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00:00Parents strongly caution, this program contains some material that is unsuitable for young children.
00:40Beyond the Tape, we'll be back after these messages.
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03:00The policy makers, the critics, the movers, and shakers of our nation.
03:06We bring you the stories behind the soundbites and connect the dots to bring you the complete picture.
03:13Through hard-hitting discussions and intimate interviews, from the community to the corridors of power, we cover it all.
03:44Good evening, Trinidad and Tobago, our global audience, and of course, our brothers and sisters in Grenada.
03:50This is Beyond the Tape, and I am Whitney Husbands.
03:53Now, today is Wednesday, so it's smack in the middle of the week.
03:56And I always say it's officially humday, because by the time we blink, we'll be in to the weekend.
04:01But today, it's all about legal discussions.
04:04And of course, the man who is always willing to guide us, he is a strong person, I should say,
04:09when it comes to the laws of Trinidad and Tobago,
04:12and understanding it and guiding us, the citizens, for us to know the law.
04:17And he's always willing to be our attorney at law, and also the director of PACSO.
04:22We have Mr. Ali.
04:24Good evening to you, sir.
04:25How are you?
04:26Whitney, what an introduction.
04:27You know, you keep, you know, escalating until you move the good things, you know, to expose me to something.
04:36It's only right, because, listen, you don't have books in front of you.
04:40I mean, you read books on a daily.
04:43I know you always tell me with me, my eyes, I always read, and you're always trying to stay on
04:47top of things and know what is happening.
04:49And when you come before us, you try your best to go in that memory bank of yours to answer,
04:54and you answer so seamlessly.
04:56And that is something that is commendable.
04:59Well, you know, Whitney, I see that you're paying deep observation.
05:03Yes.
05:03You know, when you describe me like that, no books, but you're aware that, you know, I...
05:09You are reading.
05:10With my reading, you know, to be able to, you know, share very important information to the members of the
05:14public.
05:14You know, you have identified something very important, and especially with young people, you know, following the program as well,
05:19with parental guidance, the importance of seeking knowledge.
05:23You know, and I'm happy that you made mention of that, because, and like, you know, we're speaking from a
05:28legal context,
05:29but everything in life, you know, seeking knowledge is so important to help you to exist and exist properly.
05:35Yes.
05:35I'm happy that you made mention of that.
05:37So thank you very much as well.
05:39And you do similarly as well, because I heard some time ago you were a student in the area of
05:46criminal justice as well.
05:47Yes, I stopped.
05:47I crossed that, yeah, I stopped.
05:49But I will urge you to continue, because this platform, you know, criminal justice experience, knowledge, you know, is very
05:55important.
05:55And I could see sometimes the passion within you when you're examining the criminal justice, you know, why this is
06:01not happening, why this is not happening, you know.
06:03So I'm always excited to be here to join you, very important discussions, and of course to join you to
06:09always recognize our producer and our technical staff, you know,
06:12coming in on the evening and seeing, you know, the requirements and what, you know, has or have to be
06:19done.
06:19Yes.
06:20To prepare for the engagement with the nation, with the citizenry, I should say, you know, it's commendable and very
06:27important role and functions.
06:29My law enforcement colleagues and also in the private security industry, it's always a pleasure and honor to engage you
06:34as well.
06:36You know, Whitney, I've been advised.
06:38Yes.
06:38That many persons utilize these platforms as classrooms as well.
06:44Yes.
06:44That, you know, the things that they hear, you know, they make notes and then they reproduce it, you know,
06:50to be able to teach other persons.
06:51And that is healthy for us, because that's the whole purpose of sharing information.
06:54Don't keep it for yourself, but share it so you can make sure that it's a bigger or better place.
06:58And most importantly, the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago.
07:01Oh, nice.
07:01You know, this is a very important group.
07:05And I always say with all the citizenry, there's no nation.
07:08So to the citizenry, you know, I embrace you, not literally, but I embrace you from the platform.
07:14Yes.
07:14I hope that we are meeting you in a state of comfort in light of all that is happening, you
07:18know,
07:19continue to be resilient wherever you are.
07:21Now, you spoke of information and of constantly being informed.
07:26Your thoughts on the budget that happened on the 12th of October.
07:30And there was a lot, but we are directing it specifically to the allocations of, I think,
07:36it was 7.1 around there, billion, for the national security.
07:41So 7.3 around there.
07:43Your thoughts?
07:44Well, you know, Whitney, as a citizen of Trinidad and Tobago, you know,
07:48and I see context in which I'll take it, you know, permit me to take it as a citizen of
07:50Trinidad and Tobago.
07:51So a budget is a very important statement, and a very important statement to be able to know exactly where
07:58we are going
07:58from a financial and economic context.
08:00And, you know, I didn't have the opportunity to digest the budget in detail,
08:05but from what I'm seeing, you know, reading in the open source, you know,
08:09I'm seeing an effort to try and, you know, put persons in a better position.
08:14Technology-driven, it seems it's a direction the money is allocated mainly for.
08:19Yes, to put persons in a better position, you know, security-wise and otherwise,
08:23and I'm seeing, you know, an intentional move to invest in law enforcement.
