- 4 weeks ago
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00:06The doors to the den are open once again and our five multi-millionaires are keen to dig
00:15deep and invest their cash to help the next generation of entrepreneurs find fortune and
00:22glory. They'll occasionally be joined by some special guests including health and
00:29fitness heavyweight Joe Wicks. I've got to give you a little cuddle because I'm feeling a bit emotional
00:34because you're struggling into a little bit. It's all right mate. Superstar fashion founder Emma Green.
00:40This is my opportunity just to pay it forward and we'll do some great business together. And style
00:45guru turned beauty mogul Trini Woodall. I mean I literally can I imagine going into business with
00:51you that's the thing I just don't know. Now the hunt is on to find the next big deal.
01:05Hi I'm Luke and I'm Owen. Oh gosh. And we're from Berkshire and we're non-identical twins three
01:11minutes apart. Do I look gay? Yeah. About me. Yeah I think so. There's normally a mix of people saying
01:20that we do look the same. Other people say that they can clear us apart usually followed by shortly
01:24calling us a wrong name. We do definitely get the twin telepathy. There is occasions where we'll both
01:29say the exact same thing at the exact same time. Luke and Owen might have a secret weapon, their
01:36sibling sixth sense, but facing the dragons remains a source of trepidation. A mix of excitement and
01:43nerves I guess. A little bit apprehensive. It's probably more the unknown about how it's going to go,
01:48what they're going to ask. Trying to remember the numbers. Yeah. Hopefully they'll be nice. Yeah.
01:54Fingers crossed.
01:58Hello Dragons. I'm Owen. And I'm Luke. And we're the twin founders behind the brand Doughboy's Pizza,
02:03a dynamic and engaging pizza brand disrupting the frozen pizza market. Today we're here to ask for a
02:09£90,000 investment in exchange for a 5% stake in our thriving business. Our journey began when I was
02:16working in the kitchen on my local pub and experienced firsthand the challenges faced by
02:20venues striving to offer a high quality food menu, especially amongst a growing skilled labour
02:24shortage. Many hospitality venues have had to resort to using ready-made food products such as
02:28inauthentic, highly processed frozen pizzas as a quick and easy food option which doesn't require a
02:33highly skilled chef. Similarly, within retail, the UK frozen pizza category is dominated by a handful of
02:39big manufacturers and blacking handmade authentic Italian pizza options. And so Doughboy's was born.
02:44At Doughboy's, we specialise in crafting premium, genuine Italian frozen pizzas specifically for
02:50the hospitality and retail sectors. All of our products are hand-stretched, hand-topped and stone-baked
02:56in Italy using fresh and locally sourced Italian ingredients. We've already experienced significant
03:01growth over the last few years supplying our multi-award-winning pizza products to over a thousand
03:05hospitality establishments across the UK. In addition to this, at the end of last year we launched our very
03:11first retail range, securing a listing with Ocado more or less straightaway. Since starting the company
03:16about three years ago, we've sold just shy of two million pizzas and generated a turnover exceeding
03:22£2.6 million. Thank you for your time and before you welcome any questions, we'd love for you to try
03:27our pizzas.
03:28Oh, yes. Frozen pizzas, which have been handmade in Italy... Right, here we go. ..are the offering from Luke and
03:38Owen Buckmaster.
03:39Now, for Deborah, we've got our plain base and we've added our own toppings to it, which is all plant
03:43-based. Lovely, thank you.
03:46They're seeking £90,000 in exchange for 5% of their business. We've got our margarita and also our mixed
03:53vegetable one. Great.
03:55Their product samples appear to be going down a treat. That's good. Thank you.
04:01But will the duo be able to lay their hands on a slice of the dragon's dough?
04:09So, let me get the track. This was made and frozen in Italy... Yeah. ..and shipped over to here... Yeah.
04:17..and then cooked. Correct.
04:20Yeah. So, how come you two know so much about pizzas?
04:24So, it's mainly... We don't really, as such. We left school and I wanted to become a chef, so I
04:31went and started working at my local pub, doing an apprenticeship.
04:35That was kind of exactly where, initially, they were just trying to simplify the menu as much as possible.
04:40And pizza was one of the obvious options.
04:42But the products that they were using and that they could access were just these frozen, sort of cookie-cutter
04:47-type pizzas.
04:49And we, yeah, kind of came together and thought, we'll give this a go.
04:53How do you know each other? Twins.
04:56Twin brothers? You missed that. I missed that. I thought you were mates.
05:01How old are you? We're 24. 24.
05:04And where were you based again?
05:05In Reading, Buckshire, but we're from... Well, we used to be based in Maidenhead.
05:10So, just talk me through your financials from the first year starting up to where we are today.
05:16So, in year one, we generated a turnover for the six months of that year of £320,000.
05:22We made a gross of £130,000 and a net of £40,000.
05:29Year two, we turned over £580,000.
05:34And we had a gross of £130,000.
05:39Sorry, £230,000 gross.
05:41And then another net of £40,000.
05:44And then the year just finished, our third year, we turned over £1,045,000.
05:51And we had a gross of £370,000.
05:55And our net was £100,000.
05:59I tell you what, it makes for good reading, doesn't it?
06:03I mean, I was thinking surely if they taste this good, there's going to be a catch somewhere and I'm
06:08yet to find it.
06:09No, I hope you... Let's start, lads.
06:11Thank you. Thank you.
06:13Luke, Owen, the next phase of your journey, because you have done quite a...
06:18Well, last year particularly is good growth, isn't it?
06:21Yep.
06:21What's year four and five looking like?
06:23So, right now, this year, we're on track to turn over £1.8 million in revenue.
06:28We've got a gross of £875,000 and a net of £165,000.
06:34So, £1.8875,165.
06:38So, you're really growing the sales and you're growing your gross profit.
06:43Yeah.
06:44But you're only increasing your net profit in the year by £65,000 and yet you're generating another £400,000
06:53in gross margin.
06:55Did you say £875,000 from £370,000?
06:57Yeah.
06:58There's a lot of efficiencies as we're scaling up, but we're kind of coming across, so...
07:02Well, efficiencies should actually...
07:04It should help.
07:05Should help.
07:06Yes.
07:06So, yeah, we're also...
07:08We are still, as we're obviously growing, we're trying to invest in things like trade show, things like that,
07:13which is probably going to be affecting our numbers a little bit.
