Thursday - Dance - 2026 Skate Canada International - Practices

Name: Thursday - Dance - 2026 Skate Canada International - Practices
Uploaded: 2026-10-29T21:41:07+00:00
Duration: 1 h 19 min 14 s
Channel: SkateCanada PatinageCanada

00:00:00From Italy, Noemi Maria Talley and Noah LaFornada.

00:00:06From the United States of America, Una Brown and Gage Brown.

00:00:12From the United States of America, Caroline Green and Michael Parsons.

00:00:18And from the United States of America, Katerina Wolf-Kosten and Dmitry Tcharevsky.

00:00:26Welcome back everyone to Kelowna in week number two on the Senior Grand Prix.

00:00:30The Ice Dance have taken to the ice for their warm-up and their practice session.

00:00:35I'm Ted Barton along with Joni McPhail and Jackie Wong.

00:00:38We have just seen the women's event and the pairs event.

00:00:42And now we are entering the dance world.

00:00:45And how interesting it is, Jackie, that there have been a number of teams that have sort of switched partners

00:00:50and whatnot.

00:00:50It's going to be fascinating throughout the year to see how that has worked out.

00:00:53Yeah, and none of them here.

00:00:55These are all teams that have been together for a while, which is nice to see also.

00:01:02Three American teams, a variety of different costumes.

00:01:06So we're going to see both rhythm dances and free dances in this group.

00:01:11Well, you can see the three American teams here.

00:01:15Give us sort of a summary of what you can expect in nationals.

00:01:20Ooh, okay.

00:01:21I'm going right to it.

00:01:22I see three American flags.

00:01:24I'm going there.

00:01:24The big thing here is I think there's a lot of intrigue over, you know, three spots for Worlds.

00:01:30And there are really, I think, four teams going for it.

00:01:34Zyngers, Kolesnik, Carrera, Ponmarinco.

00:01:38Neither of them are here, obviously.

00:01:39But the other two are here.

00:01:41Una Brown, Gage Brown, and Caroline Green, Michael Parsons.

00:01:45The Browns beat Green and Parsons earlier in the season, but that was also because of a big deal

00:01:54because Green and Parsons had a big mistake in their rhythm dance.

00:01:59So interesting to see how they do here on a Grand Prix event and also if they both skate clean,

00:02:07how they kind of stack up against each other.

00:02:09So there's really a competition in a competition, right?

00:02:12Especially for those from the same country.

00:02:14I don't mean just in dance, also in the women's.

00:02:17Yes.

00:02:17And for Canada, same thing with men.

00:02:19So, yeah.

00:02:20And also with a lot of these countries, the relative placements of skaters on the Grand Prix

00:02:28do also then are taken into account for, you know, World Championship spots and those kinds of things.

00:02:38Now, Johnny, you mentioned a little earlier that this might be, not might be, I guess is,

00:02:42the only discipline that they wear their competitive outfit, or mostly, it looks like it,

00:02:47their competitive outfit in practice.

00:02:49Why is that?

00:02:53You're stumped by that question.

00:02:55Come on.

00:02:56I don't know.

00:02:58I think it has a, I think when they're skating the program, I think it's a whole package out here.

00:03:03Yeah.

00:03:04So, I think that it has a lot to do with what they're skating to and wanting to get the

00:03:09whole look and feel of everything out there.

00:03:12It might be a comfort thing.

00:03:14Yeah, it could be comfort.

00:03:15It could be a comfort thing.

00:03:17There is a lot about the packaging and the theatricality of Ice Dance that, you know,

00:03:24just kind of require them to do it.

00:03:26And frankly, it's a little bit of peacocking in some ways.

00:03:29A little bit?

00:03:30He's being very...

00:03:31I know.

00:03:32I'm so polite.

00:03:32A whole lot of it.

00:03:35I mean, it's interesting to see the, probably the quirkiest team of the bunch here, Leparia, Rousseau,

00:03:42not skating in outfit.

00:03:45They're in practice gear today, but everybody else is.

00:03:50Question, Jackie.

00:03:51If you could change one rule in Ice Dance, what would it be?

00:03:56If I could change one rule in Ice Dance, what would it be?

00:03:58I'll give you more, but let's go with one.

00:04:04I would bring back more of the Pattern Dance.

00:04:07Okay.

00:04:08Interesting.

00:04:08You know, we spent four years without a compulsory pattern.

00:04:12There was a Pattern Dance involved in the Rhythm Dance, but it was one that each skater made up or

00:04:19each team made up, right?

00:04:21So there was no compulsory.

00:04:24Here we have half of a Golden Waltz that has been brought back for this Rhythm Dance.

00:04:31And so what you can see is the side-by-sides of how everybody does, which I like, and, you

00:04:38know, I would frankly want to see more of it.

00:04:41It's a tiny little bit of comparing apples to apples because everybody's required to do the same thing on the

00:04:48same beat, the same timing, and you can compare it side by side.

00:04:53Whereas there's nothing else in Ice Dance that you, you can, it's all, it's all individual and interpretive, but, and

00:05:04I know there's elements that can be judged side by side, but there's also so many variations in those.

00:05:09But there's something about doing the compulsory dances that is...

00:05:19And we start with their clown program, their, their rhythm dance.

00:05:25Talk a lot about the Golden Waltz today.

00:05:35I think of the two programs they have this season so far, this has been the one that is most

00:05:40them and that the one that they're most comfortable with so far.

00:06:04Have you ever judged skating?

00:06:06I have.

00:06:07And what disciplines?

00:06:08Uh, singles.

00:06:09Singles.

00:06:10Only singles.

00:06:12Which discipline do you feel or think is the most difficult to judge?

00:06:17Ice Dance.

00:06:18There you go.

00:06:18By far.

00:06:20By far.

00:06:22That's kind of why I was asking what rule changes.

00:06:25Like, is there something to simplify the process of judging and for the audience to understand, but still retaining, you

00:06:32know, Ice Dance.

00:06:33So tough.

00:06:34Yeah.

00:06:36Everybody talks about things, but they, no one has an answer to making it clearer.

00:06:41I mean, and Ice Dance has changed so much under the IJS too, right?

00:06:46Like, it was very much the Wild West when it was without IJS.

00:06:50And then it became this sort of algorithmic thing for a very long time.

00:06:54And they're trying to find the right balance.

00:06:57Yeah.

00:06:57You don't want to see all the same lifts all the time, right?

00:07:02I mean, we're talking about comparing apples to apples.

00:07:04Like, those are the things you don't want to be comparing apples to apples.

00:07:07No.

00:07:08No, that's true.

00:07:09Absolutely.

00:07:11But you also want to make it, well, it's always enjoyable to watch and so different, but understandable to the

00:07:20fans watching and people watching as to why people are getting marked higher on things, whereas...

00:07:25Whoops, down there.

00:07:26Those twizzles were...

00:07:27Sorry.

00:07:27Go ahead.

00:07:27No, I was just going to say, like, jumps and spins and things go and lifts, you can kind of

00:07:31get that.

00:07:32Yeah.

00:07:32But down there's a little bit more nuanced to what's better than...

00:07:36Jackie, what do you think that networks, or just basic coverage, even with RISU stuff, can do for in production

00:07:44to make it more...

00:07:47How do I put this?

00:07:50Understandable, perhaps, with Ice Dance, so it's not such a mystery?

00:07:52I mean, I think some of the more, you know, like the Golden Waltz, for example, there are certain parts

00:08:00of the Golden Waltz that are judged for a level.

00:08:04And if you are seeing those same ones every single time, from every single skater, as to, like, whether they're

00:08:13hitting their Choctaw or whether they're hitting their bracket or their open Mohawk, right?

00:08:19Like, that is a way for you to understand that a little bit more.

00:08:23So how would they do that?

00:08:25How would the network do that?

00:08:27The slow-mos afterwards.

00:08:28Okay, so you're talking replays.

00:08:29Yeah, replays.

00:08:30So show the same replay of that portion, which is one of the things that we do sometimes on the

00:08:34Junior Grand Prix, but we think, well, maybe is that too boring, doing this, you know...

00:08:39Right, I mean, I think that people...

00:08:40And Mark does a great job of analyzing it, but then you're going...

00:08:43Yeah.

00:08:44Mark's a nice dancer.

00:08:45Yeah, I know.

00:08:47Mark is a everything.

00:08:49He was a pair skater, he was a single skater, he was a nice dancer, like, he knows all of

00:08:52it.

00:08:55Okay, this program is musically incredibly impactful.

00:08:59And late entry.

00:09:00Yeah.