08:29And I want to make mention that the investment in the law enforcement,
08:32that's something that we should take seriously,
08:33because if the taxpayers' money are being spent on national security,
08:38it's important for them to get value for their monies.
08:41So, as I said before, I didn't digest it in depth in some of the various sectors,
08:45but as we go along in the next couple of days, I intend to have a deep read in it,
08:48especially when I sit as Director of Policy as well,
08:50to see, you know, what's happening with any miniature form
08:53and where I can take certain steps to, you know,
08:56apply the funding for the best interests of the people of Finland.
09:00Because it's only two days after the budget,
09:01and we did not get the full details.
09:03As it continues, we will see when they lay out everything
09:07and give full guidelines as to what is being done from the allocations,
09:14and I know you'll be able to speak further on it,
09:16and the public as well will gather more information so we can move forward.
09:20That's correct.
09:20And when you have the opportunity for, you know, all parties,
09:23the presenters and then the responders,
09:26so you are placed in a better position to be in, you know,
09:28so then you can make proper decisions or you can, you know, make informed positions.
09:32But as it stands, you know, like anything else, as I said before,
09:36I'm seeing a deliberate step to try to make the lives of persons better.
09:40You know, of course, you cannot please 100%.
09:42You can't.
09:43So there will be persons who will be disgruntled,
09:44and you have to listen to them as well and see whether you can...
09:47And weigh options and know what is the best decision for your society.
09:50And of course, as I always said, mature and balanced thinking and actions.
09:55See, I'm still learning.
09:56Well, I realize that you do have a book and you take a note as well.
09:59Yeah, well, I mean, I learn as I go along, and that is very important.
10:02Now, let's dive in now with regards to...
10:04I find you using that word diving.
10:05Well, I mean, I'm next to the course, so I'll be diving in even further.
10:09The Parent Responsibility Act.
10:10You could take us there with regards that it's coming into fruition.
10:16Well, all I'm advised at this time is that there's discussions in relation to that.
10:20That proposed policy slash bill.
10:25And I have not seen the specific provisions of that proposed policy slash bill.
10:31But from my intelligence, it will be extended, and I want to use this word,
10:38extending the, what should I say, strengthening or imposing serious duties and responsibilities upon parents.
10:51And I want to say that if you look at the Children's Act, Whitney, and I think sometimes we need
10:55to factor this in.
10:56While we may be moving in any direction of having a legislation to hold parents accountable,
11:02when you look at the Children's Act, there are provisions within the Children's Act to be able to hold parents
11:08accountable.
11:09And a simple case in terms of where parents may be in neglect.
11:13Very wide circumstances in relation to neglect.
11:17So there's some legislative provisions that can deal with parents if they're in neglect.
11:24Just by way of example into the intelligence, this particular policy and bill may be going in any direction where,
11:29if, for example, a parent is required to come to school, let's say, for example, a child is exhibiting some
11:36behavior,
11:38and the parent is called, and the parent is not coming,
11:41you may have a situation where law enforcement may be empowered to go and conduct inquiries to look for that
11:46parent,
11:47and to be empowered to be able to treat with that in terms of the parent's duty and responsibility that
11:53they are not performing.
11:54So you're basically, you know, forcing the parents to play their role in relation to those, to that particular child.
12:00So, and, you know, I want to say on the other side, it's so unfortunate that we have to legislate
12:07to enforce a parent or a caregiver
12:12to do what they are supposed to do where the children is concerned.
12:16Yeah.
12:17You know, Whitney, I will say...
12:18To behave in a certain manner and all, because by our actions, they will be observing that and feel it's
12:22okay.
12:23Correct. And I'll say, you know, I'm a grown person, and you know my mother and my father still in
12:32choir.
12:34You reach home, you're going to work.
12:37Or, I didn't like what was done there.
12:39That's correct. That's correct.
12:41Right. And you receive that, not as a disrespect, but your parents let you know.
12:44You're dropping the ball.
12:45That's correct.
12:46Regardless of age.
12:47That's correct.
12:48So I understand, I can relate my parents the same way.
12:50So that parenting never came to an end after you passed 18.
12:56Yeah, no.
12:56So, you know, something is important.
12:58And I think, you know, yesterday evening we were talking about lived experiences.
13:03Here it is Whitney Husbands sharing with the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago, when he's speaking about parenting,
13:09that even at our age, we continue to be supervised by our parents.
13:15And that's the significance to maintain and continue to hold on.
13:20God bless you with them.
13:20Or, in a case where God, you didn't have biological children, but you're connected to our child.
13:26Contribute.
13:27Play a role.
13:28We should have to be forcing you through law to pay attention to your child.
13:32And I always say, Whitney, that even if you don't have the means, whether it be from an economic, social
13:37context,
13:38look around and try to get the support and don't throw your hands in the air and give up.
13:44And that's why this word resilient was so important.
13:46I know you love a term that I use.
13:47You may be in a vulnerable position where you don't have the necessary finance or in poverty.
13:56But they don't give you the right to go and steal.
13:58At all.
13:58I rather beg.
13:59Look for the opportunities.
14:01Ask.
14:03And let's move.
