01:00And what can an £82 million deficit mean for next year's budget?
01:03Our local democracy reporter Megan Shaw has more.
01:06An unexceptional cabinet meeting from Medway Council confirming that further exceptional government support is not off the table.
01:15Medway Council has already used over £60 million in EFS.
01:20That's exceptional financial support from the government to help cover day-to-day spending over the last three years.
01:27But there might be more to come.
01:29The Unitary Authority expects a £360 million shortfall over the next five years
01:35and is expected to overspend an additional £26 million by the end of this financial year.
01:41When we're spending £1.35 million every single day on effectively three services,
01:47adult social care, children's services and temporary accommodation,
01:51the vast majority of Medway residents, thankfully, don't have to access those services.
01:57They are accessed by a relatively small amount, but the impact is great across our community.
02:01This year's budget implemented controversial income generation strategies like higher car park tariffs and hiking up council tax.
02:10Could we see these again?
02:12As always, we'll be looking as we move towards February at all of the options.
02:16So nothing's off the table yet.
02:18We'll always be looking at the options that we do on a regular basis.
02:21But former Conservative turned party trailblazer Andrew Lawrence is more wary.
02:26It's not £60 million to buy things, it's £60 million to balance the books.
02:30And the long-term projection for the next couple of years is another couple of hundred million.
02:35It's just out of control.
02:38Years of financial struggles and government support might be one thing,
02:42but in Medway, are residents bothered by that?
02:45And importantly, can they feel those years of financial shortfall?
02:49I think life carries on as normal in Medway.
02:52We don't really see the impact of the shortfall.
02:56I mean, the whole country's in debt.
02:59Obviously, eventually, we've got to cut our cloth according to what we can afford.
03:03I think there's elements of it you can see on the street in the sense of some of the cleanliness
03:07of the street.
03:08It doesn't seem to be as looked after as maybe it would be if they had the funds.
03:13We cancelled all the bins being emptied on a Sunday,
03:17which means the foxes get into all the detritus that's left on a Saturday night.
03:22And in the Castle Browns alone, it just looks like a tip.
03:25Medway Council's in a really difficult situation.
03:29One costs are actually going up.
03:31Government put more and more responsibilities on local authorities.
03:35It doesn't actually provide any extra money.
03:37But residents will need to wait until February to see if they'll be facing the brunt of the deficit.
03:44Megan Shaw in Medway.
03:47And with me now is Councillor Andrew Lawrence, leader of the new Medway First Party,
03:52and Labour's Councillor Mark Jones, both members of Medway Council.
03:56Now, Mark, I have to start with you there.
03:58We saw in that report the leader of your council promised exceptional financial support wouldn't be needed for another year.
04:04How can people trust an administration that breaks their promise?
04:10We're in a situation, as Councillor Maple said, where we've got to deliver adult social care,
04:19children's services, temporary accommodation support,
04:25and the financial circumstances of a country, international issues, that sort of thing,
04:30have an effect on things like borrowing costs.
04:34We have to deliver those services.
04:37And at the end of the day, we're trying to find new ways of working,
04:42new ways of delivering things like adult social care, more independent living,
04:46but we have to pay for things like private placements and what have you.
04:52And, you know, children with special educational needs need to be looked after.
04:58We've made representations to the government for more support.
05:03But you said you wouldn't.
05:04You said you wouldn't be asking for that extra support.
05:08As I say, the situation is ongoing in terms of the difficulties of borrowing,
05:15the Iraq war, international events.
05:18It may seem odd when people are talking about empty litter bags
05:23and that sort of thing to be commenting on these issues.
05:26But the fact of the matter is we do have the wider international issues
05:30and the effect of those to consider.
05:34Well, the Chartered Institute of Public Finance Accounting said earlier this year
05:38that you have been making efforts to improve your financial sustainability.
05:42But clearly, at the moment, things aren't sustainable the way they're going
05:46with the millions of pounds of difference that's going to be next year, the gap.
05:51As I say, we're looking at better ways of working, more independent living.
05:57In cases of children, we try to have special education needs facilities in pupil units
06:05or nearer to homes as we're not spending money on out-of-county placements and what have you.
06:10We're always looking for new ways of working.
06:13And anybody that's got ideas, we will listen.
06:16If Andrew has got a solution to these issues, you know, we'll hear what he has to say.
06:23Oh, he's laughing. What do you think?
06:24Well, I mean, unfortunately for Mark, he's here to defend the indefensible.
06:28You're absolutely right.
06:29Since January 2024, Vince has been saying,
06:32don't worry, it's all right, we're getting there, we're getting there.
06:35Then they call in SIPPA and that was supposed to be the shield
06:38that would give them the cover that they're actually making progress.
06:42But the reality is, after the Cabinet meeting on Tuesday,
06:45which was an absolute... I just sit in there open mouth.
06:49It's everyone else's fault.
06:51There is no accountability.
