- 15 hours ago
Don Toliver and Malcolm Todd discuss embracing the highs and finding beauty in the lows for Rolling Stone’s eighth annual Musicians on Musicians series. The pair became fast friends after Toliver sampled “Chest Pain (I Love),” from Todd’s 2025 self-titled debut album, on “E85.” Both artists are closing out major years. His January album Octane, has established him as an arena star alongside longtime collaborator Travis Scott. There’s also his recent run of Drake collaborations only adding to the scale of his reach. Todd’s “Earrings” has become a bona fide hit, and his Do That Again tour is taking him to his biggest venues yet. Together, they discuss keeping friendships intact as success changes their lives and turning sadness into music. Toliver also has an idea for what comes next: a proper collaboration.
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00:00Hell yeah, I know my fan base was like, Michael Tyler, another fan base was like,
00:03Donald Tyler, right?
00:04Yeah.
00:04That's dope, though.
00:05That's the type of shit that needs to happen more, honestly.
00:08You gotta just be wanted, as an artist, you gotta wanna just lock in and like, dibble
00:13and dabble with things that you don't do on the norm.
00:16I feel like that's what makes the music interesting, bro.
00:27My manager had sent me, like, he had sent me just a bounce of the song.
00:36With like, the classic, um, there's like a voice going over it every 10 seconds, like,
00:41this is like, not to be shared, like, not to be, like, whatever.
00:45I heard, like, an early version of it, and I was like, holy shit, this is so good.
00:49Like, I know he's probably making so many songs, so I'm like, I don't know, I don't know what's
00:53gonna happen to this, but I'm like, I'm glad that even if it doesn't come out, I'm like,
00:57this is cool just to have for myself.
00:59And then I didn't hear about it, really, and I would just play it in the car, like, driving.
01:03On the highway and I'm dang it.
01:05Just, like, by myself.
01:06And then, like, right before the album came out, they were like, yeah, it's track one.
01:10I was like, yes.
01:12And then I saw, like, the video, and I saw, like, the trailer thing.
01:16And then also, because you guys did some, like, crazy, you made it so cinematic and so
01:20big from the first version I heard, which is pretty cool, because when you're, like,
01:24making a real-ass album, like, it really takes a huge, like, songs take a huge jump from the
01:30first time they get recorded to the end.
01:32So I got to see, like, the transformation of it, and it was like, I got chills, you know?
01:37It's the whole energy, like, I really love that song, too.
01:40Every time I used to, like, hear fragments of it on the internet, I'd just be like, bro,
01:44this is, this is hard.
01:46And it just had, like, this energy that kind of made me think about, like, what I did on
01:53my last project, too, in a sense with the guitars and everything.
01:57That whole process, like, with that song is crazy, like, even from the beginning of it
02:03and how we built it.
02:04But it was just one of those things where I knew it was going to go on my album, though.
02:08Like, that was one of the only songs on the album where it was like, yo, this is going
02:14on.
02:14You knew it from the first time you, like, recorded it?
02:17Yeah, for sure.
02:18For sure, bro.
02:18After I recorded the vibe, everything I had going on, I knew.
02:22How many songs did you make to get Octane?
02:25Make?
02:27And a whole year of recording stuff, bro.
02:29That was, like, hundreds and hundreds of songs.
02:31Like, how do you whittle that down?
02:32Whatever kind of, like, feels the most authentic to me.
02:37You feel me?
02:38I can actually, like, work with the song.
02:41Like, I've been doing, I've been making movies for a little while now.
02:44I kind of know what, like, my fans react to and what I react to.
02:48So I try to stay in that world for real.
02:50As you kind of, like, gain your fan base and you grow with your fan base, and there's more
02:55and more and more people, it's like, sometimes I can't tell when I should be thinking about
03:00them and when I should just be thinking about what I think.
03:02Because it's not the same thing every time.
03:04I always try to, like, cater to what I feel like people love about me.
03:09But, bro, everything that I'm doing is all, like, pulling from things that I love a lot.
03:14Yeah.
03:15I wouldn't be able to put the music out if it didn't, like, stem from something that
03:18made me super, not even just me making the music, like, actual, like, little artifacts
03:25and fragments of, like, certain way I said something.
03:28Like, a certain way I sung a certain song may have been, like, an idea I got from hearing,
03:34like, Billy Idol or, like, it'd be little things.
03:38I'm like, yo, just having this on my album makes me feel so crazy just because I sent this a
03:43certain way.
03:44It's not even like you're pulling inspiration from, like, the entire song a lot of the time.
03:48It's, like, one moment, like, in the bridge.
