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The story of Arc Raiders is one of radical reinvention. Join us as Production Director Caio Braga explains the critical moment they decided to start over, shifting from a large-scale PvE concept to a tactical PvPvE game, and how data-driven design saved the project.
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00:00Picture this.
00:01You and your team have been slaving away for years on your latest game.
00:04The enemies are challenging, the setting is engaging, but the gameplay just isn't that
00:09fun.
00:10What do you do?
00:11This quandary is exactly what Embark Studios faced midway through the development of Ark
00:15Raiders.
00:16During a GDC talk entitled, When your AAA game isn't fun, the Ark Raiders' story of
00:21starting over with intent, Embark Studios' production director, K. L. Braga, explained
00:27how the studio reimagined the game from a Shadow of the Colossus-style multiplayer PvE
00:32game, to the tighter, tense and more tactical PvPVe we know today, a move famously labelled
00:38the reset.
00:40We caught up with Braga after the talk to dive more deeply into how Embark changed Ark Raiders,
00:45what player feedback has taught them about their game, and whether vehicles could one
00:49day make an appearance topside.
00:52I was really interested in the thing you said about, at the start of the talk, when
00:57you said that when you first joined, no one could really describe to you what Ark Raiders
01:01was.
01:02When you realised that there was that level of confusion, didn't you immediately panic
01:06and go, what's going on here?
01:08Yeah, as production and development like that, yes, that's the answer.
01:13But more than once than that, I started to understand why that was happening, and it came
01:18from a very good place.
01:19We wanted to give the teams a lot of autonomy to make a better game, but every single feature
01:25team that we had was doing their own thing, instead of using that autonomy to do something
01:31together.
01:32But at that point, it was a bit panicky, for sure.
01:35You also mentioned later in the talk that you kind of had to come to the realisation that
01:40you needed to stop trying to make the game you thought you wanted to make, and look at
01:45the game you actually had.
01:48Do you think that's like a common problem throughout gaming, that people kind of are too focused
01:52on what their initial idea was, and kind of lose track of what they've actually got in
01:56their hands?
01:57Yeah, I think so, it's not only for what they want to do, sometimes it's what the publisher
02:02wants or the market is asking, that you stop looking at what you have there, or just trying
02:07to go towards that goal, and not paying attention.
02:10For us, it was even a bit, speed was an interesting point there.
02:14The very first thing we did after the reset was reducing the speed of characters, everything.
02:19The actual speed in-world, of which they could move around?
02:23Yeah, exactly.
02:23It was very odd, because all the animations kept high speed, but we started to actually
02:28realise, oh, the sounds are great, the environment is great, but it was so fast before, we were
02:34not doing the same game, right?
02:36What kind of percentage did you change the speed by, would you say, roughly?
02:39Oh, I think it was like 60% slower.
02:42It's a very different game.
02:43Yeah.
02:44You talked about the big reset, and you said that Nexon embark's owners, at that point it
02:49was kind of the last chance, and that a lot of games would have been cancelled at that
02:52point.
02:53And I think you also mentioned the team size then dropped from like 100 to 25.
02:58But for the people who remained then, number one, how did you decide which 25 people you
03:03were going to keep?
03:04And then also, if I'm one of the 25 people, I'm like, how do I finish this game without
03:08all my colleagues who've left?
03:10How did you keep like the morale and the kind of spirit up amongst that group?
03:13So deciding who is based on expertise and capacity, right?
03:18We had a plan of doing this prototype using, I don't know if we put a number, 80% of
03:24what
03:24we had.
03:24A lot of changes like the speed, but still using a lot of the tech we had.
03:28So it's more about who do we need to prove that this is a good concept.
03:33To keep morale, I think one important thing was to bring the team into problem solving.
03:37They were the ones who proposed everything you see in the game.
03:40It was not the director going and telling the team to do.
03:43It was the team telling the director that feature would solve their problem.
03:46Actually, the team itself liked the freedom and autonomy from the previous one.
03:51What we didn't have was a product.
03:53And there was a way to just like, what do you like, but now with a goal.
03:56And the removal of it being a lot of silos who were operating independently.
04:00The reset led to scaling down the arc themselves from hulking behemoths to more targeted hunter-killers.
04:07Embark used data gathered from extensive playtesting to refine each arc's design and challenge.
04:13There was one time where arc came as a bad sentiment from players, the high level of it.
04:19And the team was like, oh, it's because there's not enough variety.
04:21We need to do a new one.
04:23Players are looking for a new arc.
04:25It's about content.
