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00:00All right, we're here with Wayne Scott Lucas.
00:03You've been, you were Jenna Jackson's longtime stylist.
00:06Yeah, 28 years.
00:0728 years. You've known her since, what, 1995?
00:1093 was the design of a decade.
00:12We did the design of a decade, the European cover.
00:14Okay.
00:15And I met her that day with Patrick DeMarcellier.
00:17Yeah.
00:17So this has been a long, she hated me the first day, so.
00:20Why does she hate you?
00:22I made a joke about Michael thinking that I was being funny and charming,
00:25and she didn't think it was funny, and she wanted me to go home.
00:28They were going to send me home.
00:29Wow.
00:29So I was able to quickly apologize, fix my behavior,
00:33and then it became a 28-year friendship.
00:35Maybe more now.
00:36Yeah.
00:3693.
00:37And you, I mean, you've been responsible for some of her most iconic looks and moments
00:40throughout her career.
00:42Yeah.
00:42Extremely exciting.
00:42When I look back and see it, I'm shocked how many great things we did together.
00:46Yeah.
00:46Well, I mean, obviously, one of the huge moments of her career and yours was Super Bowl in 2004.
00:53It's been 22 years.
00:55I got to tell you, we've talked about it a lot.
00:57A lot.
00:57A lot.
00:58And, you know, when I saw you in the news this week on TMZ, I was like, there he goes
01:02again, talking about the Super Bowl.
01:05Did you ever think that you would still be talking about what has been called, I know
01:11you hate this term, but a wardrobe malfunction.
01:13Did you think that you would be talking about it 22 years later?
01:16I never thought that I'd be speaking about it because we had a clause that we couldn't speak
01:20about things and we shouldn't speak about things.
01:22And Janet asked us not to speak about things.
01:25But once she did her documentary and she started speaking about it, I thought I could talk about
01:29it.
01:29Why keep a secret and a lie for 22 years?
01:32Like, who are we protecting?
01:33Nobody.
01:34Well, you know, you said, Justin coined the phrase wardrobe malfunction to your detriment.
01:40Yeah.
01:41Set the record straight.
01:42What did that do for your career?
01:44Well, the wardrobe malfunction comment was shocking and I went to fix it and my attorney
01:48said you can't speak.
01:49I was supposed to be the red carpet host on Fuse.
01:52I lost that job because I couldn't talk about it.
01:54I was supposed to do another thing with Spiegel Catalog.
01:56I lost that job.
01:57We started losing jobs.
01:59Who wants to hire a stylist who's known for doing the wardrobe malfunction, especially when
02:04it was the most functioning wardrobe in history?
02:05I was paid to change it.
02:07We did it overnight and it was perfect.
02:09It did exactly what it was supposed to do when it was supposed to do it.
02:14Why did it take so long to clear it up and actually talk about what happened that night?
02:19When you're loyal to celebrities, you don't speak out of turn, you know, and I didn't want
02:23to disrespect Janet's wishes.
02:24But when Janet started to speak about it, I just opened up and talked about it.
02:28And I still don't.
02:28People go, he changes his story.
02:30No, I tell little bits just to be salacious so you know that I'm still involved and I
02:35don't like it.
02:35But the truth is going to come out.
02:38And I wish that Janet and Justin would just tell the truth.
02:40It'd be over because Justin just opened this can of worms.
02:43I didn't.
02:43I'm not interested.
02:45I know I'm here, but I'm not interested.
02:47Well, you said the truth is that it was supposed to happen.
02:52The wardrobe was supposed to function.
02:53He was supposed to tear off her bra and the lights.
02:57It was supposed to go dark.
02:58And the producers, essentially, they screwed it up.
03:02The producers allegedly partying in the van, which I heard.
03:07The producers, the MTV producers.
03:08MTV producers have done so many interviews about this and they keep throwing me under the
03:13bus.
03:13So it's like, no, honey.
03:14It was supposed to be rip, grab, cut to black fireworks.
03:19Miley Cyrus just had a wardrobe malfunction.
03:20She turned around, they cut to the band, they let her fix it, and she came back and performed.
03:25Janet was left hanging there, bouncing, and I just don't think anybody was paying attention.
03:30And they pushed the blame.
03:31They said Justin wasn't there to rehearse it.
03:34Justin rehearsed it seven times before we went on the air.
03:37And, want one more thing?
03:39Of course.
03:40When you shoot a Super Bowl, you pre-shoot the performance in case no one knows this.
03:45If the satellite goes down, they cut to the videotape.
03:49They had a videotape without the tear.
03:52So, the producers never cut to the videotape either.
03:55They left her hanging out there.
03:56And that always has bothered me because I'm the only one that knows from this crowd that
04:00they have a videotape.
04:01There was no rip.
04:02Right.
04:02And you've spoken about this numerous times throughout the years, especially within the
04:07past, I'd say, five or six years.
04:09Spoken with respect.
04:10Yeah.
04:10You know, always trying to balance what's right and wrong to say.
04:13Has anyone tried to shut you up?