00:09:08It's the red violin.

00:09:18Wow.

00:09:19Just beautiful transition into that dance.

00:09:21Incredible, yeah.

00:09:24Fabulous positions.

00:09:32Just one of the things that we don't talk about dance spins very much, because it's hard to compare across,

00:09:38but one of the features of the dance spin that I think is, it sets people apart, is the speed

00:09:47of rotation and how centered they are.

00:09:50And we don't talk about that enough in coverage of the sport.

00:09:56The speed of rotation is not measurable, or it is, but we don't measure it.

00:10:01Yeah.

00:10:01We eyeball it.

00:10:02Yeah.

00:10:06There's a one-foot sequence.

00:10:09There's a discussion opening on, at what points can you bring AI in to standardize those things?

00:10:17Can and should.

00:10:19Exactly.

00:10:20I mean, those tools and resources are becoming more and more available and developing.

00:10:26I mean, at the same time, I also don't want this to be like a, who can spin the fastest?

00:10:30Right?

00:10:31Like, that's not, that's not how I watch skating.

00:10:36Yeah.

00:10:37But it's the same as watching in person and on TV, because you do sometimes lose how much coverage a

00:10:42jump is, or how fast a spin is, or when a spin is traveling, and you lose those things.

00:10:52All right, the, the perils of, the perils of that outside, forward outside twizzle, we've already seen the first two

00:11:03teams have issues with it.

00:11:05Although, I love the, theirs, Tali LaFernara's, their second set of twizzles, they come out forward, and that's so much

00:11:15harder to do, to get the control of coming out on a forward outside edge.

00:11:37So, this team's also interesting with the story of their season.

00:11:40They were on the Grand Prix alternates list at the very top for a while, and then all of a

00:11:47sudden, somebody dropped out.

00:11:48They got Skate America, and then this week, the Mirazeks dropped out, and they got this, this competition very late.

00:11:54So, they went from no Grand Prixs to two within a matter of two weeks.

00:12:00And very close.

00:12:00Very close.

00:12:06But, you know, that's a gift.

00:12:08Maybe not for the moment that they compete, because who knows they'll be good, but for their journey.

00:12:13Yeah.

00:12:14Because this team is new to seniors somewhat, so they need this experience, good or bad, they need them.

00:12:21I think they've got, they've got a lot of potential, these two.

00:12:24Yeah, they do, they do, yeah.

00:12:29Solid skating, they both have good power.

00:12:32They were junior world champions in 2025.

00:12:35Yeah.

00:13:09That is impact, I will say.

00:13:11That last lift was, it was, it was original, it worked with the music, great coverage.

00:13:25And the brother-sister team from the United States, as you talked about being one of those teams that are

00:13:31challenging for podiums in, at U.S. nationals, nationals, pardon me.

00:13:37And here.

00:13:38Yes.

00:13:42Billy Joel medley, or something's going on.

00:13:45Yeah.

00:13:56There's a, there's a thumb drive being given to the music operators.

00:14:01Which is almost old technology now.

00:14:03I know.

00:14:04Everything is usually uploaded.

00:14:05Yeah.

00:14:08My guess, I literally don't know if this is Billy Joel or not.

00:14:14I'm not a Billy Joel fan.

00:14:16Yeah, this is Billy Joel.

00:14:17Well, no, this, this current track that they're playing, is this like an old cut of the music?

00:14:22Yeah, it could be.

00:14:22Or is it completely the wrong cut of the music?

00:14:24I don't know.

00:14:38It's, the fact that their coach, Joel, had the thumb drive ready, meant that they were probably expecting this to

00:14:47happen.

00:14:47Or questioning.

00:14:48Yeah, because you have to upload your music every single time you go to a competition, and sometimes the database

00:14:57doesn't get updated.

00:14:58Yeah.

00:15:05That is definitely not the right music.

00:15:07Nope.

00:15:14Oh, interesting.

00:15:16Okay, so I think they ended with this, with this track in the first competition.

00:15:21Oh, then they switched it.

00:15:22Yeah, they switched it.

00:15:23I think.

00:15:35So the composition of this rhythm dance already is very interesting, because you saw them basically, like usually you get,

00:15:42you get the teams sort of, you do maybe like 20 seconds, 30 seconds of choreography, and then you get

00:15:48into the elements.

00:15:50They, they just went straight into their step sequence.

00:15:54Yeah, so the research I have is this one, only the good die young, and then followed by Piano Man.

00:16:00So I guess they had just simply maybe felt more comfortable with this starting.

00:16:10Well, the Piano Man is certainly their waltz.

00:16:21And then what you'll see on this golden waltz is the woman will hold that outside edge, and that's the

00:16:28start of it.

00:16:30And then you'll see that the first two key points were right there with the Choctaws.

00:16:36We'll see more of these, so it'll be easier to watch later on.

00:16:39But then there's a series of rotating three turns, and then another series of rotating three turns.

00:16:49And then the third and fourth key points are right here, where she does a bracket and he does a

00:16:53Mohawk.

00:16:58Interesting to watch that one, because they definitely, from this vantage point, slowed down quite a bit in the second

00:17:06half of that golden waltz.

00:17:09So that's the kind of thing that you'll see have an impact on the grades of execution.

00:17:34Creative dance element.

00:17:37The improved version of the rhythmic sequence, I will say.

00:17:41I think I do, I have enjoyed the creative dance element more than I did with the rhythmic sequences.

00:17:53Okay.

00:17:54Also would like to talk about, or, thoughts on brother-sister teams.

00:17:58Oh, that's a fall.

00:18:01That never happens.

00:18:02I looked away for a second.

00:18:04A second.

00:18:07Thoughts on brother-sister teams.

00:18:08I, I, I think it depends on, on how they mesh.

00:18:13Um, I do think having a brother-sister team pushes a team to do things differently.

00:18:23Differently.

00:18:24And, and have, have to innovate in choreography.

00:18:27Um, and I think the Browns have done a really good job of that.

00:18:31Um, you know, you, you don't have the sort of typical heteronormative romantic thing that goes on.

00:18:38And that, that closes a lot of doors.

00:18:41Okay.

00:18:42Speaking of typical romantic heterosexual, heterogromantic things.

00:18:47Um, this is not, this is definitely not one of those.

00:18:50We are doing Hamilton here.

00:18:54And Caroline Burr, Caroline Burr.

00:18:56Caroline Green is Aaron Burr.

00:18:59And Michael Parsons is Alexander Hamilton.

00:19:05They have had twizzle issues all season.

00:19:08And we're good to go here.

00:19:14A little tentative, but.

00:19:15The cool way we have it, the cool way we have it.

00:19:19The cool way we have it.

00:19:21They have been kept across the cool way we have it, the cool way we have it.

00:19:25The cool way we have it, the cool way we have it.

00:19:26Last time.

00:19:29Alright, here we go.

00:19:31Let's see this edge again.

00:19:34Edge, edge.

00:19:37Choctaws.

00:19:38Those are the Golden Walls to first two key points.

00:19:53Back edge, rotating three turns again.

00:20:00And there you go.

00:20:06So watching those two patterns, the Browns and then Green and Parsons,

00:20:11there's the Green and Parsons pattern covered more lobing and edging than the Browns did on that one

00:20:20and didn't lose as much speed coming down the ice.

00:20:23The interesting thing about the Golden Waltz that we're doing with this rhythm dance

00:20:29is that the pattern itself is not set.

00:20:34Yeah, it's open.

00:20:35Yeah, the steps are set.

00:20:38But the way that you do it is different for every single team.

00:20:43And oftentimes you see the teams that will go more into lobes

00:20:49are the ones who generally can get greater amounts of power and speed into it.

00:20:59So it sounds to me like you should be judging dance.

00:21:02No, I am nowhere near enough to do that.

00:21:06I got my patterns down.

00:21:08Yeah.

00:21:10I love their creative dance element.

00:21:13I think this is one of the best ones of the season.

00:21:16I love their creative dance element.

00:21:38I think this is one of the best ones of the season.

00:21:39How much do you think it matters for not a skating person, geek, but just a basic fan?

00:21:47Yeah.

00:21:48How important is it for them to understand why one team beat another?

00:21:51I mean, it's so important.

00:21:53But how do they do that in dance?

00:21:54You don't.

00:21:55Yeah, okay.

00:21:56But that's my point.

00:21:57It's unfortunate because it's hard to understand the differences unless there is a visible error

00:22:04because a lot of these are so subtle in terms of just like, oh, it's the turn of an edge

00:22:12or if it's whatever.