06:52And it's only 60 million quid.
06:54You know, not that it's not costing us three million pounds a year
06:57to finance that debt, let alone pay it back.
07:01You know, to put it into context,
07:02this council's got to refinance 150 million pounds of debt this year.
07:06But you were part of the Conservatives, though.
07:07Didn't you pass on that deficit originally?
07:09No, because I wasn't elected in the previous administration.
07:11I was elected in 2023.
07:12So I'm here as a councillor.
07:15When I became a councillor, there was no deficit,
07:19there was no emergency financial support.
07:21What we now have is probably three, four, five years of emergency financial support
07:26and no plan to get us out of it.
07:28I've got a bit of a theory here.
07:30I actually think the Labour group were going to carry on the way they're going
07:34because local government reorganisation was coming along
07:37and at that point it would be someone else's problem,
07:39i.e. this new North Kent authority.
07:41And it's not the Iran war that's the problem.
07:44It's the way we fund local government.
07:47And the really worrying thing is,
07:49and I'm going to be raising this with the leader at the next four council meeting,
07:53is Andy Burnham wants to take even more money away from the south-east
07:56and redistribute it to the north.
07:59What's that going to do for our financial position?
08:01What do you say to that?
08:03Well, of course, we get to see what is in the Chancellor's budget in a few weeks' time
08:08and, you know, Andrew's crystal ball is just as good as mine.
08:12But I say that, as I said before,
08:15if Andrew has got ideas as to how we deal with this issue,
08:20you know, if he's going to be able to manage all these things,
08:25keep parking charges down, keep borrowing down and all that sort of thing,
08:29how is he going to balance the books?
08:31So he has to come up with ideas and solutions to these issues.
08:38And we're working very hard, contrary to what Andrew says,
08:41the Labour and Co-op group are working very hard to try and balance the books.
08:46Yeah, well, it's a massive E-minus for effort
08:49and E-minus for results, Mark, unfortunately.
08:52I mean, the bottom line here is it appears to me
08:55that Vince Maple has zero credibility with national government.
09:00He's been ignored on local government reorganisation.
09:03And if he's making representations to get more money into Medway, he's being ignored again.
09:08So I'm just wondering, you know, whether we need to open an office Medway in the north
09:12so we're closer to where government now is in order to gain any leverage.
09:18Let's put this money into context.
09:20The £60 million requires to pay that, to get that back to a zero position.
09:25Not pay it back, just a zero balance.
09:27We've got to raise council tax by 30%.
09:30That's the thing.
09:31And I think people out there don't realise that this is money that's being borrowed on their behalf
09:37and they're going to have to pay it back.
09:40That's the key.
09:41Unless the government stump up this £60 million in extra grant, that's the reality.
09:48Well, the audience who are watching now, they might be listening to this and thinking,
09:52what is this going to do to my pocket?
09:54I mean, Vince didn't rule out the income generating policies going forward.
09:59Will they be hiking up parking charges?
10:02Will he be raising council tax again?
10:04What's his plan?
10:06There are no easy solutions to all this.
10:08If anybody comes along and says, you know, we can keep parking charges as they are
10:13and keep other charges as they are and still balance the budget.
10:17On Andrew's council tax predictions, our reckoning certainly isn't 30%.
10:25At the moment in the figures that came to Cabinet, the budget is for a 3% increase.
10:31But that's a prediction, not a certainty.
10:34Obviously, we'll have to look at that as the time comes.
10:36But it's no use frightening people.
10:39Andrew says, I'm blaming everybody else.
10:42He seems to be blaming Councillor Maple for all this.
10:46At the end of the day, people have got to come up with answers
10:49as to how we are going to manage the pressures in things like adult social care,
10:56children's services, paying for placements for people, all these things.
11:01We're trying to come up with new ways of working.
11:03We're trying to come up with solutions to those.
11:05Let's put 3% in context.
11:083% is £6 million.
11:10So if council tax goes up 3%, that's £6 million.
11:14That's not even the rate of inflation.
11:16So all of that money being collected will be going to just continuing services
11:21and to pay the inflation on those services, staff pay rises.
11:24The only way Medway Labor are going to get out of this problem
11:27is for the government to write a very, very large cheque
11:30because they have shown themselves incapable of solving the problems.
11:33It's all very well for Mark to ask me for my ideas.
11:36I'm a single councillor who doesn't have the full weight of the council machine behind him.
11:42We're here, and I'm saying, Mark, what is the plan?
11:45Tell the people watching this show what is the plan
11:48to deal with the £60 million budget deficit that's been accrued so far
11:52plus the money that's likely to be accrued in the next couple of years
11:55because you cannot hide behind local government reorganisation.
11:59Now, if you haven't got a plan, don't criticise anyone else.
12:02Go away, get a plan and come and sell it.
12:04Right, we just have to cut you off there so we can go to a break.
12:07Thank you so much, guys.
12:09So we have time for, but join us after this break.