03:50Honestly, some songs I think aren't that good, but the bridge is insane and I build, like, a whole
03:55song around the fact that I love the bridge.
03:57Bro, that's, like, the magic of, kind of, like, songwriting.
04:00We was talking about earlier.
04:01Like, the whole song could take you on a ride, but after, like, that minute and 26 marker,
04:08you just listen to the song, it might be one thing you say, bro, that just changes the whole
04:13way you view a song.
04:14Yeah.
04:15And the whole way, just, like, that bridge.
04:16It's, like, I done been there so many times where I just listen to people.
04:20I listen to a song and it's, like, you telling me this story and it's just, like, this part
04:27comes on and I'm, like, damn, I like that.
04:31That now I want to go in the studio, like, right now.
04:33Yeah.
04:34Like, that one song you got on your last album, that one, that's my favorite, that one.
04:38To Break My Heart Again Drink.
04:39Yeah, yeah, yeah.
04:40When that hook comes back around, it's, like, you go into this whole story, but then when
04:44that hook, what do you say?
04:47That down chorus?
04:48Yeah, but what do you say?
04:49You say one thing, like, before you, like, say the B word.
04:52Oh, you could rip my heart out just like you did last time.
04:55Just like you did.
04:57You could rip my heart out just like you did last time.
05:03So, this is exactly what we talking about, bro.
05:05You get all the way to this point and it's, like, when you get to that, it's, like, damn.
05:11I feel it.
05:12I feel it.
05:12But you told a story before you even got there, so.
05:15That's funny, because that's what I like about, like, a thing I love about your music
05:18is when you, like, I feel like you, especially, you love, like, those little outros and then
05:23you break it down and you build it up.
05:26Even if you're saying the hook, like, you'll bring the hook back, but it'll be no drums
05:29and it'll be, like, synth parts instead of guitar.
05:31And even though you're kind of saying the same thing you said earlier in the song, I'm, like,
05:34listening to it a different way.
05:36Right.
05:36And then it's, like, boo, boo, boo, and then it's, like, next song.
05:39It's, like, whoa.
05:39Talking about the shows, right?
05:41Yeah, I'm talking about the shows, but also in some of the albums.
05:43Yeah, the album, too.
05:44Yeah, the live aspect has to be exciting, bro.
05:48I be thinking about that.
05:49Sometimes, like, you might want to play the whole song and the outro, but sometimes you
05:53gotta cut that shit in half and just jump into something else.
05:56You're pretty involved in, like, how your set list goes and, like, the whole ...
06:00Honestly, bro, I'm such a last-minute person, though.
06:03It's, like, I would never ... I never really like to say that.
06:05This whole tour, I didn't really look at the set list probably, like, until I had to go
06:10on for the tour.
06:11Like, probably, like, an hour before, I was like, what is it?
06:14We were kind of cooking it back and forth because I had to do the show and it was kind
06:18of time-coded.
06:18Yeah, yeah.
06:19But I still didn't know the time.
06:20But this was the first year I never looked at the paper.
06:23Every other year or every other show before this year, bro, I stare at the paper.
06:29Yeah.
06:29Even though you know it, you're like ... The amount of times I've fucked up the ... because
06:33I don't, like ... I didn't have, kind of, like, a doll running my tracks or anything.
06:40I would just go up and play, like, guitar-based drums.
06:42And so there was no, like, anyone cuing me.
06:46And sometimes I'd read the paper wrong and just start playing a song that wasn't next.
06:49And my band would be like, what the fuck is going on?
06:53And, yeah, I'm like you in the same way where ... I'm last-miniting my tour right now.
06:58But I'm sure it's going to be good.
06:59Nah, it's great.
07:00That's how, like ... that keeps the energy, like, fresh, bro.
07:03Because when it's like you already know everything you're about to do, you done rehearsed it 20
07:07times.
07:08Yeah.
07:08Seeing the same people every day.
07:09Yeah.
07:10How do you keep your tour, like, show exciting?
07:12Because you're on tour all year round, pretty much.
07:16Motivation.
07:17I be motivated.
07:18Every night, I just find something or think of something, bro.
07:21So, like, I'm up there, it's like mad motive.
07:24Sometimes I'll just be up there and I haven't thought of, like, the motivation.
07:28But then I think about my kid, like, nah, I got to be lit for the next 20 years.
07:31I'm going to go nuts.
07:32Yeah, because you play a great show and everyone's coming back for the next one.
07:36Bro, it's like the shabby-shabby thing about ...
07:38Your show fired me up when I saw ... I'd never seen you live.
07:41Yeah.