04:26And then the data team said, nope.
04:27Players love those top seven arcs.
04:30They hate those bottom three.
04:31Which ones were in the bottom three?
04:33Ooh, Hornet was the worst one at that time.
04:38Like the armor was insane.
04:38Because of the armor?
04:39Yeah.
04:40Players didn't understand the armor very well.
04:42The turret was very bad because at that time it didn't have the cone.
04:47It would just shoot.
04:48So there was zero understanding where it would shoot.
04:51And the third one was the fireball at the time because it did not have the opening as well.
04:57No weak spot?
04:58Yeah, exactly.
04:59Do you know what's funny is as soon as you describe them I can see the change.
05:03Is there any major feedback around the current arc where you're like, we should actually fix that?
05:09Not really.
05:10I think one next step of what I said was before releasing them.
05:17I think the better we can do is to fix them before we release and then see how it goes.
05:23Of course there is tweaks we still do on them.
05:26We do tweaks on like Leaper, Vision and like we're always evolving their technology and their behavior trees.
05:34We want to go quite deep on the tech for those things.
05:38And we are breaking a few, we have a few big breakthroughs there.
05:42So it's quite nice to see.
05:43Can you give me some examples then of like arc that during production you just couldn't get right?
05:49You had to kind of, because you said you had to throw some away that just kind of weren't fun.
05:52Yeah.
05:53What are some examples of those?
05:54Some, there are some of the big ones because they were being built for the other game that we're building.
05:59They had like bigger puzzles and they were made for the other arc raiders basically.
06:07We were working on them when we decided to reset the game.
06:10So we paused those.
06:12I think there were a few that we removed because they weren't very interesting gameplay.
06:17We had like these suicidal bots and some flashlight bots that just like come in front of you and explode.
06:23There's still gameplay, interesting gameplay to have with them but at that time it didn't fit the game very well.
06:29Every now and then when we need to do a new arc we look at our catalogue to see if
06:32there's any capability or any arc that could be brought back.
06:37The firefly attack for instance came from the previous enemy that we just revamped.
06:43I want the record to show I'm shaking my head about the firefly.
06:47Embark relies heavily on community feedback to continuously refine arc raiders, both vocalised and data driven, which often contradict one
06:55another.
06:56We asked Braga about balancing these competing voices.
06:59We continuously are tapping into community and seeing how they play, right?
07:03And it's quite challenging because we have those two quite polar fans of the game.
07:09But it's quite interesting as well.
07:11We also had a few moments where the team got way too friendly.
07:15It was just a few moments, not always.
07:18But we would try to balance that a little bit and see how much fun we can have on all
07:22ends of it.
07:23The team however was always leaning more aggressively.
07:26You mentioned as well with the data guys that initially PvP was very badly received in playtest.
07:31Partly it was like the silos versus squads thing.
07:35The data people said that it wasn't actually that the PvP was bad.
07:38It was that the weapon balance was off.
07:39That was what they could see.
07:40When your data guys look at the current state of PvP or the sentiment, what are they seeing now in
07:45the data?
07:46Balancing is still a big portion of the game.
07:49We can test just so much.
07:51Players like yourself and like a lot of other players will test faster than we can as a team of
07:56a hundred against millions of players playing.
07:59So for us there's a lot of that.
08:01Like trying to distinguish between anecdotal versus what the mass is doing.
08:07I think that's usually the challenge because in the community you're going to hear the guy who lost to a
08:13venator and got upset.
08:14While in the data we can say that a venator is okay.
08:18I enjoyed seeing the graphs you had that were kind of tracking metrics like enjoyment and confusion, interest to play
08:25again and frustration.
08:26And you mentioned that that helped guide you or feel confident about knowing when to release.
08:32Yeah.
08:33When you look across the industry and you see we've had some very notable high profile failures recently.
08:37Do you kind of like wonder what's going on behind the scenes and what are their graphs showing them that
08:40they're still kind of…
08:42Yeah, sometimes I do and I try to hope that they were given the same chance we had.
08:48Because it's so hard to put a game out that having the trust and the time to improve those metrics
08:54is something that not all studios end up having.
08:57They get cancelled or they're forced to launch something that is not yet good.
09:01So I feel for it to be honest. It's a part of the game I guess.
09:06I think you mentioned in your talk speaking about games that get cancelled is like don't take your talk as
09:11like a roadmap to follow exactly because all games are different.
09:15What are the kind of lessons you think you're worried that people would follow too blindly or might just try
09:20and copy without thinking about enough?
