00:00Well, President Trump is hosting a meeting with tech executives, Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg, Anthropics Daria, NVIDIA CEO Jason Huang
00:08and OpenAI President Greg Brockman, all expected to attend.
00:12The gathering will focus on finding a balance between innovation and oversight as concerns increase about AI going rogue.
00:20Well, let's talk to Rob Nyers, the founding partner of H3 Capital, the London-based technology venture capital firm.
00:27Rob, welcome back. Good to see you.
00:30OpenAI says the model had problems staying within the scope and authorization given by users.
00:36For those of us who don't understand what that means, what could an AI agent do if it goes rogue,
00:43if it goes beyond those boundaries?
00:46Sure. And again, it's a bit disingenuous the way OpenAI has told it, but effectively it's a tool.
00:51And if it thinks it's achieving things that exceed what you're normally allowed to do
00:57in terms of testing limits, trying to find alternative ways to access a website,
01:01there's certainly lots of ways that it can potentially penetrate a website in unexpected ways.
01:05But also there's guardrails that these companies do put in tools to tell the systems to think about rules or
01:12think about laws.
01:12What are you doing?
01:13But also right now they're very heavily incentivized to create a lot of hype that their models are amazing.
01:18So to me, it's a bit of back and forth whether or not it's actually too much of a risk
01:21or they're also overhyping it right now for a better IPO valuation.
01:24We've already seen OpenAI systems access that Australian government website and systems without authorization.
01:33For mere mortals, I mean, just how worried should we be?
01:39None of the attacks that they're so-called doing are really that innovative.
01:43A lot of them are frankly the same thing a human could do if they had the time and persistence.
01:46I think we're at a time right now where because you can now really test all these systems much more
01:50thoroughly
01:51than you may have in the past. It's exposing holes that have probably been there for a while
01:54and just no one had happened to stumble upon them.
01:56So with all the ones I've read about so far when people are accessing data,
02:00usually it's a system configuration, something they've set up that's been active for years
02:03or been open for years, just so happens these systems can be really thorough
02:06and search all different possibilities that maybe humans hadn't gotten to yet.
02:10Now you will know that some argue that these risks can be addressed through better engineering
02:14and stronger technical guardrails, as you've been suggesting.
02:18Others say, of course, that government regulation is the only way ahead.
02:23Which is it?
02:25I think it's a combination.
02:26I mean, I think these companies, you know, at the scale they're operating at,
02:29right now they're all in a land grab to try and build more momentum.
02:32I think once they get sort of out of stasis, you're going to see a lot more guardrails
02:36that are smart around what they release.
02:37And I think they'll certainly have things inside the system that says, you know,
02:40don't do illegal things, don't do X, Y, and Z, like it already does with certain types of terror content
02:44or explosives content.
02:45I think likewise you'll see some sort of accountability on the government side coming in
02:49with the regulations that every country, similar to like speeding in your car,
02:52you know, the car can go fast, but if you speed, you make it a ticket.
02:56I think similarly you'll see a lot more restrictions that people will be responsible
02:59for what they guide the AI to do.
03:01So it's a combination that the systems designers will probably have guardrails
03:04that generally discourage them from doing things that are unethical, illegal, or otherwise dangerous.
03:09And then likewise, people will be, you know, find some way of being held responsible
03:12for the actions that they've led to cause.
03:15Rob, good to talk to you.
03:17Thanks for that.
03:17Rob Nyers, the founding partner of H3 Capital, the London-based technology venture capital firm.
