time?
34:18It's been awesome.
34:18Yeah.
34:19No, we should have you back on again.
34:20Thanks for the drink.
34:20Oh yeah.
34:21Anytime.
34:22Next time, maybe on the rocks or something.
34:24Oh yeah, sorry.
34:25That could be like a $500 bottle of whiskey, or it could be.
34:28It kind of looks like it.
34:29It'll be interesting as we do more podcasts.
34:31See how it goes down.
34:33And if it's been a particularly enjoyable one, perhaps it's...
34:36Look, I thought it was a candle.
34:38I'm glad it wasn't.
34:41Okay.
34:42Should we wrap it up, Rob?
34:42Yeah, sure.
34:43Cool.
34:44This has been Daddy's.
34:45I've been Rob.
34:46I've been Marcus.
34:48I'm only agreeing.
34:49Hey, and you've all been great.
34:52Like, subscribe, tell your friends, all that stuff too.
34:54Right.
34:55Comment.
34:56Yeah.
34:56Share.
34:57Yeah.
34:57What else can you do?
34:58I don't know.
34:58I think you can repost now.
35:00Thumbs up.
35:01Repost.
35:01Repost.
35:02Yeah.
35:02Spread the word.
35:02The 10th reposter will get a sip of this whiskey.
35:05Excellent.
35:06Okay, done.
35:07Bye.