09:21It's a lesson to be very careful with how organic you do production.
09:26It works for smaller teams, it works for autonomous teams, maybe not for everyone.
09:30And we changed our formula so many times, which is the part I also think I hope other studios are
09:35looking into as well.
09:37Looking at production as a little formula that it can follow, it usually does not work.
09:41I really love the note you gave about how fixing the loot involved giving a lot of the kind of
09:48currency type items some more functionality.
09:51You gave the example of, you know, having fabric be able to heal you using, I guess, like the smaller
09:56power cells to fix a little bit of shield.
09:58And I think recently you've made like the pop triggers be, you know, a utility item that you can use
10:03as a grenade or as a weapon.
10:05How much design space remains for that kind of item creation?
10:11And can you can you tease us any kind of ideas you've got along those lines?
10:16It's very open actually, all of that, right? We want ARC to be a big part of that.
10:21So whenever there's a new ARC, we are looking to how to use their pieces for it.
10:27But every new item we add into the game, there's always a conversation about how can we use this?
10:32Can we, I don't know, use like something to remove the gas by throwing a empty hydrogen tank, not hydrogen
10:40is going to explode, but an oxygen tank or whatever.
10:42There's always ideas like that. We try to keep it very open because it's also for our pipeline something quickish
10:49to do if it's not very novel.
10:52So it's a nice thing to add for the players. I know there's a lot of value and if it's
10:58simple for us to implement, then why not?
11:00Do you plan to keep adding to the suite of musical instruments in the game? We've got the shaker and
11:04the guitar.
11:05Are we going to get to like full band at some point?
11:08Full band, not sure, but more instruments for sure. It is something we really, really like.
11:13We like what the moments that it creates, the emergent moments that it creates. So it's a cool one.
11:18We just added the pianos. So we're going to keep doing that.
11:22Can you give me some examples of like utility type items, you know, because they definitely feel like a major
11:28part of what makes the sandbox interesting.
11:30And like you said, leads to emerging gameplay. Do you try to get into the game, but just couldn't make
11:35work?
11:36I can tell of one we removed after the reset. We've had jump pads for a long time.
11:43And when you are running faster than using both and using jump pads, like the game turned into a very
11:48more whimsical game, I would say.
11:51But how did that fit with the lore of everything being kind of broken down and like patched together? What
11:56were the jump pads?
11:57Exactly. So it was one of the things we removed for two reasons.
12:02One, the unpredictability of it. We want you to be tactical in the game and know what you are doing.
12:07So we didn't have like directional jump pads, right? It was just a jump pad.
12:13And second, you couldn't fit this new lore of the game. Like before it was much more heroic and it
12:18fit a bit better.
12:19Even in the first trailer, there is a moment with like jump pads on top of the enemy. Those are
12:24not there anymore.
12:25Did you have the snap hook at the same time?
12:27Yes, we did.
12:28Because it feels like the snap hook has kind of fulfilled some of that function.
12:32Yeah, the snap hook is in the game since the beginning, but the snap hook managed to pivot well.
12:37Before it was a free use and it was just like Spider-Man.
12:41But how much are you trying? Because there's definitely a sense amongst the community of like,
12:44Embark doesn't want us to keep those snap hooks in our safe pockets. Does that bother you?
12:48Do you want people to risk more?
12:50We want people to risk. That is part of the game, right?
12:53But at the same time, we also don't want to ruin fun to anyone.
12:57So we're not removing thus far. But balancing is a bit of a black box.
13:05Tomorrow someone finds a new tech. You have to balance it.
13:09Do you consider it one of the most powerful items in the game at the higher skill levels?
13:13It is. Personally, yes. I think so. I don't know from a data perspective if that checks.
13:19I would say maybe not. But for my personal use, I love this network. It's so good to use.
13:25One of the pieces of feedback I saw after launch was that, oh, can you please turn the lights off
13:30in Stellamontis for the Night Raid?
13:32Because that would be like really scary. And then you guys did that very quickly.
13:35Yeah.
13:36What other player reactions have you seen since launch that have kind of confirmed or rejected some of the big
13:43debates you were having during development but before release?
13:48I think the most obvious one is the PvE crowd, right? Some people in the team had that feeling that
13:56it would be nice to play PvE in the game. But we didn't know. So they proved it to us.
14:01Did those PvE guys come in and like, I f***ing told you so? Like, I was right?
14:05Some of them not told you so. Don't do that. But what happened a lot was there was even moments
14:12where we asked the team to be more aggressive because we wanted to test the PvP and all of that.