14:04So, perhaps in the next coming days and weeks, once I start to get a deeper look at that particular
14:11policy slash bill,
14:12I'll be able to share a little more to the situation at Arden and Tobago.
14:16But I don't know whether, in fact, it will be subject to further consultation.
14:20But it's something that we need to look for.
14:22And it's definitely in the thought process.
14:24Yes.
14:25A lot to delve into when it comes to these new legislations, bills.
14:29Things that are being passed and also suggested as well.
14:33Now, Corporal Ali, our Timmy.
14:38I don't know what to say again when it comes to men.
14:42This video in particular, we are seeing.
14:44Now, we still don't know what led to whatever.
14:47But the behavior, it was deplorable.
14:50Take a look at this.
14:59So, Michelle, we are not sure if it is that argument was happening there between the man and the woman
15:09that you're seeing on the screen.
15:12But it escalated.
15:15And we could see who is the dominant person here with this incident.
15:26And it continues.
15:29Now, we're still not sure if this is local.
15:32But even if it is local or not, the behavior.
15:38And this is like some weeks out of seeing an incident that was circulating online.
15:42Look at this.
15:43This is terrible.
15:46For you to feel comfortable, Mr. Ali, to do something like this.
15:51To a woman who brought you in this world.
15:54That is crazy.
15:56At no point in time, you're going to say to yourself, let me stop.
15:59This is craziness.
16:02Well, Whitney, it's very sad to see, you know, when you're looking at gender violence.
16:06Yes.
16:07And, you know, when we look at that particular situation, of course, we cannot define what level of certainty until
16:12we know the depth in terms of whether it's a robbery, whether it's a kidnapping, whether it's an abduction, or
16:20whether it's a domestic situation.
16:21Yes, we don't know.
16:22That has physical violence and other forms of abuse.
16:25Yes.
16:25But whatever it may be, gender violence, very serious matter.
16:27And just a couple of weeks ago, we were bombarded with reports of serious issues of domestic violence in Tobago
16:35and in Trinidad.
16:36A woman is critical and was seriously injured.
16:38Including children being exposed in this situation.
16:40Yes, yes.
16:41And I don't know whether you play this video, you and Jackie, as, you know, probably deja vu, if I
16:46should say that.
16:47But within the last couple of hours, I receive a directive to put together a national steering committee to look
16:54at proposed reform as it relates to domestic violence in Trinidad and Tobago.
16:59And I know that these citizens may have heard, yeah, we're looking at domestic violence over the years and over
17:03the months.
17:04But when I show you something, that come tomorrow morning, and I saw the urge from both the state agencies,
17:11non-state actors, and in this case, international agencies, who want to lend that support.
17:16It's an area that we are going to look at to see how we can strengthen from our legislative, from
17:20our institutional, even from our shelter, domestic shelter context, if I should say that.
17:27To be able to protect and intervene at early stages, and this is the key here.
17:32Sometimes we tend to be looking at the victim.
17:35But it's important for us to look at the offender.
17:38Because sometimes, and without giving a defense, sometimes the offender is crying out for help.
17:43And sometimes we're not looking at it in any way that we should be looking at it.
17:45So, at very early stages, for example, if you've seen signs of verbal abuse, and you're aware of it, when
17:52we intervene, let's intervene across the board.
17:55So that you're looking at both victim and you're looking at the offender.
17:58So you're not striking an imbalance in terms of how you're approaching the situation.
18:02Now, Mr. Ali, I will say this quickly.
18:04I believe if there's evidence, and as you said, hopefully they could pass this in the laws or whatever the
18:10case may be.
18:10But when an incident happens and there's evidence that it shows that a person was abused in a domestic situation,
18:16that even if the victim does not come forward, right, or they retract the report, that action could still be
18:25taken.
18:27Because I have an issue with that.
18:29Well, I know you're a very strong advocate for that, and on a previous occasion, I know you advocated heavily
18:33on this platform in terms of where a victim may be reluctant for many different reasons.
18:37Whether, in fact, that brings an end to any criminal charges that can flow.
18:41And, you know, while that in itself may require for me to go very deep in terms of probably hours
18:45of discussion to look at, you know, that particular argument that you're putting forward, legal argument, you know, we can
18:52look at it in many different ways.
18:53But I get the point in terms of if a victim may be reluctant, let's say for fear, maybe psychosocial
19:00issues.
19:01You know, I think that in terms of our proposal, I want to give you the undertaking on the citizenry
19:05that it's an area that we'll be looking at very closely to see whether, in fact, as you indicated, even
19:10if the victim is not coming forward, what other alternatives that we can use to be able to still prosecute
19:15someone?
19:16Now, may I say, you know, on this platform, I try not to get too legalistic sometimes.
19:21But, you know, when you push me to the extent, sometimes I may have to indicate it.
19:26If I am advising on a matter like this, and there's a domestic violence situation, I'm hoping that the law
19:30enforcement are paying attention as well.
19:32If I go to the victim and I record a statement from the victim on the basis of the victim,
19:36of course, psychosocially assessed and in a level of preparedness, give the statement.
19:41But any process indicates their reluctance for the reasons given to go to court.
19:46I think that, you know, the law is there to be able to rely on the paper with public corroborating
19:52evidence to be able to prosecute the matter.