07:18We're starting to look at employing our first staffs as well.
07:21Yeah.
07:21So, it's just been me and Luke in the business.
07:23We think that by getting a salesperson and getting more support in marketing and stuff, we'll be able to substantially
07:31increase our sales and drive it much further.
07:33Yeah, no, I get that.
07:34It's just I'm trying to fill that gap.
07:36It's quite a lot of money you're spending.
07:38Yeah.
07:39So, where's that money going?
07:41Yeah, it...
07:43God, I don't know off the top of my head, to be honest.
07:46And what do you guys pay yourselves?
07:48Right now, we pay ourselves our basic allowance of £12,000 a year.
07:53And then we, at the end of the year, we'll process dividends depending on what we have, but we don't
07:59necessarily pull that from the company straight away.
08:01So, you're paying yourselves way below minimum wage?
08:04Yeah, yeah.
08:06We obviously want the company to make a profit first and to reinvest it in the growth.
08:11You know, hopefully it'll pay later down the line as the company scales.
08:19Guys, tell you where I am.
08:20I think you're great.
08:23Honestly, I do.
08:24I think 24-year-old, the way you've come is fantastic.
08:28However, in order to go further, you need to employ more people.
08:33Yeah.
08:33And when you put your infrastructure in to run a proper business, is this going to be one of those
08:40businesses,
08:41where you turn over a lot, but don't make any money?
08:45That concerns me.
08:48And because of that, I'm not going to make you an offer, unfortunately.
08:54And I'm out.
08:55No, I'm safe anyway.
08:58Luke, Owen, I think I've sat here for quite a long time because you're so investable, and I always feel
09:05like you should back entrepreneurs first and foremost.
09:08However, I don't actually eat pizza, although today was a bit of an exception, but I just, I'm not excited
09:17about pizza.
09:19So, for that reason, I'm going to say that I'm out.
09:23Guys, I think you've done really well.
09:26Really well.
09:27Thanks.
09:28So, my sister had holiday parks.
09:31She sold her last one about a year ago.
09:33And it's just, it's funny, you're describing a scenario that I was having a discussion with her about how is
09:40she going to deliver a quality product, you know, with the inconsistencies of pizza.
09:47Yeah.
09:48Sorry, I've just offended every pizza chef in the world now.
09:50But, you know, let's face it, they move on, they turn in, you know, and no different to a lot,
09:55you know, a lot of what's going on in hospitality.
09:57So, this kind of solves that.
10:00I think you're right to be in here now.
10:03You're at a tender moment.
10:06Yeah.
10:07Because you are going to, you've got a lot of decisions to make ahead of you.
10:11And your risks will be, you choose the wrong path, hire the wrong people, go in the wrong direction, and,
10:17you know, ruin this thing that you've so carefully nurtured to this point.
10:24Yeah.
10:24And I think I can help you with that.
10:29So, I am, I'm going to make you an offer.
10:35And I'm going to offer you all of the money for 10% of the business.
10:38Cool.
10:38Thank you very much.
10:43I'll tell you where I'm at, guys.
10:46I think it's a great business.
10:49I think you've got a really good offer from Deborah.
10:53I was keen to make an offer.
10:55I'm not quite sure it was that good.
11:00But I'll make it anyway.
11:01So, I would be prepared to offer you all 90,000 that you're asking for, but I wouldn't be willing
11:08to look at anything less than 15%.
11:10OK.
11:12Thank you for your offer.
11:14I'd also take another slice of pizza if you were offered.
11:16There's plenty.
11:20Luke and Owen.
11:21I've paused and sitting here quietly for quite a long time because I'm also a maidenhead lad as well.
11:28I've seen you around.
11:29Have you?
11:30I've seen you around, yeah, at the petrol station and stuff.
11:32He pumps his own petrol.
11:34I'm sure.
11:35I'm sure I saw you at the petrol station down the road from us once in a classic car.
11:38Yeah, yeah.
11:38I drove here.
11:39That's how I got there.
11:41The fact that you're quite local, I was picking on that because when you're investing in people, you know, it
11:46is nice to be able to meet.
11:48Because we're all used to Teams or Zoom or something and it's tough.
11:52Yeah.
11:52But I think you've done really, really well.
11:55And there is no way I can let this go to Deborah Meaden.
12:00No chance.
12:01So, I'm coming in to compete here because I think I could really help you scale this business.
12:09At speed, actually, without the pitfalls that happens when you scale a business at pace.
12:16Yeah.
12:16So, I'm going to offer you all of the money at 10% as well.
12:23Okay.
12:24Same as Deborah.
12:26And yes, I am completely copying Deborah here.
12:30But I did it first.
12:35All right, let's have a chat to the wall.
12:36Go ahead.
12:37I thought twins had like telepathy or something.
12:42Luke and Owen have three competing bids to consider.
12:45With Sarah Davies offering £90,000 in exchange for 15%, triple the equity originally on offer.
12:54So, we just accept it as it is.
12:56Well, Deborah Meaden and Peter Jones have both gone in at 10%.
13:00Yeah.
13:01Can I say?
13:06Cool.
13:07Thank you again for all of your offers.
13:09Thank you all for the offers.
13:09Really do appreciate it.
13:16Thank you so much.
13:20Brilliant.
13:22Thank you, guys.
13:22A moment of triumph for non-identical twins Luke and Owen, who leave the den with £90,000
13:29and the backing of a dragon, who can help them earn more than just a crust.
13:36Thank God that's over.
13:38We're really thrilled to have Peter on our team now.
13:41We think he has huge amounts of value.
13:44He's local to us as well, so he has travelled very far.
13:47Yeah.
13:47Well, the gauntlet's down, Mr Jones.
13:49It's only because I'm more local than you.
13:51That's the only reason why.
13:55Not sure about that, Mr Jones.
13:56I think you won that fair and square, but I will remember this.
14:16I am Rachel.
14:17And this is Holly.
14:18My wife.
14:19And we're the owners and the directors of the Chocolate Cocktail Club.
14:23London's sweetest bar.
14:26Oh, espresso martinis.
14:28With chocolate.
14:29Chocolate martinis.
14:30Oh, this is heaven.
14:32The prospect of some free samples has put Peter Jones on cloud nine.