04:16I, Janet's fans, the ones that were, this is 22 years ago.
04:19So, these young kids, one person said they were going to come to New Jersey and lynch
04:23my family because I ruined Janet's career.
04:25So, what's been bothering me is that they attack me as if I ruined her career by creating
04:31a wardrobe malfunction.
04:32That's why, this is to set the record straight.
04:34The most functioning wardrobe in history.
04:37Justin's a nice guy.
04:38I was his stylist for three years.
04:40Wonderful person.
04:41And, it's time to just be clear that this was the most functioning wardrobe.
04:45What they decided to do, to be a little salacious, actually caused trouble for them.
04:49But, they pushed it everywhere else and they pushed the responsibility.
04:53And, when you work for a celebrity, you take the responsibility with your mouth shut.
04:57But, at some point, I'm tired.
04:58Yeah.
04:58I'm tired.
04:59But, what's been the reaction when you do speak out?
05:02What does Janet say?
05:03What does Justin say?
05:04Has MTV said anything?
05:06I wanted to speak.
05:07Has there been any cease and desist?
05:09No.
05:09I wanted to speak during Janet's, I'm in Janet's documentary and she said, don't talk about it.
05:13I'm going to handle it.
05:14And, I thought she was.
05:15And, I'm watching the documentary and I'm lauding how much I love her.
05:19And, at the end, she takes the cell phone and goes, oh, just get over it.
05:23That wasn't what was supposed to happen in her documentary, according to me.
05:27And, they said Justin was going to be in that one.
05:29So, none of this is quite making sense to me.
05:32And, I don't like how it's being handled again.
05:34And, I'd like to kind of go sideways.
05:36And, people go, then why did you go on TV?
05:38Because I trust you.
05:39I'm telling the truth again.
05:41If people don't want to hear it, I'm sorry.
05:43But, that's what happened.
05:44The most functioning wardrobe, it did exactly what it was supposed to do.
05:47And, we got vilified after to the point that we were in tinted windows with security, FBI, car services hiding
05:54us in L.A.
05:55Couldn't shop in stores.
05:57It was really bad, the fallout.
05:58So, what were those, so when Justin said wardrobe malfunction, when it came out of his mouth, what were the
06:06conversations then?
06:07Was everybody shocked?
06:09Was Janet shocked?
06:10I was with Janet every day after that.
06:12And, Justin said wardrobe malfunction.
06:14I called her immediately.
06:15I was at Shutters in Santa Monica.
06:17And, she lived in Malibu.
06:18And, she said, just keep your mouth shut.
06:19Don't say anything.
06:20Don't talk.
06:21And, Justin's camp was supposed to, nobody had a plan.
06:24Nobody thought it was going to go so bad, so when it did go bad, Justin decided he was going
06:29to be smarmy and say wardrobe malfunction.
06:31That turned this into a nightmare.
06:33Those words turned this into a nightmare.
06:35And, then Michael Powell of the FCC, the head of the FCC, Colin Powell's son, who's recently apologized, said, I
06:42did this for political gain.
06:43I made this worse than it was.
06:45He's friends with Janet's family.
06:46I mean, everybody took what they could from this.
06:49And, Janet did get burned.
06:50You know, and Justin didn't.
06:52And, I got burned.
06:52Well, talk to me about Janet for a second.
06:54Because, you were there.
06:55You were there even in the room when she gave that apology.
06:58Yeah, only me and her were in the room.
07:00Yeah, so, talk to me about it.
07:01Because, there's been a lot of think pieces about how it affected her career at the time.
07:07What did she say to you about how it affected her career?
07:11The next day, two days later, it was me, Janet, Mary J. Blige, and Beyonce shooting Essence.
07:16And, during lunch, we shot the apology.
07:18And, she did not want to do it.
07:19And, I had her shirt open and a Valentino top with a bra.
07:22And, they said, cover her chest.
07:24So, it's like, all of a sudden, we're doing this to Janet Jackson when she was always this.
07:28All that stuff was messy.
07:32She really wanted to get far away from it for a long time.
07:34I think, by talking about it a little bit in her documentary, she opened the door.
07:38But, if they both would just go, here's what happened, here's the plan, here's how we did it.
07:45Yeah.
07:46Well, this week, I mean, the reason you're talking about it now is because it was announced that Justin Timberlake
07:51is doing his own documentary.
07:52Yeah, another can of worms for more attention.
07:55And, Janet is reportedly going to appear.
07:58Do it.
07:58And, Brittany Day said so.
07:59So, how shocked were you when news came out that he was doing a documentary?
08:05I just can't believe, again, they don't know how to just tell the truth, not make it salacious so that
08:11they get a sound bite to then get attention to the documentary.
08:14The first thing he said was, I'm going to have Janet on.
08:17Now, he's saying he's going to have the NSYNC members on.
08:19And, it's like, it's little bits.
08:21And, the problem is, the public at large, and you know this from being in this business, they get fooled.
08:26They get fooled every day.
08:27I've only spoken the truth about this, and I get attacked.
08:31They want to hear the lies.