19:53So, you know, I don't like to get legalistic, but, you know, there are things that I can use.
19:57There are ways that we can do it, but I get your point in terms of strengthening it and making
20:03it known to the citizenry in terms of where a criminal prosecution can still proceed,
20:11even if what we expect to go before a prosecution, let's look at alternative phrase.
20:16So, excellent point that you have made, and I assure you, we will be considering that in the reforms.
20:20Beautiful. At this time, it's time for us to take a look at what's making today's headlines.
20:50And those are your stories making today's headlines.
20:52Remember, you can give us a call, but we need to take that break.
21:09We all know that not only fists and butt wounds can beat you down.
21:14You don't have to believe what the police say you are.
21:17You can become whoever you choose to be.
21:20Never alone lies on the skulls will stop you from shining.
21:24It's time to make a change.
21:26Be a body, not a bully.
21:28Tell someone.
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23:30All those things I didn't say were wrecking balls inside my brain.
23:34I will scream out loud tonight.
23:37Can you hear my voice this time?
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23:45This is my fight song.
23:47Take back my life song.
23:50Proving my right song.
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24:11This is my fight song.
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24:28And welcome back.
24:29It's Legally Speaking Wednesdays.
24:30Of course, we have our attorney and director here with us, Mr. Ali, who is here with us each and
24:35every Wednesday, which we always happy to have been here.
24:37Just to let you all know, remember, you can give us a call for today only at 299-0047, extension
24:441996 or 1997.
24:47Remember the number again, 299-0047, extension 1996 or 1997.
24:54Now, just a quick reminder about the TTPS town meeting that is happening in the Southern Division.
25:00And that is in the Princess Town area, now, Princess Town Police Station District.
25:05It's on, which is tomorrow, Thursday, the 15th of October, at JD's building, High Street, San Fernando.
25:12I should say High Street, Princess Town.
25:14My apologies.
25:15From 6 p.m.
25:16Residents are invited to come out and meet the senior officers of the Southern Division.
25:21Let's work together for a safer community.
25:23And again, we stress on this, Mr. Ali, that persons really need to come out.
25:28Please, and speak to the officers.
25:31See the officers.
25:32Let the officers see your faces as well.
25:34Build that relationship.
25:36Well, you know, and keep it with the police service strategic objectives or goals, as the case may be, very
25:42much in line.
25:43But the key here with these song meetings, everyone, and I'm speaking from a legal context, everyone advocates for an
25:51opportunity to be heard.
25:52Yes.
25:54This song meeting is designed to give the citizens an opportunity to be heard.
26:00And may I say that in a very careful context.
26:03It's one to urge the citizens to strive on the opportunity to be heard.
26:08Yes.
26:08Take the opportunity to be heard.
26:11And importantly here, the law enforcement officers and other support officers, this is an opportunity for the persons to be
26:18heard.
26:20Ensure that it has been conducted in a meaningful way.
26:22And what is the best way to be heard with me?
26:24By showing up and speaking, let your voice be heard, letting them know your concerns.
26:29So today I will tutor you a little more because you say you love to be tutored.
26:33When we say an opportunity to be heard, and the best way to manifest an opportunity to be heard, is
26:40that when you give the person an opportunity to be heard, speak up.
26:45There is an anticipated response that they are expecting.
26:48So in other words, you are not asking them to be heard to say, okay, like for example, Whitney, can
26:52you assist me?
26:52But Whitney stands there and like, how can I assist you?
26:57Let's say for example, I say, Whitney, can you assist me?
26:59With this phone you can, you reach out, you hold the phone, thank you.
27:02I was meaningfully heard.
27:04Yes.
27:05Because I required something.
27:07I'm not telling a story so that, for example, in this talk meeting, when you want to be heard, sir,
27:12I'm having a problem.
27:13There's obstruction in front of my way.
27:16So we give you a chance to be heard.
27:18What is expected now?
27:19To deal with the obstruction.
27:20To respond.
27:21Then I am properly heard.
27:22Yes, and understood.
27:24We have a caller on, hold caller.
27:25Good evening.
27:27Hello.
27:29Good evening.
27:30Hi.
27:31Good evening.
27:32No, Charlie.
27:34There are very little, I'm not alone.
27:39You are alone.
27:40No, no.
27:41Now, I was thinking, you know, like first of all, Dr. Khaled, that's a pry contract.
27:46This initiative we need.
27:48If you need to stand up in charge, if you down into somebody, you have to get injury, you'll
27:51see if you are weak, you're not fun now coming to you to help people be victim.
27:58The other point, when you're planning to make it, is that if you're not victim, in
28:03In that case, right, in this case, 6, 15, 20, 50 years, I would like to, I don't want to
28:10think outside the government, I just think too terroristic.
28:14I would think that if you're a victim in an expanse, that is extended for years ago, no, no, no,
28:19no.
28:19What about the time that the victim and the perpetrator meet with the officer, some officer is going to be
28:27police and organize something instead of prostrating the victim more
28:32after all that whole deal, after 16 years, they're waiting for case, somebody will come, police will come, the prostitutes,
28:39they're supposed to fix this.