00:22:13It wasn't clean.

00:22:13Yeah.

00:22:14And even in real time, it's hard to see.

00:22:50I always like a nice black swan, swan lake.

00:22:56There's a one-foot turns.

00:22:58This season with the one-foots, there were a couple of changes to what can and cannot do.

00:23:05A third of it has to be in hold, and then you can't finish on a twizzle.

00:23:10And it is probably the most difficult technical element in Ice Dance that has a lower level.

00:23:16Like it does not get to the level four.

00:23:18Yeah.

00:23:19You know, it usually is a level two maybe.

00:23:21Maybe three out of the outstanding have never seen, at least in what I've seen, level fours, by both.

00:23:27The level fours just require you to do basically every single turn correctly.

00:23:31Yeah.

00:23:32And it's tough.

00:23:34And oftentimes, it's either going to be your bracket or your counter.

00:23:40That's going to be the issue.

00:24:02Would you say there was more changes, rule changes this year than in years past?

00:24:07I don't think so.

00:24:08No?

00:24:09I don't think so.

00:24:10I think there were some major ones that happened this season.

00:24:13Maybe that's why it stood out.

00:24:15That make it feel like that there were.

00:24:17You know, every four years, they're always trying to recalibrate what it looks like.

00:24:23They don't want to do it during the Olympic cycle.

00:24:25And so, it's sort of like all the things that are bottled up for four years.

00:24:28I think there were some major changes that were being considered that have been put on the shelf for a

00:24:37while.

00:24:37Yeah.

00:24:39I mean, whether it's on the shelf or completely in the trash can, we don't know.

00:24:43There's a lot of proposals of changes.

00:24:47And research.

00:24:48So, define for me what you consider, because it's used, the terms used often, that turn wasn't clean.

00:24:54Define me why it wasn't clean.

00:24:58So, what we saw last season on the Grand Prix was that the cleanliness of turns not only had to

00:25:07do with the edge that you go into versus the edge that you ride out of,

00:25:12but it also had to do with what edge you are on in the immediacy right before and after the

00:25:20turn, if that makes sense.

00:25:22Isn't that the into and the out of?

00:25:24No, because when you go into a turn, you can hop, you can sort of get onto the toe pick

00:25:34of the turn right before you turn in such a way where you then go onto a flat.

00:25:40But, um, versus if you were just looking at the edge before you turn versus the edge after you turn,

00:25:48it's, it's, it's very subtle the way that they were looking at it.

00:25:51My final question to you is how accurate do you think that the technical panel, not personal, you know, how

00:25:56accurate can they be when these turns are in different places of the ice with only one camera?

00:26:00Oh, I don't think they can be.

00:26:02So, so that, so the cleanliness of those turns can be, you know, okay, we understand the definition, but they

00:26:10can really vary.

00:26:11Yes, absolutely.

00:26:11Okay.

00:26:12Yeah.

00:26:12Um, the one camera thing kills me.

00:26:15I, I can't, the, you can't do it.

00:26:16You can't do more than one though, but you don't have the time to do the one.

00:26:20Absolutely.

00:26:20But it would be more.

00:26:21Absolutely.

00:26:21Um, I mean, it's the same thing with, with single skating too, when you're talking about edge calls and those

00:26:26things, you have one camera and like all of these choreographers know where to put these things.

00:26:33Cause they know where that camera is going to be.

00:26:34There's a reason why the brackets are always the farthest thing away from, from the camera because they, you don't

00:26:41want it to be seen.

00:26:42So then my question goes to, okay, we've come to the point where we have a definition of clean turns

00:26:48and then we understand that depending on where it is on the ice, it's really impossible to say exactly what

00:26:54was really clean.

00:26:55Does AI play any part of that?

00:26:57If it could, no matter where they do it on the ice to, with the definition written as to exactly

00:27:04what was clean, could it play a role?

00:27:06Um, I think that's, it's interesting.

00:27:08We've seen AI and other sports, like for example, in tennis, um, for calling whether or not a ball is

00:27:15out and there's still, there's still a bit of the understanding of when the ball hits the ground and how

00:27:23the physics of the ball works with the hitting of it onto the ground.

00:27:29I don't think the technology is taking into account and, um, I think that would be the same with, with

00:27:37skating where, uh, it's telling you what it's seeing, but it's not necessarily telling you what it's doing, if that

00:27:48makes sense.

00:27:49Like there, there's a whole thing about weight distribution and, um, and, and sort of when you're, you're, when you're

00:27:57on the ice, when you're not on the ice, those sorts of things that I don't know if AI is

00:28:01allowed, uh, able to tell us.

00:28:03In relation to turns?

00:28:04In relation to turns.

00:28:05What about in relation to jumps?

00:28:08And in relation to jumps.

00:28:09Yeah.

00:28:10Okay.

00:28:10And I would think would be closer to telling if a jump has come out on an edge or on

00:28:14a quarter or where on the ice that blade has hit.

00:28:17Right.

00:28:18So my question to you would be, are you okay then with the subjectivity that we currently have?

00:28:23Because without AI, we're going to still be subjective.

00:28:25We're still going to be wrong some of the times and right some of the times, but it is what

00:28:29it is.

00:28:29I, I, I, I don't know if you can say AI is completely objective either.

00:28:34It's, it's ultimately a, um, a way of.

00:28:39Well, I can say for sure the, the, the technical panel is not going to be, I can, I can

00:28:43say for sure.

00:28:43Yeah.

00:28:44That's for sure.

00:28:44Right.

00:28:44We can't say for sure with AI because we don't, we haven't applied it yet.

00:28:47Right.

00:28:47Exactly.

00:28:48So until we see it.

00:28:49Right.

00:28:50So, so I know you're going to be wrong and I might be.

00:28:53Yeah.

00:28:54Yeah.

00:28:55Yeah.

00:28:57Yeah.

00:28:58It's a, it's a.

00:28:59No, it's just an interesting discussion because I think, you know, this is where the investigation

00:29:03and the effort is being made by the ISU to find out, can this help?

00:29:07Yeah.

00:29:07And, you know, then they have to define the parameters around how that's going to be measured

00:29:12and making sure it's consistent.

00:29:14So if it is, if it can be consistent on every inch of that ice.

00:29:17Yeah.

00:29:18Okay, good.

00:29:18Good.

00:29:19Now they may choose not to do it.

00:29:20Let's just stay with the humans.

00:29:21That's all good.

00:29:21Right.

00:29:22I don't mind either way.

00:29:23That's other people's calls, but I'm just interested in the discussion.

00:29:26I do think that the, the, um, what they're saying right now is we're using, we're, we're

00:29:33testing AI as a way of allowing the panel to have another data point by which they can

00:29:41then judge levels and whatnot.

00:29:45And I, that I'm, I'm good with, right?

00:29:47Like the, the providing.

00:29:51But they're giving the opportunity to human to ignore the data.

00:29:54Well, if you're, if, if, if you are a, then why have a panel person, you shouldn't have

00:29:59the, you, you, you, you shouldn't be ignoring it.

00:30:03You, if you are, if you're a good technical person, you should not be ignoring the data.

00:30:07But you're allowing them to do it.

00:30:09You are.

00:30:09Yeah.

00:30:10Yeah.

00:30:10So I don't know.

00:30:12It doesn't make sense to me.

00:30:12Then don't do it.

00:30:13The thought experiment, the thought experiment of the whole thing.

00:30:16Yeah.

00:30:16Anyways, there's lots.

00:30:17Oh, there's so many debate issues we can get.

00:30:19No, it's great.

00:30:19But ignoring the data or calling a replay or not calling it or like.

00:30:23It's fine.

00:30:23It's, it's, it's very similar to the development of the judging system because we understood

00:30:30that although there are more tools, there was replay, there was high definition, there

00:30:34was slow motion, there's all those types of things that came in.

00:30:36It didn't perfect the final judgment.

00:30:39What it did is gave more information for them.

00:30:41And it was still very, had element of subjectivity, but less.

00:30:44Right.

00:30:44So can AI add, can, can it reduce that, the amount of subjectivity, not eliminate it necessarily,

00:30:52but reduce it further?

00:30:53I mean, that's the question.

00:30:54So we'll have to find out.

00:30:56Now, I've seen Loparier-Brisot, we're not, we're not seeing them on, on the camera right

00:31:00now, but we've seen Loparier-Brisot drill those twizzles at least three times.

00:31:09How, how early in the season, okay, now let me rephrase the question, because this is

00:31:14relatively early in the season, what do you feel the difference is between these teams

00:31:18now and these teams three months from now?