14:38But prepping their pitch has involved more than just blue sky thinking for Rachel and Holly.
14:44We've been practising a lot, over and over again, to each other constantly and I think
14:49to anyone that will really listen at the moment.
14:52And we've got a six-week-old baby.
14:54So every time I walk around the street, little Ted has known the speech probably more than Holly does.
15:00So I think his first words might be dragon stem.
15:04I'm hoping the Dragons will see the passion that we've got behind our business.
15:08We've got blood, sweat and tears and chocolate in this business and I really believe that they will see that.
15:13We definitely think now is our time.
15:16And with the help, we can be big.
15:27Hi, Dragons.
15:29My name's Rachel and this is my wife and my business partner Holly.
15:32And we're the owners and the directors of the Chocolate Cocktail Club.
15:35And we're here in identity to ask for £80,000 in exchange for 8% of our business.
15:42Imagine a world filled with the indulgence of chocolate and the sophistication of cocktails.
15:46Welcome to the Chocolate Cocktail Club.
15:48The UK's first and only chocolate cocktail bar.
15:52Established in 2018 after five sold out pop-ups, we now have a permanent London home,
15:58which we've held for the past three years, celebrating two of our nation's favourite things, chocolate and cocktails.
16:04Since the launch of our first permanent site, we've turned over £700,000.
16:09We have over 25 variations of chocolate cocktails on the menu, ranging from classic pairings to chocolatey twists,
16:17making us the number one destination for chocoholics and cocktail enthusiasts alike.
16:22So join us on this delicious journey and let's take the Chocolate Cocktail Club to new cities, new markets
16:28and help us become the number one destination for chocoholics.
16:32Oliver's now just going to present you with five of our different cocktails.
16:36After you, I think.
16:39Two of the nation's favourite indulgences, booze and chocolate, are at the heart of the offering
16:45from married couple Rachel and Holly Whisson-Brooks.
16:49So, which is your favourite? My favourite? I quite like the Clockwork Orange here.
16:53OK, come on then. Clockwork Orange here.
16:56They're seeking £80,000 in return for an 8% share in their business.
17:02Oliver, well done.
17:04You're very welcome.
17:07Tipple time for Tuukka Suleiman.
17:10Cheers, Dragons. Cheers. Cheers.
17:12Cheers.
17:13But while Rachel and Holly have already managed to raise glasses...
17:17Actually, I'm going to put that down before I start asking questions.
17:20..can they also raise investment?
17:25Good pitch.
17:27You're up and running.
17:28So, where is your first club in London?
17:32Whereabouts?
17:32Clarkhamwell Farringdon.
17:34And how big?
17:35It's only a 24, 25-seat capacity venue.
17:38It's only small.
17:39That's why we essentially would like some investment,
17:42is to go into Soho, central London, where there's more footfall.
17:46So, you talked about a £700,000 turnover.
17:49What does that mean in terms of profit?
17:51So, 2021 to 2022, we turned over £115,000.
17:55Our gross was £87,000 and our net was £11,000.
17:58Then in 2022 to 2023, we turned over £275,000.
18:06Our gross was £208,000 and our net was £84,000.
18:12Then in 2023 to 2024, we turned over £297,000.
18:16Our gross profit was £232,000 and our net was £74,000.
18:22OK.
18:23So, I can see what's happening here.
18:24You have pretty much hit a ceiling in your current venue.
18:27That's exactly it.
18:28We have max capacity.
18:30OK.
18:32Now, so your current venue is not prime location.
18:36No.
18:37So, have you worked out what happens if you go into prime location
18:41in terms of size and rent?
18:44Yeah.
18:44And you have.
18:45I thought you probably had, to be honest, because you're all over it.
18:49So, what would that look like, your next perfect venue?
18:53So, ideally, I would say approximately about 50 covers.
18:55Yeah.
18:56And what are you going to pay in terms of rent?
18:58So, it would be approximately £200,000 to £100,000 on average.
19:04Yeah.
19:04I think it depends on the venue and the location.
19:06It could be, you know, if it was maybe a 50 capacity,
19:09it could be from £80,000 plus.
19:11But you must have modelled forward.
19:14So, what does that model, what does that look like?
19:16So, we've estimated £100,000.
19:19£100,000 rent.
19:20So, what turnover have you got to do to make that work?
19:23So, I've estimated that in year two, we could turn over a million based on doubling what we currently do
19:29with the two venues.
19:34Rachel Holly, looking at your financials, to me, it looks like you'd be able to get funding for this new
19:40site by other means.
19:43But also, you'd be able to go to a landlord and get a fit-out contribution if you went to
19:48a central London location.
19:49So, I mean, is anything I said there incorrect?
19:52And also, if so, if it is correct, then why are you here?
19:56Essentially for yourselves as well.
19:58Yeah.
19:58We want to really propel now.
20:00Like, we've had so many people come to us.
20:02Are you a chain?
20:03Oh my God, have you not franchised this?
20:04You know, we could see this in Edinburgh.
20:06We could see this in Manchester.
20:08And we really would like the help to really push that.
20:13So, it's not about the money necessarily?
20:15Because you could, I mean, you're asking for 80k.
20:17How much cash have you got in the bank at the moment?
20:19100,000.
20:20Yeah.
20:20So, you've got enough money in the bank, theoretically, to at least do a deal with a landlord?
20:25Yeah.
20:26Essentially.
20:27Yeah.
20:29And what is the brand?
20:30The Chocolate Cocktail Club.
20:32The Chocolate Cocktail Club.
20:33Because it does look like there's a little bit of franchise potential.
20:37Yeah.
20:37Yeah, we've discussed franchising.
20:39Obviously, the scare is you don't want someone to ruin what you've built with giving trust to someone else.
20:46But it's not off the table.
20:48Yeah.
20:50Can I take over for a second?
20:52So, did you have an empty glass delivered?
20:55Yeah.
20:56Wow.
20:56That's that good.
20:58I did drink a couple of sips for him.
21:01I've been waiting for your questions.
21:03You've been waiting for my questions.
21:04Here we go.
21:04Right.
21:05Rachel and Holly.
21:06Hiya.
21:08To have one venue is easier to manage.
21:13Low risk.
21:15Yeah.
21:15Yeah.
21:15The moment you start building venues, the more fixed overheads you'll get.