07:41And when I went and saw you ... Well, when we got ... I got to obviously ...
07:45Right.
07:45That was lit.
07:46But even just ... It was sick because it was the last song.
07:49So, I had the whole concert to get, like, charged up.
07:52Right.
07:52And every song, I was like, damn, I'm going to be up there in a little bit.
07:55And then it was, like, getting closer.
07:56I was like, shit, I'm about to go up there.
07:58Sure.
07:58But the show was so sick.
07:59And the way you like ... You're pretty fluid, like, the way you move on stage.
08:03I just be having fun, bro.
08:04It's like ... I be loving that music.
08:07It's just like a connection of, like, me loving the music, the fans loving the music,
08:13and me kind of feeling like it's always what I wanted to do.
08:16You don't take it for granted.
08:17Nah, hell nah, bro.
08:18Because I be thinking about that motivation.
08:20It's hard to be like, ah, fuck this when it's, like, every day I think of something
08:24to, like, motivate me, bro.
08:25Because it be taking a lot sometimes.
08:27Like, bro, I be tired.
08:28I be wanting to do a million other things sometimes.
08:30What's your, like, bus vibe on tour?
08:32My bus vibe is very, like, boring.
08:34Three people on my bus.
08:36Okay.
08:37Sometimes I have volts of energy and I, like, want to listen to music.
08:41It depends on what I got going on.
08:43But it's really kind of, like, boring.
08:45I'm just, like, smoking on the bus.
08:47I might ...
08:48Playing the game or ...
08:49Yeah, I'm napping, too, because I be tired low-key.
08:52Yeah, I saw the show.
08:54Yeah, I be kind of tired.
08:55So, sometimes I be like ...
08:56But this be the only time, too, I be feeling completely away.
09:01Like, I just watch you call me and I might not answer the phone just because I feel like
09:05I'm away, bro.
09:07Yeah.
09:07You know?
09:08You have an excuse to be away.
09:10It's like, I gotta breathe.
09:12You do gotta breathe.
09:12Especially because you gotta show up, like, every night for people.
09:15And, you know, as exciting as it is, back to back to back to back to back.
09:19Sometimes it gets very non-personal.
09:21Like, you know ...
09:22You just connected?
09:23Yeah, no.
09:24I be connected to whatever, but it's like, everybody's in your business, in a sense,
09:28because, like, I got the security.
09:30It's like, I got my assistance.
09:31When I get there, it's like, everybody who is probably on the other buses, wanting to
09:37see whatever I got going on.
09:38Sometimes I just want to shut down, but then it kind of seems like I'm, like, being a jerk
09:43or something, you know?
09:44That's been, like, probably my only thing on tours.
09:46It's like, I be wanting to be by myself a lot.
09:49Everybody's just ... Sometimes people just get used to coming in my dressing room like,
09:52hey, what are you doing?
09:53It's like, I just don't really want to talk.
09:55This is my first tour where I have the option to pretty much have, like, my two homies
09:58on my bus or, like, be very alone on my bus.
10:01Yeah.
10:02But I'm so ... I don't know.
10:03I feel like I'm going to get, like, FOMO.
10:05Because, like, if all my boys are on the other bus ...
10:07No, that's how I felt.
10:08This is my second tour.
10:09I felt the same way.
10:10I'm like ...
10:10You're just going to pop in.
10:12Pop in.
10:12It's fun.
10:13When you go pop out, pop in.
10:14Right now, I'm like, fuck it.
10:16They're coming on.
10:16But I'm, like, worried that it's going to be, like, one weekend and we're all packed on
10:20the bus together and I'm going to be like, I don't want to talk to anyone at all.
10:25So we'll see how it goes.
10:26But I'm just so used to having them on that, like, I'm afraid to miss out.
10:30It's great to keep the homies around.
10:32When you're on tour, bro, it's like the best marketing, best ...
10:36Everything to promote you.
10:38And your homies can promote or do whatever they're trying to do while they're on the
10:41road with you.
10:42So always just keep that in mind, bro.
10:44This is an opportunity for everybody.
10:45So it's very exciting, you know?
10:47And everybody needs to understand that you are the reason why all this shit is the reason
10:51why it is.
10:52So you need your time, bro.
10:53It gets interesting, too, because, like, when your homies are around, like, you're
10:56like a boss and a friend at the same time.
10:58And that's something I'm kind of learning is, like ...
11:01Man, think about it as just, like, you got responsibilities and people count on you.
11:05Think about it more so as like that than, like, you the boss.
11:08You just got ... people rely on you.
11:11And at the end of the day, bro, you got to do whatever you got to do to get where
11:15you're
11:15going to get.