00:31:20Programs.

00:31:21The, the, the, the, of all the disciplines, the ice dancers are the ones who always, or

00:31:28at least the, the, if you're smart, always take, uh, the, the panel feedback that the

00:31:35judges feedback, all of that, and, and really throw them into their programs.

00:31:40And you often see these programs evolve during the season that you don't see in the singles

00:31:47and pairs of events nearly as much.

00:31:49Um, and they evolve, how would they are technically or emotionally or less emotionally more around

00:31:57like, um, the, the elements themselves, what they're doing, how they're doing it, where

00:32:04they're placing it.

00:32:05Um, sometimes it's the music.

00:32:07I mean, we just saw Davis and Smokin at, uh, Grand Prix de France completely changed their

00:32:12music, but staying with the same concept.

00:32:15Um, so, so it, that kind of feedback, whether it's from the audience or from the judges or

00:32:21from the technical panel, all of that, I think the ice dancers take all of that so much

00:32:25into account, um, and, and they're, they do have, they're the ones who, their, their programs

00:32:32will change the most.

00:32:34Um, how much from last year at the Olympics and Worlds do you feel that the popularity of

00:32:39the sport, the growth came through the personalities versus the sport?

00:32:44A lot.

00:32:45Um, I think the, the personalities were a huge factor.

00:32:49Um, I'm obviously very much anchored on Alyssa Liu being a huge thing, right?

00:32:56Oh, whoa.

00:32:58Big smile coming up.

00:32:59Yep.

00:32:59That was, uh.

00:33:01Michael Parsons.

00:33:03He's still wearing it.

00:33:07I think they, were they trying to avoid something?

00:33:10I don't know.

00:33:11It was very smooth.

00:33:13Yeah.

00:33:14They're trying to avoid the fall, but that didn't work, right?

00:33:15I don't know what happened.

00:33:17He's also allergic to sleeves.

00:33:20Um, no, yeah, I, I think, I think the, the personality thing has been a big part.

00:33:27I mean, you and I were talking about this earlier too.

00:33:29You can't manufacture that.

00:33:30No.

00:33:31You know, like you can't teach it.

00:33:32You can't, yeah, you can't make somebody have a good personality and then make that go

00:33:36viral.

00:33:37Like it just has to happen itself.

00:33:38Yeah.

00:33:40And it's, you know, right, right time and right place sort of thing.

00:33:45I kind of think that the, that the impact of people watching or skaters, young skaters

00:33:49watching that maybe made them think a little bit, maybe I should have a little more fun

00:33:54when I'm skating like this.

00:33:55Cause we see that, although it's stressful, how much support there is for each other.

00:33:59And that hopefully will impact the next generation coming up.

00:34:02I do think the sport has changed quite a bit in, in that sense for these skaters.

00:34:07Like they're just more, there's more of a camaraderie across the board with these skaters.

00:34:12Um, it's not the, do you remember the era when there wasn't any camaraderie?

00:34:18Yeah.

00:34:18Me too.

00:34:19You know, everybody was sort of pitted against each other and you know, like the media loves

00:34:23to, loves those narratives because that's just, that's, that's what they're used to.

00:34:28But the media also loved this last year when the camaraderie came, you know, so.

00:34:31Well, they, they loved it cause the fans loved it, right?

00:34:34Like, you know, they go where the views go.

00:34:37Yep.

00:34:39Well, I think there's a lot to be said too about storytelling of the athletes.

00:34:43Cause I'll see someone and think, yeah, and then I'll hear their story.

00:34:46Yes.

00:34:46Good point.

00:34:46I think, oh my God, I never knew that.

00:34:48Like they are now, I love watching them and I understand what, what they've gone through

00:34:53and what they've accomplished or, or.

00:34:55And that is one of the things on the ICU.

00:34:57We've talked about this a lot.

00:34:58That's why Mark does such a good job at this is because you're learning about them as people

00:35:02and then you're, I don't want to say either sympathizing, but you're, you're alert to them

00:35:07more than just the athlete that you're going to see do a program.

00:35:19Did you ever dance, Joni?

00:35:20I, I, I danced because I had to.

00:35:23We all had.

00:35:24We all did.

00:35:25We all did.

00:35:25And I remember being told you dance like a free skater.

00:35:28And I never understood what that meant till I was coaching.

00:35:32Oh, really?

00:35:32I was like, oh, I get it.

00:35:34Yeah.

00:35:34Oh, I see what a free skater looks like when they're dancing and really didn't care.

00:35:39Hmm.

00:35:39But I did go back as an adult and finished my dances.

00:35:42Oh, wow.

00:35:43Good.

00:35:44Wow.

00:35:44That is impressive.

00:35:46I was in my mid thirties when I finished my gold.

00:35:48Why weren't you in Vernon competition, the adult competition?

00:35:51Yeah.

00:35:52Do some solo dancing.

00:35:53Yeah.

00:35:54No.

00:35:55I'm good.

00:35:56You and Jackie, I, I, I see a team here.

00:35:59No, I, I would be afraid for you, Joni.

00:36:02Yeah, no, I, uh, I'm good.

00:36:04Okay.

00:36:10I, it's, it's been interesting watching, um, the Browns and Green and Parsons on, on,

00:36:17on this ice, just having them be side by side here and seeing the differences.

00:36:21I do think Green and Parsons have an edge in the rhythm dance and then I, at this point,

00:36:31I think both of their free dances are really good and it'll be interesting to see what the

00:36:36judges will do with those.

00:36:37And, uh, you know, I guess it's a silly, silly question are, how alert are they to the importance

00:36:43of.

00:36:44So alert.

00:36:45So alert.

00:36:46Okay.

00:36:47So alert.

00:36:48Yeah.

00:36:49I mean, they, especially with the U S, um, because everything is about this body of work,

00:36:55right.

00:36:56And, and, and how your fall season goes and they know that it's, it's going to be tough

00:37:00at nationals.

00:37:02Um, the thing you can't do is have a string of bad performances that then make, make it

00:37:12so that you have to be just out of control good at nationals in order to get there.

00:37:17So they have to, even if they don't win, they have to be close, right?

00:37:21They have to be close to each other.

00:37:22Um, because nationals ultimately is the thing that counts the most, but if, if they are super

00:37:29close or if there's an upset, like that's when some of this, like earlier on season stuff

00:37:35is going to matter a lot.

00:37:36Um, and I would say ice dance practice and warmup is so much more, um, gauges the competition

00:37:59than singles or pairs.

00:38:02You look at it differently.

00:38:03Yeah.

00:38:03You look at it differently.

00:38:04Like you're already, you understood what I was trying to say there, Ted?

00:38:13I did, but it stopped pretty quickly.

00:38:15I didn't know what works to use next.

00:38:17It's like, it's not prejudged, but you get a really good sense of where everybody is.

00:38:23Well, you're, you're measuring maybe not the fine detail, but you're measuring the speed,

00:38:27the power, the effectiveness.

00:38:28You're going, well, they look really good.

00:38:30Well, and the costumes and the impression and the, all of that is part of the delivery.

00:38:34Really, I think this is the best variety show there is, ice dance.

00:38:38It is because you're getting different acts and different stories and different emotion

00:38:43and all that kind of stuff.

00:38:43I, I love this as the discipline in, in singles or in, in, in figure skating.

00:38:48What I find frustrating is, frustrating is the wrong word.

00:38:53What I find, you know, disturbing, which is even stronger, is that the, our inability to

00:39:02be able to explain this to the public who doesn't know anything, you know, those small

00:39:07little details we were talking about, the key points and the kindness of the edge and all

00:39:11that kind of stuff like that, which is so critical to the sport of ice dance, but it's very difficult

00:39:15for people to understand.

00:39:20Three Canadian teams, British team and team from Ukraine.

00:39:24A lot of fear and Lewis Gibson, always been so close and up in that upper group.

00:39:31What do they need this year?

00:39:33They need to be clean, cleaner.

00:39:35Um, that was the thing that was such an issue, especially at the Olympics.

00:39:41Uh, Lila fears twizzles got in her head basically from mid season onward.

00:39:48And they had a huge error in their free dance.

00:39:52I just took them completely out of the running.

00:39:54Now that's to say, I don't think had they've been clean, they would have beaten Piper and Paul

00:39:58for the bronze anyway.

00:40:00Um, but still like, you don't want, you don't want to end your Olympics like that.

00:40:06Um, and it's been the twizzles that's been their issue.