14:18Nowadays, it changed a lot of play tests because our play tests have people saying like, I actually enjoy PvE.
14:24I'm going to play PvE because it's part of the game. I'm going to represent those players, right?
14:27That changed for us. Another cool thing from community was the rubber ducks. That's in your raider den. You have
14:35like everything in your inventory.
14:37Some player found like thousands of them and said like, oh, it doesn't show. In a day we went there
14:42and now we can have thousands of rubber ducks in your raider den.
14:45After five months and over 14 million copies sold, Ark Raiders continues to be one of the most popular extraction
14:52shooters around. We asked how Embark plans to support Ark Raiders in the years to come.
14:56You mentioned kind of like giving the developers on the team the tools to come up with their own solutions.
15:03You've also given the players a bunch of tools to come up with their own solutions.
15:06How do you feel like you keep building on that tool set without it becoming either over complex or kind
15:12of losing the lore and it being ridiculous?
15:14I think it's a little bit bound to exactly that, to the lore and the gameplay we want out of
15:20it. But out of that, the rest is just imagination and creativity, right?
15:25Like we have a bunch of ideas and not enough capacity to build them all. So we keep going through
15:32our lists and deciding what fits the game now, what needs we see.
15:36Do we see mobility is becoming a problem? Can we improve that or want to give more utility?
15:42And we are looking at the data and passing the challenge to the team as a tool and say, okay,
15:48we believe mobility has become a problem.
15:51Can you work on some ideas to close that gap and then let the team shine with that, right?
15:56And we do the same for tools. Like our internal tools are for that. It's for increasing their iteration time
16:04and make that fun for the players.
16:06One of the guys I play with asked me, do you think they'll ever add like any sort of vehicles?
16:11Could you have like a quad bike, for instance, with very limited fuel? Are vehicles like completely off the cards
16:17or something that's still...?
16:18It's not completely off. I think it's a bit quite open. We've talked about 10 years, right? We want this
16:25game to last for a long time.
16:27So I think everything is a bit open there, as long as it fits our lore and the kind of
16:32experience we want to give.
16:36We have prototypes for vehicles from seven years ago, haven't been touched in a while, but it's not off the
16:43table.
16:44You know, people on the dev team or the other testers doing stuff that's as crazy as the things we're
16:49seeing now,
16:49where like someone's snap hooking up to a Rocketeer, placing the deadline, snap hooking off the Rocketeer,
16:55letting the deadline explode and then snap hooking back to the wreckage and riding the wreckage down.
17:00Like I was watching that and going like, I'll be lucky if I can snap hook to a window on
17:03a building.
17:04Like...
17:05Yeah, no, our weapons designer is perfect at doing those things.
17:10He can do it.
17:11Yeah, he loves mixing all of the utility items.
17:15Like he is always doing that.
17:18And we have a couple of very, very good players as well.
17:22So they don't go whimsical, they go like utility more.
17:25Like one of them, his nickname is Hatch Camper.
17:29Hatch Camper?
17:30Hatch Camper, yeah, yeah.
17:31Oh, Hatch Camper.
17:32Yeah, exactly.
17:32Well, he sounds like a scumbag.
17:35He loves PvP in the game and he usually plays, I don't even know, he's like Spider-Man.
17:40He is here and then he jumps out and he's a zipline somewhere and he's behind you again.
17:44Like he kills whole squads all the time.
17:46And never want to be in a lobby with that guy.
17:48He is very good at the game.
17:50So we have both.
17:51We have people trying to encounter the fun mixes in there and some people just trying to be very efficient.
17:58So that's good because we have a mix.
18:00That's what we want from the players as well, right?
18:02That they can experiment with all of that.
18:03And so when you first saw that kind of behavior like popping up in game, you were like,
18:07okay, great, they get it.
18:08Were you kind of worried that you might just not see it?
18:10At least our weapons designer, Simon, he always said like this, the player is going to get this thing.
18:15It's something quite interesting.
18:18A lot of new games are doing ziplines and mobility and all of that.
18:23So emergent gameplay was something that even from the first version of the game was part of it since the
18:29beginning.
18:30If you enjoyed this chat, check out our interview with Arc Raiders game director Virgil Watkins
18:35on matchmaking, fixes and expedition changes.
18:38And for more news, reviews and previews of the latest games, subscribe to PC Gamer.
18:52And I'll see you next time.
18:53I'll see you next time.
18:55Bye.
18:58Bye.
18:59Bye.
19:01Bye.