11:16For sure.
11:16Or none of that would even be a thing.
11:18What I learned when my music started taking off, just don't stop.
11:23Because you never know, like, every song that you create is an asset for yourself.
11:27Every single song you create, everything, whether it's a voice note, whether it's a
11:31one minute song or five minute song, that's an asset, bro.
11:37So, yeah, that's probably, like, the craziest thing I think I learned.
11:41Like, I just didn't want ... That's like, you know, the whole thing about success, like,
11:46it's like, you just got to kind of keep going.
11:48We all, like, none of this is promised for us, like ...
11:51Yeah.
11:52I feel like people get really ... get really cozy at a certain level.
11:57Yeah.
11:57And then they also maybe get two in their head and, like, try to perfect stuff.
12:02Yeah.
12:02And then it's, like, four years, five years, six years, seven years, and it's, like, some
12:06people nail it.
12:06Some people can take a break and just crush it.
12:08And some people, they would have crushed it if they just put out the first, you know,
12:13thing they made.
12:14But then they had to make ten more things, and then it's, like ...
12:16The thing to combat that is what I was telling you earlier about just, like, when you making
12:21that music, just, like, think about that pain.
12:23Like, that stuff that really, like, moves you.
12:26Like, it might have been just one thing somebody said that made you look at them, like, you know,
12:30that's your day going, but shit's still on your brain.
12:33Mm-hmm.
12:33It's that type of thing.
12:34It's like that's a song.
12:35Yeah, it's a song, bro.
12:37We're so lucky to be able to, like, have, like, inconveniences make us art, you know?
12:42Like, some people have inconveniences and it just ruins their day, but we get to, like ...
12:46Actually, like, make something out of it, right?
12:48It's, like, so cool, especially when you perform it.
12:51Because some people, like, really, like, pick up that energy without them, man, not even
12:55knowing your situation.
12:57I see it all the time when I perform.
12:59Like, it'd be a song that I made and it's, like, whatever I'm saying on a song might not
13:04be the actual message that's, like, I'm portraying, but certain people actually get it.
13:10Like, you don't see that.
13:11Like, you know, as you just keep making music and it's, like, more and more clever you get.
13:16And it's cool how, like, people will make, like, their own meaning out of a song, you
13:21know?
13:21Word Up.
13:22I think that's cool, too.
13:23I listen to music for my own pleasure and, like, I take it however I take it, you know?
13:28Like, I listen to a lot of crazy shit and I just be, like, sometimes I go and try to,
13:33like, find out what they made that song for, but sometimes it just relates to my situation
13:39and I just leave it at that.
13:40Yeah, and some people be, like, making songs about nothing and then, like, people make it whatever
13:45they need to make it for themselves.
13:48Right, right.
13:48Pain is pain.
13:49It doesn't matter.
13:50Pain is pain.
13:51Or even just locking in on somebody else's pain, bro.
13:53Like, it's kind of crazy to say, but, like, you might have somebody going through something
13:57and it's, like, how could you, like, capture that situation and explain it to the world for
14:05people who might not have seen that shit before?
14:08There's this one song on my album called I Saw Your Face that I think I made, like, four
14:11different ways.
14:12It probably was, like, two or three months, like, going back and forth to it.
14:15And I thought if a song took that long, it wasn't meant to be.
14:19But I'm now learning, like, there's something beautiful about trying a bunch of shit over it.
14:25Nah, bro, for sure.
14:26For those songs, I'd be taking literally, like, 30 minutes.
14:29I probably took 30 minutes to make E85.
14:31Probably like 20, 30 minutes to make E85.
14:34But it was all energy at that moment.
14:36You feel me?
14:36Man, the longest to make a song that actually went crazy?
14:40I think it went crazy.
14:42Maybe body?
14:43To me, it was, like, a no-brainer thing, right?
14:45You hear the sample.
14:47What I'm saying is hot.
14:49I'm embodying this energy for all the girls around the world who love their body.
14:55So that was, like, okay, that's that, right?
14:57But it didn't have, it's kind of open.
15:01When I say open, like, it don't have a lot of drums in it.
15:05Like, it's kind of like .
15:06Yeah, it's not like too much of a groove.
15:08And I was like, I don't know if this is enough, but it definitely is polarizing for
15:13somebody to just be feeling themselves.
15:14But at the same time, I wanted to have it to where it was just, at least music, it was,
15:22because it was a lot of different things.
15:23I put music into it.
15:24I put drums into it.
15:26And at the end of the day, I just said, I just wanted to be the .
15:30And I left it at that.
15:31That's the thing.