00:40:10But, but I think for them too, looking toward the next four seasons to the Olympics, I think

00:40:19they're very much trying to be like, how do we continue to improve on our basics such

00:40:24that we're not just about the lifts, we're not just about the, the, the vibes and the,

00:40:29the, uh, the value of like how we, how, how exciting our programs are.

00:40:35We are even more about the basics of our skating.

00:40:39Question for the two of you.

00:40:40If you were coaching ice dance, what would be the piece of music that you would choose?

00:40:45And I know you're going to say, Oh, well, it depends on the team.

00:40:46No, no.

00:40:46Forget about that for a second.

00:40:47What piece of music would you choose to have that major emotional impact on the audience

00:40:54and also the judges?

00:40:56Cause they're human as well.

00:40:57I would not choose Bolero.

00:41:00I said, which one would you choose?

00:41:04Bolero.

00:41:08Joni goes with it.

00:41:09We're the winner.

00:41:10There we go.

00:41:11Putting my team against your team, Jackie.

00:41:14Okay.

00:41:15Jackie, if you don't have Bolero, what would you have?

00:41:16I mean, I mean, I actually, I, I do think Swan Lake is a great piece.

00:41:21And, and if you can skate.

00:41:22And why?

00:41:23Because, because of the, just the drama of it all.

00:41:26Yeah.

00:41:27Um, and also there's, there is something to music being familiar to people.

00:41:32Yeah.

00:41:32That allows them to really just kind of go with it.

00:41:37You sticking with Bolero, Joni?

00:41:39No, but again, Ted, I didn't know I was going on a game show against the game master.

00:41:44Well, you don't, no one wins anything here.

00:41:47Okay.

00:41:48I'm just asking your impression.

00:41:50Tomorrow.

00:41:50I'm going to have so many answers for you because I'm going home tonight and doing all

00:41:54my homework.

00:41:54But you don't know my questions.

00:41:55So I'm going to answer today's questions tomorrow.

00:41:57Oh, tomorrow.

00:41:58Yeah.

00:41:58All right.

00:41:59That's it.

00:41:59That's good.

00:42:00While you're thinking up tomorrow's questions, I'm thinking up today's answers.

00:42:04I don't think them up in advance.

00:42:05I just, I don't know.

00:42:06They just come into my head when I've got the headphone on and I just start to ask questions

00:42:09because I think of it like I'm a fan.

00:42:12Like I'm a fan of the sport.

00:42:13So what are the things that I want to know that other people think about?

00:42:16I know what I think about, but I'm going, I don't know if I'm right or wrong.

00:42:18What other people think about it?

00:42:19So you have to ask the questions.

00:42:21Well, Jackie, you mentioned earlier that Michael Parsons has an allergy to sleeves

00:42:26and Alexander Brandis only has a partial allergy.

00:42:31It's not as severe.

00:42:33For sure.

00:42:33Yeah.

00:42:33Just half of it.

00:42:34Just a half of the allergy.

00:42:36Yeah.

00:42:38This group is in a lot of ways really fun because there are at least three teams here

00:42:46who are known for their lifts.

00:42:48And they're, they're just like big showy, you know, exciting lifts that, that they do.

00:42:56And I'm talking about Fear and Gibson.

00:42:57I'm talking about L'Oreal Legat.

00:43:01And I'm talking about Pigena Koval who are making their Grand Prix debut.

00:43:05So it's, this is that, this is the group where you're going to see like the big lifts.

00:43:10You know, it kind of makes you wonder sometimes, okay, we've, have we seen everything?

00:43:14You know, what new can be discovered and they keep on coming up with something.

00:43:18Yeah.

00:43:19Just, just ask, just ask Olivia Smart and Tim Deke, what else they're going to have up their

00:43:23sleeves.

00:43:24Yeah, exactly.

00:43:25Yeah.

00:43:30So the great ice dance shakeup that was in Canada too.

00:43:36Uh, now we have L'Oreal Legat who's, who's going to be the first to skate here.

00:43:41They're, they're now the default number one team in Canada.

00:43:45Mm-hm.

00:43:45Yes.

00:44:04This team is always so creative.

00:44:07Oh, they are.

00:44:08Yeah.

00:44:09I, I like their improvement too.

00:44:11And just their overall ice dance quality over the last few seasons.

00:44:16But they will bring all of the, all of the wow.

00:44:29They're also a team I find when I watch, I watch him just as much.

00:44:32Often you watch her, but with them.

00:44:35Oh yeah.

00:44:36Yeah.

00:44:36Your eyes.

00:44:36He's got a character and a personality.

00:44:39Yeah.

00:44:39I think this is the Mr. Bean character, is it?

00:44:41Yeah.

00:44:43Um, yeah, he makes you look at him.

00:44:55It's interesting.

00:44:56You, you watch that, you don't probably see it quite as much on, on the stream.

00:45:02But from up here, you could see them sort of, uh, going closer to each other and farther

00:45:10apart, closer to each other and farther apart.

00:45:12You want those, unless it's, it's intentionally done.

00:45:15You want those, uh, step sequences to be as consistently close as possible.

00:45:22Yeah.

00:45:22Um, whether it's far or close, they have to be consistent.

00:45:25Yeah.

00:45:26No, they shouldn't be.

00:45:28Yeah.

00:45:29One, they want that breaks not down here.

00:45:42Here's, uh, golden waltz first key point here.

00:45:47Hers looked a little flat.

00:46:00I like those churning threes from them

00:46:06they have a really good lilt on these

00:46:19not the most powerful golden waltz but it was well done

00:46:46man how much energy he puts out in his performance it's incredible in the upper body

00:46:51it's I mean they both do but

00:46:56yeah

00:46:57yeah

00:46:58yeah

00:46:59yeah

00:47:00yeah

00:47:02yeah

00:47:24so Robinson ports I don't know much about at all they were fifth last year at Canadians and that's

00:47:31all basically all I know about yeah they they don't have a huge background record here

00:47:48we're doing the artist well they were fifth in Orbisdorf 10th in Batumi so they had a couple

00:47:53international competitions but not a long history

00:48:04I'm focused on that bowtie is it supposed to be I don't know I'm trying to decide

00:48:12it just came undone or if it was supposed to be don't know I think that's just danging yeah

00:48:18I think it was does not look intentional no

00:48:35here we go golden waltz is that edge oh they're not doing it

00:48:40they're not doing it come on now you've got everybody focused on

00:48:46on the golden waltz and all the steps and all the details

00:48:52I get disappointed interesting strategy yeah but actually you're not wrong but you're not wrong from

00:48:59that I mean if we we or broadcast did a better job of okay this is something that's a little

00:49:04harder to see you can see the lips you can see this but you can see all that stuff here

00:49:07it is yeah and

00:49:08they drill that and people will right you know have a little bit more information on it yeah good point

00:49:36there's a lot of discussion about oh this is a waltz right but like why are there all these other

00:49:41rhythms yeah the the whole the whole thing about

00:49:44the theme of this year is not just waltz it's rhythm and waltz which take that as you will um

00:49:51but

00:49:52there is supposed to be a waltz part of the the program and there's supposed to be another dance

00:50:01uh genre that's part of the program so that's the thing I think that's been confusing to folks

00:50:05is like why isn't all of this just a waltz and it's not

00:50:20so you see that lift it it's it's a little bit simpler of a rotational lift than others because

00:50:27she is in a much more stable position kind of sitting on his shoulder that still gets a level four

00:50:36but it doesn't have that same amount of um kind of difficulty wow factor that some of the other ones

00:50:44do

00:50:46well delian brandes out of the juniors very successful in the junior circuit

00:50:55i'm feeling paso doble you think what was the end

00:51:07hmm

00:51:25i see how she was holding that skirt up i i will say the scariness of dance skirts yeah

00:51:31they that's a lot of skirt they never failed to scare me

00:51:45and you wonder whether the value of the costume itself is diluted by the distraction you know of

00:51:53the of the skirt obviously if it's making you scared then you're not watching the rest of the detail

00:51:57that's not really or is it a distraction or maybe it's cover up

00:52:04not not a cover-up i don't mean that but i mean i know yeah you know what i'm saying

00:52:17and we're on the walls yep there we go and there's your entrance

00:52:24choctaws

00:52:27those open choctaws just go by so quickly and it's so hard to see from

00:52:35at least you're coming at the camera so that would be relatively consistent depending

00:52:40that's the direction but oh they really stopped there on that on that outside edge right before

00:52:48it went into those threes

00:52:52i lost half their speed on that one

00:52:59so

00:53:08so

00:53:45Jack, do you think that in skating, not for judging, but that if the measurement of speed, how fast or

00:53:55how far would be interesting for the audience to know?