28:41In this manner, if the officer wants to fix this case up, and pay an example that they are victims,
28:51as it is, they go to the magistrate and explain this,
28:55and do the whole thing instead of being scared to keep it here.
28:58So, this is all acceptable.
29:01It's time to get a massive subject, and do the right answer to stop suffering.
29:05Have a best one.
29:05With me.
29:06Alright, thank you so much, scholar, Ms. Ali.
29:10Scholar, you normally refer to me, and I recognize the voice, you normally refer to me as Dr. Zaheer Ali.
29:15But perhaps you yourself is showing evidence of a critical thinker.
29:25Where he has taken us from his submissions is a term that we have played with, restorative justice.
29:32Perhaps.
29:33Where you have, what he's calling for, is bringing the parties together to find a resolution.
29:39Now, of course, that will have to be measured in the particular circumstances of particular cases and offenses.
29:44But I like where the thought process is going.
29:47And I want to signal the Minister of Homeland Security, the Minister of Justice in particular, two very important ministries.
29:54That's the direction that the lens, or the lens that we are, you know, looking through.
30:01In terms of looking at restorative justice and really promoting what really restorative justice means.
30:05So, that's the first thing.
30:06The second thing in what you said, and I said, I don't like to be too legalistic, but sometimes you
30:11and the callers push me.
30:12You know, sometimes you set that stage, you set that stage, right?
30:16So, normally I like to grasp wrong within discussions, but now you're pushing me into the law.
30:22There's a legislation that calls the plea discussion, plea agreement legislation.
30:29And I know that the judiciary and I, you know, justice of appeal lucky when doing the judicial education.
30:38Strong advocate, with reference to that plea discussion, plea agreement, together with other esteemed members of the judiciary and the
30:49panels, if I should say that.
30:59We have not, in my respectful view, seen a deep and an effective use of that legislation.
31:05And one need to examine why that legislation is not being used or a preference.
31:11And I say that on a basis where, if you are charged with me, or even with that plea bargain
31:16where you are suspected of a criminal offence, and I'm in a criminal context.
31:20You have the option, based on the strength of the evidence.
31:23The accused must know, the suspect must know, that he has that right through his attorney to be able to
31:29enter, of course, with the DPP department.
31:33But it's showing an opportunity for early o'clock to determine where you're going.
31:38So you're not really going to be engaged in a system for months and years.
31:44When you, in your heart, no listen, if I enter a plea, this might be the outcome.
31:48This is where the state might be able to offer.
31:50And I think that that is where we need to be radical.
31:52And that's what if you know that you're really guilty.
31:55Well, not if you, not if you know you're guilty.
31:58But both sides, not only if you know you're guilty, the police is going to do an investigation.
32:02Well, yes.
32:02And they're going to gather the evidence.
32:04And when this evidence now is shown to you, and you look at it, this is where you expect that
32:11level of reasonable conduct.
32:12You say, listen, am I going to waste the court time?
32:14Look at how hard the evidence is.
32:16And this is where we need to be mature in what we're doing.
32:18But some persons like to say, you know what?
32:20Perhaps if I take it through the process, after two years, the witness might give up.
32:24Yes.
32:25Or things may go missing.
32:26You know, and I don't mean to go that way.
32:28But that's why I ask the question.
32:29Once someone is not guilty, you know to yourself you didn't commit this crime.
32:34Different story.
32:35Now, then that's a different story.
32:37Different story because you are not guilty, so you don't expect someone to plead guilty if they're not guilty.
32:42Correct.
32:43So, and that's what I'm calling for when we talk about restorative, looking at the parties.
32:47The pre-bargaining also bring the parties together.
32:49Prosecution, defense.
32:50Let's see what you have.
32:51And let's make some decisions.
32:52And I'm saying that that is also another way, in my respectful view, to be able to deal with what's
32:57happening up in the prison.
32:58You see, all those persons in Raman, they can be treated with in a particular way.
33:03The question is whether they are acting maturely in relation to treating those matters.
33:07And let me go back to your point.
33:08If you're not guilty, you're not guilty.
33:10But if you've seen hard evidence, you're instructing an attorney, you're looking at the criminal justice system, some level of
33:17maturity.
33:17But you know what trumps?
33:20Perhaps, along the way, are with this might fall off.
33:22They might fall off because they're there for many years.
33:24That's correct.
33:24And as the cycle goes, you need to take that break.
33:26We'll be back.
33:31I never see if I have a subject called bullying on a timetable yet.
33:36But all them children want to beat up other children instead of beating their book.
33:42And to me, that is big, big failure.
33:46I promise to do my part to stop the bullying in the people at them school.
33:52But you see parents, you see uncles, you see grannies, you see aunties, you see nenens, all of them.
33:59And all of you, all you have to help out too.
34:02All you have to teach them the right way, boy.
34:05They have to choose peace, not physical and verbal violence.
34:11Teach them to be a body, not a bully.
34:16Tell somebody.
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36:26For the investigations that matter most to TNT, turn to the team you trust.
36:31The TV6 News.
36:32We do the work to uncover the facts, ask the important questions, and report on the issues that impact your
36:37community and the nation at large.
36:40This is more than just news.
36:41It's accountability.