15:31You could try, like, a million different things.
15:33I did, like, one high, and that was it.
15:36And I just thought that was it.
15:37Sometimes being simple is more flattering than having everything on the table.
15:43Sometimes you got to try everything to realize that simple is the best.
15:46I think you got to do that with everything in life, bro.
15:49Like, you got to try everything, bro.
15:51If you don't like it, fuck it.
15:52Let it go.
15:52It's okay if it doesn't work, yeah.
15:53Let it go.
15:54Have you ever, I don't know, I guess like the pressure to release by a certain time,
15:58like, do you feel like you're on a schedule?
16:00Did you ever feel like, damn, I could keep going on this album, but I want to put it out
16:04by this time?
16:05And like, what's that?
16:06No, I always put myself on like my own timer.
16:08Because if I don't, like, I don't know, that just, I just, it just don't seem like I got
16:13my shit together.
16:14Like, I like to put myself on.
16:16Because...
16:16That's how it went with me in this last album.
16:17I was like...
16:18You wanted to put it out?
16:19I wanted to put it out, you know?
16:20And I kind of accepted that and it was beautiful because I was like, I know whatever I do by
16:24this time is what's supposed to come out.
16:26And now I'm trying to find out what that, because I just put an album out.
16:29So I'm like looking at another album and it's so far away from me, not like time-wise.
16:34I just like, there's nothing has come of it, you know?
16:37Obviously I want to make great music and I want to evolve, but I don't know what it means.
16:41Like, I don't know.
16:42I feel like I know I'm going to do it.
16:44I just have no idea how.
16:45I feel like what I do, bro, before I make an album, as soon as I'm done with my album,
16:51first thing I think about is like, what's going to be my creative?
16:54Who am I going to be?
16:56Who is going to tell the story?
16:57But you're not thinking about it while you're making the music.
16:59It's once the music's done?
17:00No, I'm saying like after whatever last album, like after this, after I dropped Octane.
17:04Oh, going into a new album.
17:06Okay.
17:06Yeah, after I dropped Octane, probably like a week later I was like, damn, so what am I
17:09going to do next?
17:10And I just start, I think about the creative and who I'm going to be first.
17:13If I'm telling this story, who am I?
17:16Like that's literally like the first thing I think about.
17:20Then it starts with like, what's going to like, what creatively is going to make me, attach
17:26me to this.
17:27You know what I mean?
17:28And the environment.
17:29I think about all of that first.
17:30That's crazy.
17:31It's like I think of all of that last.
17:33It's kind of, if you think about it, like if you think about the creative and who you're
17:36going to be first, it kind of like tells the story for you.
17:40You know, all you got to do is just make the music off to, yeah.
17:45Did you have the white outfit picked out before you like started making the music where
17:48you're like, I'm going to be in an all white.
17:49Yeah.
17:50So now this album, I was kind of all over the place.
17:52I was like, damn, I want to just like go NASCAR jumpsuit, Octane, NASCAR jumpsuit.
17:57I was like, nah, I don't want to jack that.
17:59I'm going to go like, oh no, like big jumpsuit scientist, but like mad scientist.
18:05And it's kind of like baggy.
18:07Nah, I ain't jacked that.
18:09And then I like put on this all white fit one day and I was like, yo, this Octane.
18:15And I just never stopped.
18:17I just like all white till it's over.
18:20Till it's over.
18:21Yeah.
18:21It just helps me connect the music to something.
18:24Cause when I was like, you just making the music, it's like cool.
18:27But it's like after I make all this music, like, all right, what am I doing?
18:30You know?
18:31What am I for real?
18:32How much are you like showing people in the process?
18:34Like showing people what you're doing while you're doing it.
18:36Sometimes I feel like I just want to go away and like make what it is and be like, here
18:40it is to like all the homies or like the people and then ask for the notes.
18:43But like, sometimes I won't make half a song and I want to like show someone before it's
18:48finished, you know, like I get worried.
18:50Like I don't want too many opinions on what I'm doing while I'm doing it.
18:53Cause I don't want to get like fucked up.
18:55It'll be like, I'll show it to one person and it'll be the only person who has ever heard
18:59it and they have their one opinion.
19:00So I think that's the general opinion, but it's like the next person might be like, that's the
19:04greatest thing I've ever heard.
19:05Or like, I love this part.
19:06So it's like, you can't judge it off of one person.
19:09And so...
19:10That's such a good question.
19:11Now I'm just thinking like, bro, how do you combat that?
19:13Like I always been super like, I would love to play some music for you right now.
19:17I'm confident in my music, but I do ask for answers and, you know, what people think at
19:25times.