00:53:57I do think one thing about the IJS that I have not appreciated is the constant push for how fast

00:54:08somebody is.

00:54:09And that's not the only way that you can tell how powerful someone is.

00:54:14And I think that's been overly stated as like everything needs to be big and fast when you can actually

00:54:20have good elements, really good elements that don't have to be big and fast.

00:54:24Yeah.

00:54:26You don't have to be fast all the time.

00:54:27Yeah.

00:54:29Well, and there's a difference between speed and power.

00:54:31Yes.

00:54:32Because you can have great power without great speed.

00:54:34And I think that's a bit of a difference that gets missed as well.

00:54:38And that's when all you're thinking about is speed, you miss a lot of the nuances of what power is.

00:54:47Here's those twizzles.

00:54:50She just got through it.

00:54:52But you can still tell she's tentative going into that right forward outside twizzle.

00:54:57That's the one that's going to give her trouble.

00:55:01I mean, frankly, it gives everybody trouble.

00:55:03Well, it's the opposite direction.

00:55:04The rotation for everybody.

00:55:06The forward outside one is the hardest one to do and to do it on your counter rotation.

00:55:13That's why that is always the treacherous one.

00:55:17So they start interesting.

00:55:20Yeah, really?

00:55:21It was later.

00:55:23Very, very different pattern that they have.

00:55:26Almost mid-ice.

00:55:30And they're coming into...

00:55:34They've already gone around the rink here.

00:55:38And now they're at their final key point.

00:55:44Interestingly enough, I'll have to look at that again.

00:55:46But it does feel like that pattern covers more ice than the ones that we've seen so far.

00:55:52Yeah, you're right.

00:55:52It does feel that way.

00:55:53But it could very well be because it went around.

00:55:56Exactly.

00:55:57Around one directional almost of continuing that way.

00:56:00And then the...

00:56:01It felt longer.

00:56:03Yeah.

00:56:03All of the golden waltzes have to start to the right of the judges.

00:56:08Now, where it gets started is less of a thing.

00:56:12So it's got to be before mid-ice because that's otherwise reaching into the left zone.

00:56:16Exactly.

00:56:27The thing about them two this season is that they are trying to have different choreography,

00:56:35to go outside of their comfort zones.

00:56:39Because we're used to them being like the fun, pop, Lady Gaga, Madonna, you know, disco skaters.

00:56:49And I think they want to expand their range.

00:56:53And sometimes when you're doing that, you sort of lose yourself.

00:56:57And I'm curious to see what their season looks like.

00:57:02But I still feel this program is an energetic crowd pleaser.

00:57:05Everybody get engaged and involved and that's still there.

00:57:09Well, they're always entertained.

00:57:11Always, always.

00:57:12How do you entertain, right?

00:57:13Which vehicle?

00:57:15That's good energy at the end.

00:57:16Yeah.

00:57:19And I think that energy probably helps even with the skating skills.

00:57:23I mean, if you break it down in detail, perhaps a judge will see or a coach will see.

00:57:27But I think for the general audience, you go, well, that looks, you know, pretty much similar to other teams

00:57:32or more.

00:57:35Again, I end, Kovell from Ukraine.

00:57:56Oh, that stationary lift just sort of went a little bit too slow toward the end.

00:58:02But you see, this is one of the teams I was talking about with the big lifts.

00:58:05Like, they love their tricks.

00:58:08And they're really good at them.

00:58:11That lift could be a lot better, though.

00:58:27The thing I love about the OneFoot's this year is that they're not allowed to finish with the Twizzles.

00:58:36And that means that you have to keep a certain amount of speed and power out of the Twizzles in

00:58:43order to do more.

00:58:44And you see the differences in some of the teams where some of them just come to a grinding halt

00:58:50at the end of their Twizzles.

00:58:51And they can't do another turn.

00:58:53Well, it makes the Twizzles that much harder, for sure, and important to the whole step.

00:58:58Because it's not a dismount anymore.

00:58:59It's still part of the element that is not the end of it.

00:59:04And skating.

00:59:05That's great.

00:59:10But, like, the ease of which, Johnny, you were looking at that lift.

00:59:14The ease to which he was able to sort of kind of flip her around.

00:59:19Like, that's what they're known for.

00:59:21Even as juniors.

00:59:23Yeah.

00:59:25Well, and it was unique and different.

00:59:27But it happened so fast.

00:59:28It was like, whoa.

00:59:29Yeah.

00:59:31Yeah.

00:59:41Yeah.

00:59:42I'm waiting for the stars.

00:59:46I am trying to achieve things to give you love.

00:59:55You're ready for the song to take me through.

01:00:02Please see me in your tears.

01:00:07It's the sounds of tears.

01:00:10We were talking about the rotational speed of this dance lift.

01:00:15You can tell, out of all of them that we've seen so far, this one is one of the weaker

01:00:19ones.

01:00:20You're just not seeing.

01:00:22Here it gets faster, but that first set was a little labored.

01:00:41I'm also really sick of this song.

01:00:46Hey, don't, don't, don't walk the fence.

01:00:49Come on.

01:00:52So along with Bolero, this music would not be.

01:00:55Yeah, exactly.

01:00:57I am very interested to see what Zyngus Kolesnik does with their Bolero this season though.

01:01:03That is, that is one.

01:01:07It's a challenge from so many different angles.

01:01:11But maybe they did that on purpose because they feel they can meet that challenge and make it new.

01:01:24See, this is one of those instances where I don't think a character step works for this music.

01:01:30Like the sort of going from one side to the other.

01:01:34Yeah, you're right.

01:01:35You're right.

01:01:37I would much rather see a, you know, for lack of a better term, like a pair's choreograph sequence.

01:01:45Where you're, you're covering ice, you're, you're working with the flow of the music.

01:01:50And it, the, the rhythmics are the character.

01:01:52But was, was, was the element wrong or was the music wrong?

01:01:56Maybe the element was placed at the wrong place.

01:01:58I don't know.

01:01:59Yeah.

01:02:00It didn't work with the music.

01:02:01No, no.

01:02:02Not at all.

01:02:03Yeah.

01:02:05There's a little fence walking there too.

01:02:07You know.

01:02:07Well.

01:02:08Jump right off.

01:02:09Or was the character developed enough to know.

01:02:10He's impacting me.

01:02:11He's making me give an opinion here.

01:02:18Yeah, I'm interested to see the, um, Fear and Gibson now that I've seen that pattern.

01:02:23Um, they, they, they certainly looked like they covered more ice.

01:02:28And you wonder how much of that has to do with how much they are able to be in their,

01:02:33in the, in their edges and down in the lobes of what they're doing.

01:02:37So how long can you, I mean, because this team, they have been innovative from a character perspective and from

01:02:44an entertainment perspective.

01:02:45But when does that wear thin?

01:02:47And, um, and then what do they, how do they recreate themselves?

01:02:51Which is what I think they're trying to do here for sure.

01:02:54And I think they've improved into a certain area of this, but you'll have to wait to see.

01:02:57Yeah, I mean, I think to be honest that the, the, they probably feel like their Lady Gaga and Madonna

01:03:04and disco era has worn thin, right?

01:03:08That they, they feel like they're repeating themselves a little bit, which is why they're pushing themselves to do more

01:03:12and do new things.

01:03:13Which is the right thing to do.

01:03:14Yeah, for sure.

01:03:15Like you don't, you don't want to be, it can only work so many times.

01:03:20Right.

01:03:20Um, and, and maybe they go back to that later on, but for it to be every single season, it

01:03:26doesn't work.

01:03:26No.

01:03:35And how do you feel, okay, this is, you, I'm, you're certainly allowed to walk the fence on this question.

01:03:41Okay.

01:03:42But how do you feel that the judging was during last year's ice dance events for the most part?

01:03:48I mean, there were some issues here and there, but for the most part, do you feel the right teams

01:03:52were in the right place?

01:03:53I think, I mean, for the most part, yes.

01:03:55Um, I, I, I think there, there was part, one of the things that was frustrating about last season was

01:04:00sort of the surprise of how levels were being given such that it wasn't just a surprise to us, but

01:04:10it was a surprise to the skaters and the teams.

01:04:12Um, I think you're talking about one particular circumstance.

01:04:16Oh, there were multiple circumstances for sure.

01:04:18One was way above the others, Jackie.

01:04:21Come on.

01:04:21One stands out.

01:04:22Yeah.

01:04:22Far more than the others.

01:04:24Question.

01:04:24And even I noticed that.

