00:00Sonny and and and Cassius were mirrors. They seem like they're on the opposite sides. But if you take no
00:10one wanted that fight was not a popular fight. It was hard to sell the fight. People don't remember this,
00:16but that was a hard fight to sell.
00:18You had this loud mouth young challenger. You had this pariah of a champion that no one wanted. The black
00:26community didn't want to accept him because he didn't you know, he wasn't like Joe Lewis, you know, he wasn't
00:33like Floyd Patterson that said the right things. He was handled by the mob. He was a felon, you know.
00:39And then on this side, you had this loud mouth guy. America didn't know what to do with them, you
00:45know, and I feel like Sonny, you know, to me, Sonny had a lot of shame that came along with
00:51his handlers that came along with his past, the traumatic way that he grew up.
00:57And I feel like he was constantly trying to get that off of him, trying to be what America wanted
01:02him to be. And no one would accept him. No one would give him that second chance, that redemption.
01:07And when he became champion, they act like he wasn't.
01:11Yeah. And for you, Jay?
01:15Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I would capitalize on that, too, and just say, you know, another way to look at
01:21that, too, especially to black men.
01:24I think it's it's interesting because with Sonny Liston, you get to see the storyline of someone where the world,
01:32you know, told him who he was.
01:34So a lot of his fight was to prove to himself, you know, who he believed himself to be.
01:40And with Ali, he was creating that to the world.
01:43He was able to be in a position where he's telling the world who he is and making them believe
01:48it or not.
01:49So they were really to fight. And at the same time, they're in the same position, fighting what could seem
01:54like the same cause.
01:55But to me, I think they're very different.
01:57You know, I think they're very different.