21:20Yeah.
21:21Yeah.
21:21Yeah.
21:21You need area managers to control.
21:23Yeah.
21:24You need manager systems.
21:26You get a bad week and you've got six doors.
21:30Yeah.
21:30Yeah.
21:30Although you're very successful and I think the product's great.
21:35How do you get out there without the exposure?
21:37Now, of course, franchise is one way.
21:39Yeah.
21:40Which is the obvious way, of course.
21:42Yeah.
21:43But building up your own chain, I would be… I'd say to you think twice.
21:50And my last question is…
21:52You haven't asked them a question, so you've been talking to.
21:55All right.
21:55The question I'm going to ask you is this one, how many square feet is it?
22:001,000.
22:001,200.
22:02So it's a good size.
22:03Yeah.
22:04So if you're going to go to a bigger size and you've got to go more central,
22:08you pay a lot more than 100 grand rent.
22:09Yeah.
22:12Guys, can I just say, you've given me three numbers.
22:16This is a masterclass in how fantastic numbers are.
22:19And I would say I never particularly like numbers.
22:21Let me tell you about yourself.
22:24You're good operators.
22:26And you've got yourself high margins.
22:29In the latest year, you've increased your margins.
22:33You've increased your margins because your overheads have gone up.
22:36Yeah.
22:37And you spotted that early enough to think we're going to have to respond to this.
22:41We're going to have to drive our margins really, really hard.
22:46So that tells me that you are all over it.
22:49And I just stop for a moment because I'm forever saying to people,
22:52you only need to know three numbers in your business.
22:54And this is like a masterclass in how you can read how people are operating their businesses from a very
23:01few level of numbers.
23:03So well done you guys.
23:03Thank you very much.
23:05There's a however.
23:07I was waiting for it.
23:08Yeah.
23:09I think franchising is going to be difficult for you.
23:13And when you look at franchising, you don't have enough money in here to excite them.
23:17Because if you think about this, they're going to need to pay for premises.
23:22They're going to be paying their own staff.
23:23They're going to have all of your costs and they're going to be paying a franchise fee.
23:29And when you look at your net profit, even you haven't proved enough that it's going to be worth the
23:35risk of the high investment that they're going to have to take.
23:38And your business model doesn't give them that rate for a return.
23:41It's not going to be worth taking that risk.
23:44I think franchising is going to be difficult for you until you can really drive home some of those profits.
23:52I've got quite a lot of insight into this.
23:54There's some really good friends with a lady called Sarah Willingham, as you probably know, owns the London Cocktail Clubs.
24:00And it's really hard at the moment.
24:02Yeah.
24:02So you're doing really well in a tough environment.
24:05But it's not something that right now I want to walk into because they're incredibly good operators and it's tough.
24:11Yeah.
24:12So I'm afraid right now it's not an investment for me, so I'm out.
24:15Thank you very much.
24:18So, Rachel Holly.
24:20Hello.
24:21I've owned a bar and restaurant.
24:22I had one in Windsor and we had put like the longest, but it was a cocktail bar.
24:25Okay, yeah.
24:26And we did, it was incredible.
24:28We felt like we did really well.
24:32But it's really, really brutally tough to make a business out of it.
24:37Having sort of been on this journey before and knowing how difficult and brutal it is, it's not an investment
24:44for me today.
24:44I'm going to say that I'm out.
24:45No problem.
24:46Well done.
24:47Thanks.
24:50Rachel and Holly.
24:51Hello.
24:52So, this is my personal opinion and take on board what you want of this.
24:57Okay.
24:58I look at this and as Deborah said, you are clearly smart business woman.
25:02Yeah.
25:03And you can go one of two ways now.
25:05You can either use your retained profits to open a second bigger site and push the business that way or
25:10to fund expansion through a franchise operation and go that way.
25:15And my advice to you would be go this way because you could take the knowledge, the experience you've got
25:23and you too run a way more successful bar on a much bigger scale and earn a really, really good
25:30living for it for you guys to have a great living.
25:32Yeah.
25:32Or you could work really, really hard managing hundreds of people up and down the country who aren't as passionate
25:39about it as you, who aren't quite going to make it the same success you are, and then they're going
25:43to drive you around the bend.
25:44Yeah.
25:44To probably make less money than you would do if you went this way.
25:48Yeah.
25:48So, my personal opinion is I don't think it's right to invest.
25:52Okay.
25:52Thank you very much.
25:53So, good luck, but I'm out.
25:54Thank you very much.
25:57Rachel, Holly, I think what you've done is great.
25:59I think it's really, really difficult to operate a business in this economic climate that's in the space that you're
26:05in.
26:06Yeah.
26:06That's turning a pretty consistent profit year over year.
26:08So, I think that's really something to applaud.
26:11And when I think about this as an investor, this isn't an investment for me.
26:14Okay.
26:14So, I'm going to say that I'm out and wish you well.
26:17Thank you very much.
26:18Thank you very much.
26:21Question mark.
26:22You're in Clerkenwell.
26:24Yeah.
26:24And you're full to capacity.
26:26Yes?
26:27Yeah, yeah.
26:27So, if you had a bigger store, would you attract the same amount or more because you've got the space?
26:33More.
26:34More.
26:34Fine, you've answered my question.
26:35I would not think about a second store, two lots of overhead, two lots of rent, two lots of staff.
26:42Can you double what you're doing now with a bigger store?
26:46That's what you've got to ask yourselves.
26:47Yeah, yeah.
26:48And I think what you need is a bigger cocktail bar where you've still got control, you're still there, you
26:55keep the same staff and hopefully you create more of an experience.
27:00Yeah, yeah.
27:00And if you believe that you can attract more people because you've got the space, you don't need a second
27:07store.
27:08You need to look for a bigger store in Clerkenwell.
27:10Yeah.
27:10And you might become crazy.
27:12Right?
27:13When it comes to retail, I'm the best.
27:15Yeah.
27:16I can't see myself coming to a bar and advice.
27:20I've given you the advice.
27:21Yeah.
27:21Read.
27:22You look like you're in the bar now.
27:26Anyway, would you mind?
27:29So, I think this journey is not for me.
27:33Yeah.
27:33And I wish you all the best, but I'm out.
27:36Well, thank you very much.
27:37Thank you very much for having us.