19:26So I would say that, I would say that, bro, take criticism and what people say, you know,
19:35with a grain of salt, definitely listen.
19:37It's hard to say like, you have to be confident.
19:39No, I'm not going to say that.
19:41I just want to, I want to say that you have to just, not even just say it.
19:47You just got to love it.
19:48It's kind of hard to say.
19:49I feel like I'm confident, but I'm also sensitive.
19:51Yeah.
19:52So it's like, even if I believe in it, it's just like, I don't know.
19:55It depends on who, you got to play it for the right people.
19:58Sometimes I feel so confident in my, my idea that I'm, I'm like, I shouldn't even allow
20:05anyone to hear it in case they're going to put their spin on it.
20:08Cause I'm like, but then that, I don't know, that's not sustainable.
20:11Cause.
20:12Nah, honestly, I will say, I don't, I don't, I like to play my music for my peers or other
20:19artists, but I don't, some, nowadays days I'll be like, I definitely hold certain stuff.
20:23Yeah.
20:23You know what I'm saying?
20:24Don't be afraid to hold it, bro.
20:26Just hold it.
20:27Nah.
20:27Cause it's just one person, you know?
20:29Cause I'm like, it'll be like, I'll show it to one person and it'll be the only person
20:35who has ever heard it and they have their one opinion.
20:36So I think that's the general opinion, but it's like the next person might be like, that's
20:40the greatest thing I've ever heard.
20:41Or like, I love this part.
20:42So it's like, you can't judge it off of one person.
20:45If you know the recipe for however you want to market that song on the internet, you
20:49can make it.
20:49You can drop a song right now and you might get a million listeners.
20:56And 12 minutes.
20:58And I think it's interesting cause like as fast as people can get a million listeners
21:03in 12 minutes, they can like lose a million listeners in the next 12 minutes.
21:07Yeah.
21:07It's like, so you, I don't know.
21:08It's crazy how quick people can get shit.
21:11And then it's like, okay, cool.
21:13Congrats.
21:13Like, can you keep it up or like what's the, and then cause people just be dropping people
21:18at every second, you know, it's, it's pretty crazy.
21:21I think with that though, it's like, yeah, you can get on, but it's like, it's like you
21:25can make a song and all that can happen, but it's definitely like what you do afterwards.
21:31After that song or whatever happens, there's a whirlwind of other type of, you know, things
21:37you could possibly be doing.
21:38And it's like, you got to make all those right decisions.
21:41And you got to make more good music, you know, like.
21:43Yeah.
21:44That was like a part of the decisions.
21:47That's like one of the things that you have to achieve after you like, it's different.
21:53You know, I, I've been waiting to see like something that just really just super polarizing
21:58to me.
21:58Like, I don't know.
21:59What's your take on like the new generation of music coming in?
22:04Yeah.
22:05I don't really know where it's at.
22:06It feels like we were going back, like what we were talking about earlier.
22:08It's like, it really is just energy.
22:10And it's kind of funny cause it goes back to like, we're talking about movies and we're
22:13like, what type of movies, what type of music?
22:14And it's really like, it's all energy.
22:16All of this stuff, like the hyper, the sad, the emo, the hip hop.
22:23The R&B.
22:24There's all forms of energy in 2026 that we just might've seen before or may have never
22:29seen before.
22:30Yeah.
22:30Yeah.
22:30And also people get so tight on like, I don't know, like everyone's just, we're just in
22:37a circle, like inspiring each other.
22:39You know, the very, very, very most original thing of all time that no one's ever heard.
22:43Like it doesn't exist.
22:44You know, it's like, you can't get technical about like, like every note has been played
22:49like in a song.
22:50Like it's, it's not enough notes for this shit to really be original.
22:53Like, so you just got to get the energy, right?
22:55Like you got to feel it.
22:56It's like, you got to have the pain.
22:57If you don't have the pain, like I'm not buying it probably.
22:59Right.
22:59Right.
22:59It's literally the pain and the technique to make you like, feel like, Hey, this is relatable.
23:05And I believe this guy.
23:06The pain and the technique.
23:08That's the two joints, bro.
23:10The pain and like the technique or however you giving it up when it's time to give up the
23:14pain.
23:14As like a singer, like you ever took like a voice lesson before or like?
23:18Nah, but when I was young, bro, what got me into just singing more was like fifth grade
23:24choir.
23:25Like I tried to like, I tried to see what they were talking about as far as like music.
23:30It was never like, I was never into like writing music or learning how to read music.