08:32They want to hear the deceit instead of going, oh, okay, there was a mistake.
08:36You know, they wanted to show something.
08:38The public doesn't quite get it.
08:40And, I don't understand why.
08:42And, they're going to fall for this again.
08:44And, it's okay.
08:45God bless Justin.
08:46How furious were you when you read that Janet, and we don't know if she's participating, she hasn't actually commented,
08:54but how furious were you when you read that she was going to be a part of it?
08:56It's never furious because I love her.
08:58It's disappointment.
09:00It's consistently being disappointed in 42 years of celebrity clients.
09:0542 years.
09:06I'm 61 years old.
09:08And, you never get around these celebrities always working the angle and using you to protect their own image, which
09:15is fine.
09:15And, we do that as we work with them.
09:17I'm disappointed because she's cooler, and she's smarter, and she knows better.
09:23So, I don't know if she's going to be in it, unless it's a little clip here and there.
09:26I don't know if there's confirmation she's going to be in it.
09:29Do you believe she'll do it?
09:31I don't think she should.
09:32Yeah.
09:33I think she was treated dirty during this.
09:36I think that she's somewhere else now with a beautiful child, beautiful friends, beautiful team doing this tour.
09:42She doesn't need to do it.
09:44And, I don't think she should, unless they really tell the truth, and they say, hey, Wayne, come on, let's
09:49talk about this.
09:50What was that like leading up to it?
09:51Wayne, why is it so important for you to clear your name?
09:56Wayne, it's not clear my name for drama's sake.
09:59It's clear my name because I have very big clients, political clients, celebrity clients, who know that I am discreet,
10:05and I keep their secrets, and I keep their privacies, because we have a lot of stuff, you and me,
10:09from all these years.
10:10It's very important because I have a family that it affects.
10:13They do threaten my family whenever this comes up.
10:16Every January when there's a Super Bowl, I get 47 emails from people I don't know, just right now.
10:20I'm getting emails from radio shows and people I don't know.
10:23I'm here because I trust you, but it's messy, and I think it's time to put this to rest that
10:28this was the most functioning wardrobe in history.
10:31It did what it was supposed to do.
10:33It got the most attention of any wardrobe in the world.
10:36It coined the phrase.
10:37It created TiVo.
10:38It created YouTube.
10:39We all know how big this was.
10:41Give it the power.
10:42That performance was stupendous.
10:44We were at a war with the country, and Janet was going to do War is Stupid, possibly, by Boy
10:49George, but then she picked Rhythm Nation.
10:51But we were, like, fighting a battle to make some fabulous moment, and that one stupid moment changed that whole—the
10:58performance is huge.
10:59Go back and rewatch it.
11:01If they do—if she does appear in this documentary and they do address the Super Bowl, which presumably they will,
11:07what do you hope they say?
11:10Guys, we made a plan.
11:12It didn't work as we wanted it to.
11:14It went a little messy.
11:16We're sorry we lied for 22 years because you fans have believed in us and trusted us, and you've attacked
11:22everybody around us as if they were lying, me, myself.
11:26But it was never us.
11:27It was, you know, covering for celebrity, you know, and loving the two of them because they're very talented and
11:32kind.
11:33What's your relationship like with Janet today?
11:35Janet, I haven't talked to in a while.
11:37We talk a lot on WhatsApp when she's traveling, but she's been doing her thing.
11:40I've been doing my thing.
11:42I think if the world fell apart and I needed to make a call, I could call right away.
11:45I was at her birthday a couple years ago in Vegas, and, you know, she's always been consistent.
11:49Her team, Jaime Terry, her business team, they're all consistent and kind.
11:53And Joey, her bodyguard, I see him on the streets here in New York sometimes, and it's always a high
11:57-five and a hello.
11:58You can't have a 28-year relationship and have it go sideways unless it's really messy, and it's not.
12:04Wayne Scott Lucas, thank you for talking about the Super Bowl again until next year.
12:09This was so calm and kind.
12:10Yeah, next year we'll talk again.
12:11Maybe I won't do it again, but I'm glad that we spoke about it, and thank you for the space.
12:16I trust you, so I came to talk to you about it.
12:19What will it take, though, for you to let it go?
12:21I've let it go.
12:23If not one more person calls and asks to ask me what happened, I probably won't, but I've let it
12:29go, and what it's going to take is I wrote a book, and Janet gave me a publisher that I
12:33can possibly work with and an agent, so I am going to write a correct accounting of what happened, like
12:40a countdown, if it matters.
12:42But when I tried to sell the book called World Drip Malfunction, nobody wanted it, they said, you know, and
12:46the Jacksons have, you know, 240-page NDAs that you really can't say much, so you have to respect them.
12:52But I think when the book comes out and I do interviews for that, that should put it to rest,
12:57because it's to rest in my head.
12:58If Justin didn't do this, I wouldn't be sitting with you right now.
13:01It's good to see you.
13:02It's to rest.
13:03I love you.
13:03All right, good to see you, mate.
13:04And we love page six.
13:05We love page six.