27:38Well, good luck.
27:38And you've got a good business.
27:39Thank you very much.
27:41Bye.
27:41Bye.
27:41Well done.
27:44That's it for Rachel and Holly, who depart the den without the investment they were seeking,
27:50as the Dragons call time on a deal.
27:54Are you all right?
27:55Yeah.
27:55Are you okay?
27:56Yeah.
27:57I'm relieved that it's over.
27:59Yeah.
28:00It's quite a cool scene having to stand up there in front of all the Dragons.
28:03Yeah.
28:03I think it would be good for our son not to hear our pitch 24-7 now.
28:08Yeah.
28:08So, I now focus on being a mum as well, being an entrepreneur.
28:11Yeah.
28:11I think people know what to do now, Tuca, to get some Tuca time.
28:15Just give you some drinks.
28:16Oh.
28:17Maybe it's another cocktail and he might have invested.
28:19Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.
28:37Hi, I'm Aaron, I'm 23 and this is Zara, the person I'm married to.
28:41They're 24.
28:43We're in business together which is quite unusual for our age and being married, but we love
28:47of working together and I can't wait to see where we take it.
28:50How are you feeling?
28:51Good. I think it's good.
28:52I think one of the downsides though is,
28:55I'll give you the example of our anniversary dinner.
28:59We went after a full day of work
29:02and we kind of didn't know what to talk about
29:04that wasn't work.
29:06I'm going to take a second to remember this.
29:08It hasn't really sunk in yet.
29:11I grew up watching Dragon's Den,
29:13so it just feels like, I guess, an emotionally loaded event.
29:19My mum sent me the article when Stephen Bartlett
29:22actually joined as being, you know, the youngest Dragon ever.
29:25And I was like, it would be, you know,
29:26I want to be in his position someday.
29:28So I feel like this is the first step of being in the chair myself.
29:36So hello Dragons, I'm Zara and this is my husband Aaron.
29:40And we're the founders of Chopperty,
29:43an AI video editor,
29:44which allows people to do complex video editing quickly and easily.
29:49We're asking for £100,000 for a 6% equity stake.
29:54Since Chopperty is such a visual product,
29:56I'm going to hand over to my lovely husband to give a demo now.
30:00So as you can see here, I've got a podcast video.
30:03This one's about four minutes long,
30:05but it could just as easily be a best man speech
30:07that you've recorded at your phone at a wedding.
30:10So what I've been tasked with is I want to turn this
30:12into lots of short videos to share on social media.
30:15So what I'm going to do is I'm going to open up our website.
30:18I'm going to click upload.
30:20And as you can see, now it's being uploaded.
30:22So because it takes a few minutes to analyze,
30:24I'm just going to leave that to the side for one second.
30:26And I've previously uploaded video.
30:29So I'm going to open up that folder.
30:31And what you can see is that Chopperty's automatically made
30:33all of these projects for me.
30:34So I'm going to click play on one of those,
30:36just so you get an idea of what they are.
30:40I think goal setting is important.
30:41It's also why I think having the right people around you is important, but...
30:46So I'm going to pause it there just for a second,
30:48but you can see it's turned what was originally
30:50a landscape video into a portrait one.
30:52It's detected the faces.
30:53And when there were two people, it stuck them on top of each other.
30:56And it's added this background music
30:57and these animated captions automatically.
30:59So on top of that, on the left hand side here,
31:01you can see that there's a transcript.
31:03And on the right hand side over here,
31:05you can see that there's an AI generated title.
31:07But it isn't made for just making one video.
31:09It makes a bunch of them.
31:10So here I've got a 30 second video.
31:12This one's about 28 seconds long.
31:14And actually from what was originally a 45 minute long video,
31:17it's automatically made all of these clips.
31:20So at this point, what you could do is you could click download
31:22on any one of these and post it to social media.
31:25But if for example, you want to edit it,
31:27you can just click edit.
31:29Now editing videos is usually a really daunting task.
31:32And what we've tried to do is make it as simple as possible.
31:36So if what I wanted to do is make this video shorter,
31:38all I need to do is you see this purple bit here that's selected.
31:42I can just drag this handle and trim it like this.
31:45And now it's shorter.
31:46So if you can edit a Word document,
31:48you can edit a video in Chopperty is the idea.
31:50So the video that I uploaded at the start of the demo
31:52has already been edited.
31:54Again, I've touched nothing apart from just uploading it.
31:56So I'm going to open that one up and you can see it's made all of these clips.
32:00So I'm just going to click on this one so you can see how it's edited it.
32:04But the thing is like, I also, I mean, it's not that I'm never like up late or...
32:09So you can see it's added some nice pink animated captions.
32:12It's added a logo in the top left corner that appeared and animated in.
32:15Some background music and even some zooms.
32:18So at this point, these videos are ready to go out on social media.
32:23AI video editing software designed with social media in mind
32:27is the brainchild of Aaron Morris and Zara Paul.
32:32The couple are seeking £100,000 in return for 6% of their business.
32:38And their product demo has clearly made an impression on Sarah Davies.
32:45Wow. Like, just wow.
32:50That is exceptional. Thank you very much.
32:52What is it about you two that is giving you the skills
32:56that has set you off in this market?
32:59What's happened to get you to this point here?
33:01So Aaron and I met in uni and we got together pretty quickly
33:07and have basically been building together ever since.
33:11We spent a year working on a graphic design app.
33:16And we took a lot of the skills that we'd learned from building that tech
33:19and transferred it over to the video space.
33:22And just a little bit on me as well, my background.
33:25So I've been developing since I was about 13 years old.
33:28And that's really my specialty.
33:29And I have a bit of experience, background of video editing,
33:32but that's more just as a hobby.
33:34And how long have you been working on it to get it to this stage?
33:38We started development in November of 2022
33:42and we launched in January of 2023.
33:46And what have you spent on the development of the product so far?
33:51Development zero. There are running costs,
33:53but development zero because it was all done in-house.
33:57Wow. Well done.
34:03I'm the least tech person you can imagine.
34:06But I've got fashion businesses and we create videos.
34:10So how do I use your technology so I can get the consumer's attention?
34:18So one of the common requirements is just first off branding.
34:24So imagine if instead of just having one of those videos,
34:26you have 50 for every single one of those to add the logo,
34:31add a little outro animation, put background music.