23:34Like it was the things we would do after the class, all the other kids who like made music
23:40would go into a room and we would make a beat or fucking rap all day or like that would
23:45kind of like got me more in tune with just being an artist, like being around other people
23:51that just liked the music is because I loved music growing up.
23:54Like when you're on tour, like I'd be losing my voice so much and I'm trying to like learn
23:59how to not lose it.
24:00Like use my voice the right way.
24:02Cause do you ever like go out there?
24:04Cause you, you play like 20 to five songs.
24:06I, you gotta find like, you gotta find like the sweet spot of your voice is gone, but you
24:12still know how to use it.
24:13Yeah.
24:14Like that's just literally like the, the only way I can say it's like.
24:17You gotta like fight through it cause the show has to go on.
24:19The show has to go on.
24:20So it'll be, you just gotta know how to use your voice when it's in that state.
24:24Like you can try to like thick tea it and like preserve and all of these different things.
24:31But at the end of the day, if you're like feeling it and you're going hard and you just
24:34lose your voice, you have to, next day is probably another show.
24:38And you sing, your songs are high.
24:40Yeah.
24:40You like, you like sing them, sing them.
24:42Like you sing with your chest.
24:44Yeah.
24:44I be loving that shit.
24:45But like you said, it takes a toll on you day after day.
24:49Sometimes you just gotta push through a lot of times.
24:52How do you find music?
24:53How do I find music?
24:54Like, like, like, how do you find like crazy, like obscure music?
24:57Like, are you just like surfing Apple?
24:59Honestly, I don't really, I don't really go out there to search too much anymore.
25:03But where I do find the craziest music is like Instagram.
25:06Okay.
25:07Like the craziest music where I was like, damn, thanks.
25:10Give me that.
25:11Just like cause someone posted a photo with it or something?
25:13Oh, story reels, photos.
25:16Yeah.
25:16I'll take it from wherever it comes.
25:18If I hear it, I need it.
25:19Some of these girls on Instagram, like, because like crafting an Instagram post is like such
25:25an important thing.
25:26Like, and it is for everyone, but like, they'd be like so good at it that they like need to
25:30find the perfect song and like their dedication to their craft of finding the perfect song for
25:35their post, honestly, is like a crazy pipeline.
25:38They like nail it.
25:39And then it's like, you know, now you know Donna Summer.
25:42Exactly.
25:43There you go.
25:45Now you know Donna Summer.
25:46It's tough.
25:47Yeah.
25:48Shout out to the, shout out to all those girls.
25:50Like nah, bro.
25:51This girl is jamming.
25:52One Madonna song, bro.
25:53I was like, yo, I heard this before, but I haven't heard this before.
25:57Eat that.
25:59And also it's like, they're just surfing for like the best vibe.
26:01Like they're finding the song for the post.
26:04Like now.
26:04Right.
26:05Right.
26:05Right.
26:06Right.
26:06No, I just seen something off an album that I heard like at least 20 times and never heard
26:11that song.
26:12Give me that.
26:14Samples too.
26:15Works great for samples.
26:16I love these Instagram pages that dedicate to like retro music videos or retro songs.
26:21Sometimes it just hits my feed.
26:23I'm like, yo.
26:25I think I forgot about this.
26:26Do you have to like, when you're, like you don't have to deal with the bullshit of like
26:30clearing samples?
26:30Like people just go and do that for you?
26:32Or are you in the fucking field?
26:34I get in the field if I have to.
26:35You have to step in like the balls.
26:37I would love to.
26:38If I got to talk to somebody, I would love to have a conversation with you about it and
26:41why I need to do this.
26:42Yeah.
26:43But most of the time it's cool.
26:44Me and Charles did this one song in San Francisco, but it was like a flip of, I love to
26:50love you
26:50baby.
26:52I think that's Donna Summers.
26:53I think that is.
26:54I think that is Donna Summers.
26:55That's crazy.
26:56I tried to sample that and she was not having it, but I swear the song I made was crazy.
27:02And you just never got it?
27:03I mean, she did not let it go, bro.
27:05Like Donna, maybe we can make this happen.
27:09Because I really liked, I still love that song.
27:11It's going to go crazy.
27:13But she just wasn't happening in her state.
27:15Her people was not happening.
27:17I really be feeling some way about those samples, bro.
27:19But so now, like if someone ever tries to sample you in the future and you're like,
27:23you're just going to be like, hell yeah.
27:25Because you know how it feels, right?
27:27Yeah.
27:27Depending on if I like you.
27:28I'm not going to lie.
27:29I'm going to be picky.
27:30Oh yeah.
27:30Oh yeah.
27:30Oh yeah.
27:32You trying, you trying, you trying to do that.