36:43The undisputed number one program in Trinidad and Tobago.
36:46Delivering the hard-hitting investigations you rely on.
36:48The TV6 News.
36:50Revealing facts.
36:51Provoking opinions.
37:03And we're back.
37:04Remember, you can give us a call on this number 299-0047 extension 1996 or 1997.
37:11We have a caller.
37:12Caller, good evening.
37:13Hello, good evening.
37:14Hi, good evening, ma'am.
37:15How are you?
37:16I'm doing fine, actually.
37:18What do you mean, be on the tape?
37:20Yes, you're live.
37:21Go ahead.
37:22Yes, you're good.
37:24Mm-hmm.
37:26From Mr. Ali.
37:27Yes, you can go ahead.
37:28He's right here.
37:28Hi, good evening.
37:29Okay, Mr. Ali and his husband.
37:30Good evening.
37:31I'm calling with respect to a wrecking service.
37:34Mm-hmm.
37:35All right.
37:36A car was, as far as the driver was concerned, was well parked on Drive-Rage Road.
37:43And someone, the helicopter came and removed the vehicle.
37:49When they got to the station, they collected the vehicle.
37:54They discussed it with the police and they said, the police told them it had to be parked.
38:00Three vehicles from the corner.
38:04Three?
38:05If the vehicle was parked, you know, Ministry of Works put down these lines on the pavement.
38:11Mm-hmm.
38:11And you can park behind it and you think you're safe.
38:14But now the police is saying that you're supposed to have, you're parked three vehicles from the corner.
38:23That is the length.
38:24But when I look at the motor vehicle and road traffic ordinance, chapter 48, 50, number 10, it says,
38:36he shall not park his motor vehicle within us, within a distance of nine meters from any corner.
38:44That's the length.
38:45It says, you have the Ministry of Works putting down these lines, nine meters, supposedly nine meters.
38:51And then the police are saying it's supposed to be three vehicles.
38:55When the person might have collected the vehicle, they were told, oh, you could go to court.
39:00And that is all.
39:01So, if we could please give us some very good, clear guidelines where a vehicle must be parked for it
39:09to be safe.
39:10Please, because it is unfair to the driver, you park behind the line in the Ministry of Works put down,
39:16and then police are saying three vehicles and up the re-outry, too.
39:23Could you please give us some guidelines?
39:26Thank you so much, ma'am.
39:28Mr. Ali.
39:28Thank you very much.
39:29And, you know, the fact that you have read from the Motor Vehicle and Road Traffic Act, chapter 48, 50,
39:34as amended,
39:35and, you know, very familiar with the distance, that nine meters that you spoke about in Tindafama Corner,
39:40you know, that is firm in my mind.
39:42And when you spoke about the area where the Ministry of Works,
39:47something steps in immediately there in terms of the Ministry of Works.
39:49You have tabled a law for me.
39:51You have tabled what Parliament has indicated in relation to the distance that one should keep from a corner.
39:57And if the Works is placing markings on the road,
40:00I will ask you kindly to permit me to investigate exactly the authority that they are acting upon in relation
40:06to those markings,
40:07and what exactly is the mischief that the marking is expected to prevent.
40:12And then let's see exactly whether, in fact, there's a conflict.
40:15And if so, I want to give the citizenry an assurance that I will engage both the Ministry of Works
40:22and Transport
40:24and also the licensing authority and the Trident and Topical Police Service and Extension by the Ministry of Homeland Security
40:30to really determine exactly what's the situation with that.
40:33So, please permit me to look into it.
40:35But from what you have read for us, I am familiar with that nine meters from a corner,
40:39and you have cited the law.
40:40From what I heard, you have basically given us the provisions,
40:45but the markings from the Ministry of Works,
40:47I just want to see what authority that they are acting upon,
40:49and also what's the reason and what mischief that they are looking to prevent.
40:52And let's look at both to see whether, in fact, there's a conflict and if it needs to be ironed
40:57out.
40:57But with Whitney, it's not the first time I've heard about not only this situation,
41:01but other situations where there seems to be a conflict in terms of, you know, the enforcement and the actions.
41:07And this call for what we begin this show with today, the word knowledge.
41:10Knowledge.
41:10Well, I started digging.
41:14Yes.
41:14And what they're stating here is that in Trinidad and Tobago,
41:18you're not allowed to park your vehicle within nine meters,
41:21approximately 30 feet of a road corner or intersection.
41:25This is covered by the Motor Vehicles and Road Traffic Regulations,
41:30Chapter 4850, Regulations 38, Rule 510.
41:34Now, parking near a corner, you must leave at least nine meters, 30 feet,
41:38between your parked vehicle and the corner or road intersection unless applicable traffic signs requires a greater distance.
41:48And that is what I know it to be.
41:49Even there, I have it marked a big yellow block that shows where.
41:53And even when I got wrecked being like literally too close to the yellow line or even touching,
42:00when I say touching the yellow line, and I was wrecked.
42:01So, even that, I am even very wary of that the car is not even touching the line of the
42:09block
42:09or the rectangular painting that they put on the pavement.
42:13But this is there, so I don't understand that three-car length thing.
42:16I think they need to double-check that.