01:04:26So.

01:04:27Have you, have you been on a technical panel?

01:04:28I have not, no.

01:04:29Have you listened to a technical panel?

01:04:31I have.

01:04:31You have?

01:04:32Yeah.

01:04:32Uh, at what level?

01:04:33Uh, like, kind of like sitting there listening to it on international.

01:04:39Yeah, international.

01:04:40You had the, you had the ability to do that?

01:04:42Oh, that was cool.

01:04:43Like just kind of sitting around there.

01:04:44Yeah.

01:04:44I see.

01:04:45So what did you think of that process?

01:04:47I mean.

01:04:47Or the difficulty of it?

01:04:48It's, it's, ooh.

01:04:50Oops.

01:04:50That was a close call.

01:04:53Uh, it's, they, they do, they, they do a lot of multitasking.

01:05:00Yeah.

01:05:01Um, not in a bad way, but like they have to do a lot of multitasking and because they have

01:05:06to get these calls and these levels in the right place and they have to then say, you

01:05:11know, there are three of them, right?

01:05:14Um, two of them have to agree and like there, there's all this kind of gymnastics of the,

01:05:19the technical calls that nobody knows or sees, um, cause you're not listening to it.

01:05:26Uh, but then, you know, somebody has to go and replay the thing and then you have to

01:05:30go and watch the thing and then you have to make the, the, the decision on what to call

01:05:33the thing.

01:05:34And so it's, it's, it gets to be difficult.

01:05:35And sometimes watch the replay over and over and over.

01:05:38Right.

01:05:38Not just once it's like over and over and over and people wondering what takes so long.

01:05:43Do you think that, um, uh, that the audience would enjoy, maybe not, certainly not all the

01:05:48time being able to hear it?

01:05:52Possibly.

01:05:52I think it would be like the diehards who wish we were most interested in listening to

01:05:57that kind of stuff.

01:05:57Um, but understanding the sort of behind the scenes machinations, I think is, uh, is, would

01:06:04be helpful.

01:06:05Yeah.

01:06:06Cause we last, we've been the last two years able to listen to it ourselves.

01:06:09Right.

01:06:10And always in an effort, what does this make sense to open this up?

01:06:14And would you open it up?

01:06:15Or when would you open it up?

01:06:16On whom you would, you know, that type of thing.

01:06:18So I think there has been discussion around that too.

01:06:20So the people could say, Oh, now I understand.

01:06:22Cause to me, I always say it's like an air traffic controller.

01:06:25There is no emotion.

01:06:26They're just analyzing it.

01:06:27And then you could say, okay, that's a difficult job or you can.

01:06:30But what about when we started with the element tracker and people being able to see the elements

01:06:35and them getting called, whether just how much that brought to people?

01:06:40Oh, totally.

01:06:40Ask the question of your, all your group, because you've got data from that.

01:06:44How much, how many of them watch the element tracker?

01:06:47Oh, they so, they watch it so much.

01:06:49Okay.

01:06:49So it is important.

01:06:51Absolutely important.

01:06:52I mean, the, um, understanding what is being reviewed, what, what they're, they're calling it.

01:06:58One of the things that I've been able to bring is actually, you know, you, you see the stuff live,

01:07:03right?

01:07:04And then you're sort of in, um, you're sort of in limbo because you don't know then at the end

01:07:11of the program.

01:07:12Okay.

01:07:12These things are marked green and these things are under review.

01:07:15You don't then know what happens until afterwards where you see the protocols.

01:07:20Like the scores don't even tell you what happened, right?

01:07:23Like, I don't know.

01:07:24So what if you saw, so question you, because I'm doing this all the time.

01:07:29Is that what if you saw that stay up there?

01:07:31Yeah.

01:07:31And what, because when, as commentators, we see it, we see the numbers roll.

01:07:35Yeah.

01:07:35And we actually say like, wow, there's six points ahead here, but you know what?

01:07:38This is going down.

01:07:39It's still changing.

01:07:40So what if you saw those things change so you can watch the process?

01:07:43I, I think that would be very helpful to the audience.

01:07:46Again, that's one of the things that I, I do on my site now because I have access to all

01:07:50of those things.

01:07:52So, so I may, I'm able to, to give the audience the transparency of what actually gets called, but that

01:07:59doesn't happen in every competition either.

01:08:01Okay.

01:08:01So would that be something that you, you know, not just you, I mean, obviously, you know, like I would

01:08:07love to see that.

01:08:08I think that's great.

01:08:08I think it's the right thing to do.

01:08:09Right.

01:08:10So, because, and even that, that left-hand part of the screen goes away.

01:08:14Yeah.

01:08:14Even before you get to take a look at the very end of it, which is really annoying because you

01:08:18want to see, well, what was the total and how did it compare?

01:08:21Right.

01:08:21So, yeah.

01:08:21Well, and you still get that.

01:08:22You still don't know what's happening over here.

01:08:24Right.

01:08:24So, but it, it brings an element of excitement because you know, it's close, but you know, it's not final.

01:08:29But we get to see it and that's the excitement and that's cool.

01:08:32I know you do, but watching, if you're just watching.

01:08:33I know.

01:08:33I want them to see it too.

01:08:34Yeah.

01:08:35I agree.

01:08:36Okay.

01:08:36But you don't know how that changes and how it goes up and down enough.

01:08:41I don't see any reason why you wouldn't.

01:08:42You've already seen this much about it.

01:08:43Yeah.

01:08:44I was going to ask you a question.

01:08:45Why, you know, what would your thoughts be if you were the ISU to say, well, I'm concerned

01:08:49because?

01:08:51Well, there was concern before.

01:08:53We couldn't even have the element tracker on in the arena, but now we do.

01:08:57Mm-hmm.

01:08:57And, you know, the theory was, oh, well, the judges can look and see it.

01:09:00They're not looking to make.

01:09:01I think the concern is that it mucks up the broadcast too much.

01:09:09That, that it's like, for, there's, there's a certain, uh, there's a certain group of people

01:09:15who want that level of detail.

01:09:17And then there's a certain group of people who are like, don't give me all the, like,

01:09:20stuff that I don't know what I'm looking at.

01:09:22Because that would actually go over what, on the replays, you'd be seeing that happen.

01:09:26Yeah.

01:09:26On the replays.

01:09:26So it's hard to follow the replays.

01:09:28Then you'd see that happen in the kiss and cry.

01:09:30Yeah.

01:09:30So it could be annoying from a visual perspective.

01:09:32Yeah.

01:09:32Okay.

01:09:32And the question of like, you know, is that, do you make that available immediately after

01:09:38a score comes up on the scoring website rather than on the broadcast?

01:09:42Yeah.

01:09:42Because the people who are going to be interested in that kind of stuff.

01:09:46Yeah.

01:09:46For the last many years.

01:09:48Like you can actually go in and see it.

01:09:49Yeah.

01:09:50Um, but the ISU doesn't do that.

01:09:51Yeah.

01:09:52Yeah.

01:09:52Okay.

01:09:53Although I do have, I do, I've seen coaches sit in the kiss and cry.

01:09:57Oh.

01:09:58Yeah.

01:10:26Yeah.

01:10:28Were you watching?

01:10:32Interesting discussion though, because it's all these resources that are there can enhance

01:10:36or, or get in the way of the enjoyment of the viewer, right?

01:10:41Yeah.

01:10:41Everybody demands more information.

01:10:42Who's everybody?

01:10:43Right.

01:10:43Exactly.

01:10:43Maybe everybody that knows a lot about figure skating, but not the other general fans say,

01:10:46Hey, don't muck it up.

01:10:47I just like watching this.

01:10:48Right?

01:10:49So it's complicated business.

01:10:50Or is it a way to make it an option where it's an app and you watch it if you

01:10:54want to

01:10:54and you don't if you don't want to.

01:10:55I think that's coming.

01:10:56And then it's up to, yeah.

01:10:57I think that'll come.

01:10:57It is available on rockerskating.com.

01:11:00There you go.

01:11:00Well, okay.

01:11:01But if I'm sitting here now watching, not adding much, not that I'm adding much anyway,

01:11:06to the conversation, but.

01:11:07No, no.

01:11:08Your opinions are important.

01:11:10Discussion is important.

01:11:11One of the things that I think people enjoy with a good broadcast is that you feel like

01:11:16if you're talking and having this type of discussion, right?

01:11:19Okay.

01:11:19We're not focused on the detail of this in competition as we will be throughout the weekend.

01:11:24But the point is, if you have the right amount of coverage, accurate coverage of the competition,

01:11:28plus discussion, a person sitting at home feels that they're part of a family.