34:34If you need to correct any audio, like if it's muffled, there's background noise,
34:38all of those sort of things can be done instantly for every single one of them,
34:42as opposed to having to do it one by one.
34:43Right. So where do you believe you're going to end up with this in two, three years' time?
34:54So we want to be in every business.
34:59We want every marketer in the world to be using Chopperty for all of the videos that they need to
35:05be making.
35:07Very impressive, you guys. Thank you. Even though I'm not in tech.
35:13I think it's because we're not in tech.
35:16We're a little bit like, whoa, this is really clever.
35:19I know you guys, like you live in this world and you see stuff like this all the time and
35:24I'm just like, yeah.
35:26Thank you. Thank you.
35:29Aaron, Zahra.
35:32It's really cool. I think it's really cool. Thank you.
35:35It's really cool.
35:35To say I know this space, this tool, what it does, every competitor that exists, is an understatement.
35:44I actually partner in a company which is essentially doing the same thing, taking long form, turning it into clips.
35:49And there is a lot of products that are trying to do the same thing. There's a lot of them.
35:54And with these businesses, sometimes, you know, it's hard to forecast the disruptive forces that come out of nowhere.
36:00Yeah, for sure.
36:01Right. Because, you know, you could have a Photoshop or an Adobe, I'm sure that's probably a little bit,
36:06it keeps you up a little bit at night, who introduce similar features in their video editing software for long
36:11form video.
36:12What happens to you in that situation? What do you do?
36:15So, Aaron and I, we're very determined and driven people. And we're also very resourceful.
36:22Whatever the landscape looks like, we'll figure something out. Maybe not with this.
36:28If this is a sinking ship, we'll let the ship sink and we'll go and do something else.
36:33We don't want to lose anyone else's money or time. That's not our attitude towards doing anything.
36:40So, I'm going to tell you where I am, just to make things a little bit easier for everybody.
36:45When I think about who wins in this space, many of these games are won by resource.
36:53And some of these games are winner takes all, to some degree.
36:58I'm, you know, I'm not saying that there will be just one winner.
37:00There's typically maybe three, you know, big, big names.
37:03And then I look at the ask, and this is for me actually where it falls down.
37:09Because 100k for 6%, it's actually the 100k piece.
37:14If you'd come in and that number was lower, I think I would have had a shot at this.
37:19But with what I know, the risk equation at that level doesn't add up for me, unfortunately.
37:26So, I'm going to say that I'm out, but I wish you the very, very best.
37:34So, that was interesting because I have to be honest, I don't live in, I don't know the landscape of
37:42this.
37:42I do live in this world, I just don't know the landscape because I'm not on the tech side of
37:46things.
37:48And I have to say that Stephen's comments have wobbled me.
37:54And they've wobbled me because if I know a landscape, any of these other dragons can say what they like.
38:00I know what I know.
38:02In this particular situation, you guys are really impressive.
38:07I can see exactly why this product is needed and how it would be used.
38:12But I have, I'm going to take into account Stephen's summary of the landscape.
38:21So, I am really sorry, I am really sorry.
38:25I won't be investing, I'm out.
38:29I appreciate it.
38:32Aaron and Zara.
38:34Look, I think this is really, I think it's great what you've done.
38:37It's, without doubt, really admirable.
38:42And you are both really credible.
38:47It's really interesting because I do think you do have something here.
38:52Um, and I think I could, I could really help, um, help you build the business.
39:00One of my best friends, this group CEO of a very large business in the UK that does a lot
39:04of this sort of stuff.
39:06But I have to take more than the 6% because of the risk.
39:13So, I am going to offer you all of the money.
39:17But I'm doing it at 15%.
39:19OK, that's my offer.
39:22Thank you very much for your offer.
39:25How are you going to feel if, if I put my money in today and we spend this 100,000
39:30pursuing this,
39:33this Chuppity product, um, and it doesn't work.
39:39And then you're starting from scratch with something new, but you only own 94% of it.
39:45Your value isn't the money that you're putting in.
39:50Your value is you.
39:52The same with us.
39:54And we would see it as going in as a partnership.
39:59That was a great answer.
40:00That made my mind up.
40:02Um, I don't have expertise in this area.
40:05I'm not investing in this product or this area.
40:08I'm happy to back you too.
40:10Wow.
40:10Thank you so much.
40:11Thank you so much.
40:12So, I will offer you what you're asking for at what you're offering.
40:15I'll offer you the whole 100,000 at the 6%.
40:18Thank you very much.
40:18Thank you so much.
40:21Well, you've got two offers.
40:27Um, I like you guys.
40:30You really are great, you know?
40:33So, I'm going to offer you all the money.
40:37But I also want 15%, like Mr Jones.
40:40Okay, thank you.
40:42Do you want to go and have a chat with yourselves at the wall?
40:44Yes, please.
40:45Yeah, sure.
40:46Thanks for your offers.
40:48Aaron and Zara have three competing bids to consider.
40:52With Sarah Davies having met the couple's original ask,
40:56£100,000, in return for 6%.
41:0115%.
41:04Whilst Peter Jones and Tuka Suleiman have both demanded 15%.
41:22So, thank you guys so much for your offers.
41:27Um, Peter, we're really interested in your connections.
41:35But we were wondering if you would consider dropping your equity ask to 12.5%.
41:47I would drop it if I get my 100k back, because then I've got no cash at risk, and I
41:53own 12.5%.
41:54I would be happy with that.
41:59And that's good.
42:00Yeah.
42:01We'd like to accept your offer.
42:03Yay!
42:06So, it's been such a pleasure.
42:08Thank you so much.
42:09An amazing outcome for Aaron and Zara.
42:12Thank you so much, guys.
42:14Bye.
42:14Who leave the den £100,000 better off, having clinched a deal with a dragon
42:20who has a wealth of experience in the world of tech.
42:25It doesn't feel like that was real. I feel like I'm waking up right now.
42:30They were brilliant. We could not have let them walk out of this den without getting investment.
42:36They're the most sort of, they're the best we've seen in the den.
42:40We're super delighted to have Peter on board.
42:43He just has so much industry experience, and yeah, super excited to be working with him.
43:01My name's Alex Street. I'm originally from South London, but now I'm living in Nottingham.
43:06Come on.
43:09I love football shirts.