42:18Yeah.
42:20Now, we have to take a short break, and when we come back, we'll continue with more.
42:24We always have so much to discuss.
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45:30Welcome back to Legally Speaking Wednesdays. We have a caller on the line. Caller, good evening.
45:35Hello.
45:36Hi, good evening to you, ma'am. How are you?
45:38I'm okay, thanks. Good evening.
45:40I would like to ask Mr. Ali about the people who were detained under the PDO during the SOE who
45:51were not yet released and have not yet been charged with a still remaining in jail.
45:56I saw that at the end of the SOE, the persons who were in charge were being released and those
46:04who were remaining in jail would have been charged.
46:07But this is, I'm aware of a case right now that I'm interested in and the guy is just sitting
46:12there with no charge.
46:15All right. Thank you.
46:18Caller, you've asked me a very sensitive question.
46:20And all I'll say to you is, now that the SOE has come to an end, if what you are
46:26saying, a person is still incarcerated on a preventative detention order,
46:32what I will advise you to do is to seek counsel and engage the authorities.
46:36And I can't say any more at this time, but, you know, that will be your recourse to be able
46:41to, you know, ensure that that person gets justice
46:44if that person has still been incarcerated under preventative detention order.
46:49One thing I may want to say in terms of an academic context, sometimes persons may have...
46:54No, in the situation where persons are, in the case where some persons would have already been incarcerated,
47:01but they would have been removed from a particular location to another location on a preventative detention order.
47:06But at all material times, they were serving, or I should say they were remanded before.
47:11But just because of the state of emergency, they were removed to another location because the intelligence may have suggested
47:16that they may also act in a manner prejudicial to public safety where they were remanded.
47:22So you need to look at the situation very carefully.
47:24If you've seen someone still there on a PDO to determine whether, before the PDO, whether they were remanded.
47:30And notwithstanding, yes, we come to an end.
47:33They have reverted back to the previous situation.
47:35Yes, we too.
47:35But my advice will be, if you are aware of that, because as someone, liberty, freedom of movement, constitutional issues
47:41involved,
47:42I will ask you to speak to an attorney immediately so the necessary intervention could be made
47:47in the best interest of that person and by extension in the public's interest.
47:50All right, we have another call.
47:51Good evening.
47:54Good evening, sir.
47:56Good evening, sir.
47:56I have a question.
47:57I have a question to you, sir.
47:59Yes.
47:59Because what you mean in the other time, we don't want to make laws to cover a sense of law.
48:05Now, Mr Ali, the only obstacle I am, I did, just on it, it would be, it would be, it
48:13would be necessary,
48:14the back of all cases are together was, and the other thing, sadly, is that the only obstacle I see
48:20here is,
48:21if the officer is a judge to do the challenge, he may not, he may want to win this case,
48:27all officers want to win the case, and the only problem is, if they just have to apply this,
48:33it doesn't go down there, both parties are going to treat them as a decision.
48:36If they have to complete an agreement, and the first way he has a case to be dismissed, when should
48:43you win this case?
48:44If everybody wants to just put the record on the side, you know, so that the only problem I see
48:48could happen,
48:49but besides that, it is very good for both parties.
48:51All parties, thanks a lot, sir.
48:53All right, thank you, Mr Ali.
48:56Yes, thank you very much.
48:56You know, very simple, we have dealt with the issue in terms of, where the plea bargain is concerned in
49:00particular,
49:00and as you indicated, the, what may be available, and I don't want to say what may be attractive,
49:06what may be available, and you, let me use your example.
49:08Yes.
49:09If there's a 15-year sentence, if you have found guilty, and if you, as the offender, look at the
49:15evidence,
49:15and realize the evidence is hard, and if I enter a plea of guilty, of course, adopting the proper protocols,
49:20with your attorney, the DPP's office, and you are afforded a discount, and I usually know what, a discount.
49:25It serves you well, or any other accommodation that the state may give you.
49:31Maybe they may give you less than 15 years.
49:33Or they may even give you a situation, if there's no violence, maybe I want a non-custodial sentence, maybe
49:37if you are fine.
49:38So, you know, you need to look at it with some wisdom and some maturity, and, you know, always,
49:43I cannot tell the lawyers what to do in a given situation, but, and I'm speaking about the defense attorneys
49:48and the prosecutors,
49:49but let us promote the, in the spirit and intent of the law sometimes.
49:54Let us promote the spirit and intent of the law, any way that we should do it,
49:57and in the best interest of all parties, because that's what the caller come in again to talk about,
50:02looking at all parties.
50:04We have spoken about all parties, even in a domestic violence context.
50:07Let's look at all parties, because all parties need to be looked at,
50:12albeit maybe in different circumstances.
50:14But thank you again, caller, for your contribution.
50:16All right, we have another call.
50:17Caller, good evening.
50:19Good evening.
50:19I'm just good evening.
50:21Hi, good evening to you.
50:22Good evening to you, sir.
50:25Charlie, I want you to listen to everything I want to say.
50:31It has been endorsed by the budget,
50:33and the conversations over the past few years,
50:38that there is a fill of 800 million over time to the police.
50:45I suppose to do it.