27:34Know what I do?
27:35But I might, yeah.
27:36I might have to get your side of the head with it.
27:38I mean, I cleared your sample like, before I like, I heard like, boom, boom.
27:42I was like, yeah, that's good.
27:44You went crazy.
27:44That's tough.
27:45You went crazy.
27:47I appreciate that too.
27:49Yeah.
27:51Yeah.
27:53Your music is super, like you never know which way you're going to go.
27:55And I think that's a product of confidence.
27:59And listening to a lot of, I just grew up listening to it, but it's just, I'm confident
28:03about it.
28:04But I listen to a lot of music, bro.
28:06If I didn't like, like all of that stuff, the old, the new, how drum and bass.
28:16Like I love all of that in some way, in some sense.
28:19It just helps with creating and just blending genres together.
28:25I feel like people get comfortable in something.
28:29Just, I don't know.
28:30Comfortability is like just the killer for people and they get comfortable.
28:34Like they, they paint this picture for themselves.
28:37They don't even let themselves break out of it because like, they're fake.
28:40They're like, oh, this is good.
28:41Yeah.
28:41They're like, oh, I can do this good.
28:43So I will do this.
28:44Sometimes it'll be the people around you too, bro.
28:45Like you gotta really watch it.
28:47Cause it'd be like, some people just like happy and content or whatever you're doing
28:51because it's, it's, it's good for the moment or whatever they got going on.
28:55Cause you're doing it.
28:55But you always want people that's going to possibly take you to that.
28:59Push you to go to that next level.
29:01Cause being in that spot, it gets comfortable, but it's like the music.
29:05I feel like that gets the most play spin or just eyes on it.
29:11It's just stuff that's like mad polarizing, stuff that should sound that you ain't heard.
29:15Different ways of going about the melody and all of this.
29:18It's like, those things are the things that's always going to stick out when it's like time
29:23for somebody to listen to your music.
29:24I got a question.
29:25Cause it's something that I'm dealing with now as you were coming up, like everyone has
29:29an opinion and everything's on the internet.
29:31Like how much did you stay in and out of that?
29:33And like, cause it's, I'm learning, like I've learned to disconnect from it.
29:36Reading shit about yourself is like the most healthy thing.
29:39I disconnected.
29:40When I got to a point in my career, bro, I just hated everything.
29:43Like I just hated whatever somebody said or I just disconnected.
29:49Yeah.
29:49I disconnected.
29:50I stopped getting on those apps where I felt like it just, I don't got none of that.
29:54All I got is Instagram literally.
29:57And I barely just really, I just like to like post on it.
30:00Yeah.
30:00My stories just to let my fans and people-
30:02You were fishing on your stories?
30:03Yeah.
30:04Just let my fans and people know like, Hey, I'm here and we're doing shit.
30:07You just got to really like limit it.
30:09I've been, I've been off it and it's like, it's, it's been like a blessing.
30:12It like forced you to get off it.
30:13And you're like, Oh wow.
30:13Like life is so sick with-
30:15Yeah.
30:15Like when you're not all the way on-
30:17Cause you live in real life and you really Malcolm.
30:19So it's like the end of the day, like people saying all that, bro, it's like, you're blessed
30:24to even like, you know, we so blessed to do this type of shit.
30:27Like cameras just running.
30:28Like it's a blessing.
30:30So after this one, me and Malcolm going to the studio.
30:33I can do it all.
30:34I'm down.
30:34Justin Timberlake Senorita.
30:37I'm following your lead, bro.
30:38You feel me?
30:41Yeah.
30:42I love Justin.
30:43Shout out to Timberlake.
30:44We're going to be swinging our hips in the studio.
30:47Nah, you going crazy.
30:49Ayo.
30:51I want to be fucking break dancing in there.
30:53Hell yeah.
30:54I know my fan base was like, Malcolm Todd.
30:55And this fan base was like, Don Tolerate.
30:57Yeah.
30:57That's dope though.
30:58That's the type of shit that needs to happen more, honestly.
31:01You got to just be wanting, as an artist, you got to want to just lock in and like dibble
31:06and dabble in with things that you don't do on the norm.
31:10I feel like that's what makes the music interesting, bro.
31:12You know?
31:13If you're just good at whatever you do and you're just that artist, cool.
31:16But it's fun.
31:17Like this guy is talented as hell.
31:19He playing guitar.
31:20He be singing, swagging.
31:21Like, why not?
31:23We make a movie.
31:24I think more people got to think about it like that than just being so stuck on whatever
31:28they feel like is working for them.
31:30You want to dab me up?
31:33We out.
31:34Get too.