43:10From all different years, they have a history and a nostalgia that
43:12I just absolutely love.
43:16Where's Gary Neville when you need him?
43:18I wash an awful lot of football shirts every week.
43:20We don't have any that look like that in our house.
43:24Alex has dressed up, especially for the Dragons.
43:27I put on a full suit today, a little three-piece, cheeky number.
43:31Most of the time, I'm wearing football shirts in the office.
43:33Yeah, it feels nice to put on those proper clothes.
43:37The last time he was in formal wear was a much more sombre occasion.
43:42It's been a really challenging couple of months.
43:44I lost my dad and we had his funeral about a month ago, but I'm here now.
43:49I'm ready to deliver the best pitch I possibly can.
43:51Don't shoot, you don't score.
43:53And hopefully the Dragons will see a real, authentic, quality business that they can get behind and invest.
44:03Hello, Dragons.
44:04My name is Alex Street and I'm the co-founder of Mystery Jersey King.
44:08I'm here today looking for an investment of £50,000 for a 10% equity share in my business.
44:14Mystery Jersey King is the home of the football shirt mystery box.
44:18The business is based on an idea for football fans and consumers
44:21to purchase a mystery box experience and subscription service.
44:26It's a new and exciting concept to collect football shirts from all around the world at an amazing price.
44:32Since starting the business from my spare room in February 2021,
44:36we made our first move to our new office space in the same year.
44:40And then we took on four members of staff to help with the day-to-day running.
44:45This then allowed us to spend more time building relationships with manufacturers, retailers and football clubs,
44:52which in turn has given MJK the opportunity to present a broad collection of unique and unexpected shirts,
44:59which we present on our social media platforms, which has over 100,000 followers.
45:05We are really pleased to say we've accumulated over £1 million worth of sales revenue.
45:10Thank you for your time.
45:11And before we go on to the questions, I've got a wonderful cheeky little mystery box for each one of
45:16you.
45:17Better be Manchester United.
45:20Yours would be Chelsea, the best team.
45:23A mystery box containing a football shirt sourced from anywhere around the globe
45:28and delivered to your door is the offering from Alex Street.
45:33I love purple.
45:35Top colour.
45:37He's seeking £50,000 in return for a 10% share in his business.
45:43That is Peña Deportiva.
45:45Yes, that captures the essence of the island, which they call Ibiza.
45:49So it's got a big DJ on it, funky colours.
45:51That's me. You have got me down to a tee.
45:55Alex might have successfully sized up Deborah Meaden, but his shirts also fit the bill for self-confessed
46:02soccer mum, Sarah Davies.
46:07Wow! Alex.
46:10Hi.
46:10My kids would love this.
46:14I mean, yeah, it's amazing.
46:17I can see it. It's brilliant.
46:19So what's the premise in terms of how often do people receive the subscription?
46:24OK, so we work on a subscription basis where we work on one a month and we charge £29.99,
46:29including delivery.
46:30And so what is your average cost on one of those shirts and deliver it to a customer?
46:37All the shirts that we actually source all come at different sort of prices.
46:39So we could be sourcing the shirts at £6 to £7, up to £14 to £15.
46:45It all depends on the relationships we have with the manufacturers.
46:48OK, so I can totally see how it's a win-win.
46:51I can see how from the manufacturer's standpoint,
46:53they're getting rid of excess stock that they wouldn't be able to sell.
46:56From your standpoint, you'd be able to negotiate by brilliant prices.
46:59And the consumer's happy because they're accepting,
47:01I'm going to get something different and I'm getting it at a good price for a football shirt.
47:05Yes, exactly right.
47:06I like win-win businesses. This is great.
47:09Sorry if it's a bit simple, but like, it works.
47:12And I'm a pretty simple geezer, just enjoy it.
47:15And I love what we do, trying to make these little deals,
47:18like I had this guy the other day called Pedro.
47:20He went to me, oh Alex, 600 shirts, FC Porto, last season.
47:24So I've managed to source them in at €13, right?
47:28So if you receive that in a £30 mystery box, amazing.
47:32You've got the right value for money, because if you Googled that actual shirt,
47:34it's going to be £60, £70, £80.
47:37I feel like I want a pint of beer, just to sit here and have a chat in the pub.
47:42A chat's a football in the pub.
47:43You can have a glass of water, not quite the same.
47:46Right, so how many people do you have in the subscription model today?
47:51We have 700 subscribers as of today. That's where we're at.
47:55It will fluctuate because, you know, some go up, some go down.
47:58Well, I want to understand your attrition.
48:00Like, how... OK.
48:01So how long, generally, are you keeping a customer?
48:03What's your retention rate, month on month?
48:05And then I also want to understand what your cost per acquisition for a customer is.
48:11Those are great questions.
48:12They are great questions. That's why I sit in this chair, mate.
48:15And I would love to give you the answer to those.
48:17Yep, I'm hoping you will.
48:20Yeah. So we just basically, every month, we just track how many subscribers we've got,
48:23and we work out on a month-by-month basis.
48:26And so, roughly, so if we take, at the moment, you've got 700.
48:30Do you know how many new customers have come in this month?
48:34No.
48:36Apologies that I don't know that number.
48:39Have you got any data at all I can work with to kind of analyse how well the business is
48:43doing?
48:44I've got some numbers. So once I can get rid of these numbers,
48:47because I've got a lot of numbers, I can kind of then just relax and...
48:50Oh, I'm not sure you're going to be relaxing.
48:51I wouldn't take that anything for granted, yeah.
48:53I'll just manage that expectation now.
48:55OK, OK, so for year one, the turnover was 365k, with a net profit of 62k.
49:04Our second year, the turnover was 688k, with a net profit of 62k.
49:11And for year three, the turnover was 672k, with a net profit of 95k.
49:21Mm-hm.
49:24Alex, good to meet you. Hi, Peter.
49:27700 subscribers, paying 29.99 a month.
49:30Yep.
49:31That's where you are today.
49:32Yep.
49:33That's about, what, 21k a month coming in.
49:37And yet the numbers that you've already done previously, last year, were nearly three times that.
49:42Yeah.
49:43What's happened?
49:44OK, so last year, we kind of dilly and dally about with, like, another, we basically got a load,
49:50a lot of training gear in.
49:51And we used to sell in on eBay.