50:47I suppose to do it, because the bill has proven what I've been saying over a year of time,
50:53that we need about 6,000 more police than that we're doing.
51:05And it's about time, we've established about two more police center tools.
51:14I know we have one in forestry, I know we have one in forestry, I know we have one in
51:17south, but we need two more.
51:20So at least we're producing at least about 500 to 1,000 more police every year, because this thing can't
51:29go on forever.
51:30We're going to overwork the police, and over this period of time, we would not have a call to go
51:37for it.
51:39So let's take a look at that.
51:41Increasing the amount of training centers,
51:44we're going to force and increase the amount of police.
51:47We're going to force and increase the amount of police, and we're going to force and increase the amount of
51:51police, and we're going to force and increase the amount of police.
51:52All right. Thank you so much.
51:55Thank you very much, Kola.
51:57What I want to say to you, I have listened very attentively to you.
52:00I've taken notes mentally.
52:02I'll reduce it in writing subsequently, and I will engage the necessary authorities based on your submission.
52:07Very, very serious, and I don't want to take a position on it.
52:10I know that we can look at it with a different lens, but your point is noted, and I'll take
52:16it to the necessary authorities.
52:19That's all I'll say for now.
52:21All right.
52:22Well, I am just admiring the way in which you have to make sure that we are very cautious with
52:27the things that we do.
52:28Now, there was a major accident that took place today, and let me just tell you, it caused a lot
52:36of backup.
52:36Now, heading east on the highway in the Maloney area, a truck overturned with a load of sand.
52:44And this was...
52:46So, you know when traffic starts because of situations like this.
52:51Yes.
52:52The frustration.
52:54The inconvenience.
52:56Well, Whitney, I want to begin by indicating that I hope no one is seriously injured in that accident.
53:00Yeah.
53:01And if persons are injured, I hope that there's a quick recovery for those persons.
53:04And, you know, when you're looking at, you know, heavy equipment, because we're talking about a truck taking and conveying
53:11a load.
53:11Yes.
53:11It's important for the drivers, you know, to be warned, you know, that you need to be extra vigilant and
53:16careful, because it's a serious risk that you are bearing, not only for yourself, but also for the motorists that
53:23will be within your vicinity.
53:25And then when there's an accident, when there's an unfortunate situation like that, it normally plays the freedom of movement.
53:31Yes.
53:31For persons.
53:32For streets.
53:33You know, persons on, you know, long, you know, lines of traffic.
53:36But one thing, Whitney, in terms of those things, I know, you know, sometimes from a police context, of course,
53:40you know, we'd have to respond to look at the situation, markings, photographs, taking information.
53:45But I think that in order to deal with traffic issues, I think, in my respective views, I'm going to
53:50be able to look at from a policy context as well.
53:52How can we quickly deal with the situation?
53:55Yes.
53:55When something happens.
53:56Yeah.
53:56And like in that situation there, because there's what material on the ground, that's not a situation where there's .
54:02Yes.
54:02So, you know, we need to be looking in terms of what should be a possible response for dealing with
54:07accidents that may be causing unnecessary obstruction.
54:09And that is how we should now be as a society that is uplifting our thinking to be able to
54:15deal with a situation.
54:16We have another call.
54:17Caller.
54:18Good evening.
54:19And our final caller for the evening.
54:21I know something.
54:22If someone is driving a vehicle and they get into accidents and they do not have a driver's tunet, what
54:29are the consequences, if any, at all?
54:35So, is it valid or expired, even though it's not on them?
54:42Sorry?
54:43Is the driver's permit, even though it's not on them, is it a valid one?
54:47They never had a driver's tunet when they're driving, whenever they feel like, they never had a driver's tunet, they
54:54come out and get an accident, what is the consequences?
54:57That's not 50,000?
55:00That's not.
55:01With jail.
55:01From my recollection, I mean, I can check it.
55:05That's an arrest taken before the court for driving out a driver's permit.
55:08That's not an issue where you had a driver's permit that expired.
55:10No.
55:10And that's not driving it out.
55:11So, in other words, you never went through the process.
55:13You shouldn't be on the nation roads.
55:15And if you have no driver's permit with me, it means that the insurance of that vehicle does not fit
55:20you as well.
55:21So, you can also be charged for that in the circumstances.
55:24And the question is, the person who you got into contact with, they can take particular actions against you as
55:31well.
55:31So, very serious matter.
55:32So, those, and I'm happy that you raised that, those who have never been issued with a driver's permit, please
55:37do not take charge of any vehicle and do not go on the nation road.
55:40You do not have the authority to drive.
55:43They gave me 50,000.
55:44So, I went digging again, you know.
55:46Yes.
55:46And they said a driver's permit can attract a fine of 750 TT dollars imprisonment up to six months under
55:54Section 42-1 of the Motor Vehicles and Road Traffic Act.
55:58But time is against us. Ms. Ali, thank you so much for being here with us.
56:02We get ready for news up next TNT at 7 o'clock.
56:04God bless.
56:05Be safe.
56:06We're out.
56:07We're out.
56:08Bye bye yo!
56:11Bye bye.
56:13Bye bye.
56:14Bye bye, bye bye.
56:17Bye bye, bye bye, bye bye.