01:11:32And they learn something.

01:11:33Yeah.

01:11:33And you're asking the questions.

01:11:36That's what I try to do is ask the questions that they have in their mind, right?

01:11:38So not just for us.

01:11:40It's for them.

01:11:41So I think, you know, there's all this data out there.

01:11:45And how does it get organized to make sure the fan enjoyment is at the level they want

01:11:49it to be?

01:11:50Too much detail, not enough detail, whatever it is.

01:11:53They have the choice, which right now they have more choice than they used to, but not

01:11:56enough, perhaps.

01:11:57Well, in a place to get answers because also people are watching and they have questions.

01:12:01I have a sister who will watch.

01:12:03Yeah.

01:12:03A huge fan watches faithfully and then we'll save all her questions that she's had and

01:12:09then call me and say, okay, here's my questions.

01:12:12She needs to know these answers.

01:12:15Because you'd like her not to call you at the end.

01:12:17I don't mind her calling me, but I hope she's listening now so she's getting all those answers

01:12:21and they don't have to give them to her on Monday.

01:12:23It's a good point.

01:12:24Having a resource that they can get answers to their questions.

01:12:26And I think in a broadcast, you don't have the time to do it because you've got to go

01:12:29to commercial or whatever.

01:12:30I mean, we have the time on junior, but what is the mechanism for people actually asking

01:12:34the questions to make it easy for the commentator to say, yeah, well, that's a good question.

01:12:39I don't have the answer to that.

01:12:40I'll get the answer.

01:12:41You know, that fan engagement, if you will.

01:12:42Well, and for people who will be in stands here.

01:12:45Yes.

01:12:45Listening.

01:12:46Skatebug.

01:12:47Skatebug radio.

01:12:47I don't mind listening to the commentary.

01:12:50Jack, you will be listening to us.

01:12:51You better be.

01:12:52Anyways.

01:12:53Sure.

01:12:53And then you're going to tell, well, you're wrong.

01:12:56You're totally wrong.

01:12:57The one thing you should know about me is I don't like commentary while I'm listening

01:13:03to you while I'm watching skating.

01:13:05For sure.

01:13:05And yet you know how many times I screwed up.

01:13:07Yeah.

01:13:08I don't get it.

01:13:10Well, I have no choice but to listen to you on Junior Grand Prix.

01:13:14Why?

01:13:15There's no commentary list.

01:13:19I'll have to give you a clean feed so you don't have to listen to us.

01:13:22Or I'll just give you Mark's feed.

01:13:24You can just listen to Mark.

01:13:24No, I'd rather just not have him.

01:13:26Yeah.

01:13:26Okay.

01:13:27Hey, Mark.

01:13:28A new fan for you.

01:13:29Mark.

01:13:29Sorry, Mark.

01:13:33Sure.

01:13:53We just saw Steven Gogolev and Benoit Rochot walk in front of us.

01:13:58It's interesting and such an improvement in his skating and his performance.

01:14:04Everyone is just walking by us right now.

01:14:07Great Brian Orser with Wesley Chu.

01:14:09It's like the who's who of skating.

01:14:11I know.

01:14:11This is it.

01:14:12Yeah.

01:14:12Well, for people who don't know, we're sitting in the arena, but we're just beside the skater

01:14:17warm-up area.

01:14:17Yeah.

01:14:18So virtually everybody is at some point coming up here.

01:14:21And we're kind of in their way, aren't we?

01:14:23Or they're in our way.

01:14:25Yeah.

01:14:25We were here first.

01:14:26We were here first.

01:14:26Hey, outfit center.

01:14:28Come on.

01:14:28Yeah.

01:14:28But it's kind of fun.

01:14:30Yeah.

01:14:30It is fun.

01:14:31Yeah.

01:14:31It's great.

01:14:34Watch one of these lifts from L'Oreal.

01:14:35Look at that.

01:14:36Look at the ease of this lift.

01:14:38My gosh.

01:14:39But just that slow extension.

01:14:41Yeah.

01:14:42And the fact that when he goes on one leg, there's no shaking.

01:14:46No, nothing.

01:14:47And even the free leg is solid, right?

01:14:51Those one leg lifts, straight line lifts often give me a little bit of pause.

01:14:56Yeah.

01:14:56Because you're like, are they in the right place?

01:14:59They used to shake in the beginning when people did it, but not anymore.

01:15:02Just a reminder, Caitlin Weaver will be joining me for the broadcast.

01:15:06And Caitlin is doing such a wonderful job in choreography, but such a successful ice dancer

01:15:11as well.

01:15:12So you'll enjoy her input and her thoughts on the sport itself, but also the competition

01:15:18in detail.

01:15:20So you just saw the one foot from Lila and Lewis there.

01:15:23That one I felt like is one of the more improved elements for them.

01:15:27They really, they take the time to cover the ice.

01:15:33Now, they oftentimes have a way of covering the ice faster because they're not as deep

01:15:40on their edges.

01:15:41And I think that one foot sequence was a stronger one than they've done in the past.

01:15:51You know, it's so funny, and I know this is sort of silly, but the sliding moves and the

01:15:57knee slides across the ice, a lot of the control depends on how rough the ice is.

01:16:02Yes.

01:16:02If it's absolutely fresh and clean, it's really risky, you know.

01:16:05I was just looking at how cut up this ice is from the dance practice compared to the

01:16:10other.

01:16:10Yeah.

01:16:10And you saw that team slow down.

01:16:13Yeah.

01:16:13And like sandpaper.

01:16:14It's like sandpaper on the knees, you know, not easy.

01:16:16And it hurts.

01:16:17Yeah.

01:16:18I don't get why they do it.

01:16:19Like, okay, I get why they do it.

01:16:21Because it's cool.

01:16:21But some of them have some sort of a light pad.

01:16:24Yeah.

01:16:24Not a pad, but...

01:16:25Or bandages that have been just added.

01:16:27They tape up their knees with forehand.

01:16:29Yeah.

01:16:33Alexander Brandis has completely lost both sleeves.

01:16:37Oh, his allergy has...

01:16:38Yeah.

01:16:39Not enough Benadryl.

01:16:52So, if you have questions, anybody listening out there, any questions, what's your address

01:16:57there, Jackie?

01:16:58At Rocker Skating.

01:17:00Here you go.

01:17:01On X.

01:17:04So, this will be coming to the end of the dance practice.

01:17:08We'll have an ice resurfacing.

01:17:10Stay tuned on that.

01:17:12We're going to have an interview with Leila Villan and Alexander Brandis that was done

01:17:15from the summer, talking about their move from junior to senior.

01:17:19And then we will have the men.

01:17:22And you two will be covering the men.

01:17:24I've got something I have to go to.

01:17:25Oh, my God.

01:17:26Yeah.

01:17:26Ted.

01:17:27Yeah.

01:17:28No.

01:17:29Hey, listen.

01:17:29If I'm not here, I won't be making mistakes.

01:17:33He'll be texting us.

01:17:34He's going to go back and listen while he's getting ready and text us questions.

01:17:38Ted will be like, you made a mistake this time.

01:17:43Because I won't listen.

01:17:44My favorite is when you can't think of somebody and I'm screaming it to you.

01:17:48Oh, I know.

01:17:49Screaming it to you.

01:17:49But how many times are we going and we're searching for the name?

01:17:52You did that a little earlier, Jackie.

01:17:54Searching for the name.

01:17:55And you're also on it for 10 hours.

01:17:58By the time the fifth hour comes around, you're just like, what's going on?

01:18:12Do the ice dancers need this long of a practice?

01:18:14I mean, they all do.

01:18:15I mean, the same thing with Paris because it finished so early, right?

01:18:18And it's 16 minutes left.

01:18:19Well, and I think when they have the option of which program they're doing because the other ones are scaled

01:18:24down when it's all the shorter programs or the longer programs.

01:18:27The thing about the ice dancers also is that they use these practices also to figure out where their elements

01:18:36go, especially when the ring sizes are different.

01:18:39Because they have to mark it and they have to figure out how far they can really push it because

01:18:45all these ice dancers will try to push their elements as far out as they possibly can.

01:18:51Yeah.

01:18:52Exactly.

01:18:53Okay, Joni.

01:18:53All right.

01:18:54We're wrapped up here.

01:18:54Stay tuned for the interview and we'll be back after the ice resurfacing with the men.

01:18:58Ted, good luck at your event.

01:19:09I'm now being joined.

Thursday - Dance - 2026 Skate Canada International - Practices

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