49:53But then it was just taking away our attention from the main thing, which is the brand,
49:56and the mystery box element and experience that people get when they open up.
50:00OK, so that's why. So your revenue has dropped.
50:03Yeah.
50:04But you're focusing back on your core offer.
50:06Yeah, which is the brand.
50:09One question I had is, could you tell me the proportion of revenue that's coming from eBay
50:13versus mystery Jersey King?
50:16I'm really sorry. I don't know the answer to that.
50:18I'm really sorry. I shouldn't have come here more prepared.
50:21But, so, listen, I would allow some leeway for not knowing.
50:25I'm not so pinnockety about some things, because, you know, I'm sure there's some things you can
50:30walk out of this den and find out. Yeah.
50:32But this isn't the complicated stuff.
50:35This isn't me asking you to read out your balance sheet and quizzing you on it.
50:38Yeah.
50:38I'm just asking how much money you made from eBay.
50:42Yeah. I'd be guessing, and I wouldn't want to do that.
50:48I'm going to tell you where I am. I don't feel like I'm able to invest,
50:52because, admittedly, you don't know the numbers.
50:55OK.
50:57So I'm going to say that I'm out. Well done.
50:58Thank you so much. You know, I'm going to learn so much from this experience.
51:04You've got a great business, and I would say congratulations,
51:07because you are generating 20k a month.
51:11But your business, even the name of your business, actually reflects the numbers in it as well.
51:18Because it's beyond me. It is a mystery.
51:22We can't even get to the bottom of the detail of the numbers.
51:28I mean, football shirt market is worth, like, £4 billion.
51:33Yeah, I know, but, you know, how is it possible to invest?
51:37Neither of us know, actually, what this business has done.
51:42And that's really a challenge, to try and find a way to invest.
51:46So, look, I'm going to say that I'm out.
51:52Alex, you don't have to be an accountant,
51:54but you do need to know the numerical mechanics of your business.
51:59It's not that complicated. Yeah.
52:02So, I'm afraid I won't be investing. I'm out.
52:05Thank you so much.
52:09Look, you are a trader at heart, and traders are entrepreneurs.
52:16And entrepreneurs sometimes are mavericks.
52:23Am I building the picture? Yeah.
52:26But honestly, can you imagine you and I having a board meeting,
52:30and I come to you and say, Alex?
52:33I actually can. Yeah.
52:34I'd actually buy tickets to see you two have a board meeting.
52:37I say, Alex, give me the numbers.
52:38I think you two, having a board meeting,
52:41will actually sell like Billy-o.
52:44Tuka, I'll tell you what, Tuka, I'll give you the money.
52:46Invest in the man.
52:51What I'm trying to get to is that you are a personality in your own self.
52:58You are the trader. You're the entrepreneur.
53:02And I believe that you would find it very difficult to bring an investor on board.
53:08So, for those reasons, I'm out.
53:12OK.
53:17Alex.
53:19Yeah?
53:19It's stressful, isn't it?
53:22And we're being really nice to you tonight.
53:24You didn't know any of your numbers, and none of us have got fiery.
53:28You've been really lucky.
53:31What is it you've come in here for?
53:33What do you think you want a dragon for?
53:36Just to move on to the next level.
53:38You know, we've got a lovely little business with a couple of members of staff.
53:41We're doing well.
53:42I just think you guys can open new doors for me.
53:45And I just think with one of you guys' help, this can really go.
53:49You know, we can absolutely nail this.
53:51I know it.
53:56Do you know what, Alex?
53:56I'm going to throw you a lifeline.
53:59Because I think you're a top bloke.
54:01However, I totally agree with absolutely everything that has been said by every other dragon.
54:06OK?
54:07And you not knowing your numbers, this is a really, really risky business.
54:13Just because I'm putting my money into you, and I don't quite know that you know how you're going
54:18to give me a return as an investor.
54:19OK?
54:20OK.
54:20So, what I'd be prepared to do is give you the 50,000 you're asking for,
54:25and I would want to do that for 15% of the business.
54:28OK.
54:30And as long as you return my money to me within 18 months, which I think is reasonable,
54:35Yeah.
54:35then I'm no longer at risk.
54:38Yeah, OK.
54:39And I'll drop down to the 10% shareholder that you want.
54:42I think that's really fair and reasonable, given the absolute dog's dinny of media numbers today.
54:47Yeah, OK.
54:47So that's my offer.
54:48Thank you. OK.
54:51I must be mad.
54:54You're not.
54:55You're not.
54:55You can bank on a geezer like me.
54:57So does that mean we've got a deal?
54:59100% yes.
55:02Absolutely!
55:04It's a massive win for Alex.
55:06Thank you so much.
55:08Well done.
55:08Who can't resist the opportunity to try and strike one more deal before he leaves the den.
55:14Are you playing soccer right on Sunday?
55:16I am.
55:16Cut the cheater tickets.
55:19Sorry.
55:21Cut the cheater tickets, they're ten quid.
55:24Alex departs without his tickets.
55:28But crucially, he does have £50,000.
55:34And the backing of a dragon who understands how to take a business to the top of its league.
55:40What happens to you, Dad?
55:44He just needs a bit of help.
55:46He needs putting in touch with a decent accountant.
55:48Do you know what?
55:49I think you'll have a great time.
55:50I think he's great.
55:51It's lovely.
55:52And I can't wait to go and ring the kids and tell them I've invested in a football shirt company.
55:58I thought the final whistle would have been blowing on me.
56:00You know, they all felt like dominoes.
56:02One, two.
56:02And then a shining light came on.
56:04My substitute.
56:06She smashed the goal.
56:07She believed in me.
56:08And, yeah, I'm...
56:10Yeah.
56:26Next time.
56:27Saves time, doesn't it?
56:29Because you can poo and wash your hands at the same time.
56:31That's quite a big piece of information you've just divulged there.
56:34That was one of the best pictures I've seen in the day.
56:38Oh, yes.
56:40Wow.
56:40When you build your life again, this is driving you a lot.
56:44Gosh, I feel a bit choked up.
56:45This is all about contacts.
56:47I think Sara and I would be a great team on this.
56:49I would never go against my wife.
56:52I'm glad someone can understand my point of view.
57:24I have the most.
57:25Also, let's go to the L.M.
57:25See you.