00:00 that I am in pain today,
00:01 today the majority of your people, they are hurt,
00:04 they are on the streets.
00:05 And we are told that there is no fiscal space.
00:07 No, it is told exactly like that.
00:08 It should be told like that.
00:09 So then, when my neighbor gets free electricity,
00:13 the person whose salary is the highest in Pakistan,
00:16 he gets free electricity,
00:17 he gets limited free electricity,
00:19 then will I have pain or not?
00:21 There they remember their merit,
00:23 there they remember their temporary,
00:24 their limitations,
00:27 the problem is that the elite capture of Israfiya in Pakistan
00:31 has become very strong.
00:33 No one is ready to put their hand in their mouth.
00:36 I tell you one thing,
00:38 you can take out your researchers,
00:40 the income tax ordinance has a second schedule.
00:43 If you take it out,
00:44 then see who has been forgiven in this country.
00:46 There they will not do anything.
00:48 Here they will know that we have international agreements.
00:51 So this is a matter of protecting each other.
00:55 If they want to do it, they can do it today.
00:57 Yesterday, the cabinet was right to say that
01:00 we cannot announce any agreement until the IMF agrees to it.
01:06 Who stopped the cabinet yesterday
01:08 that you cannot withdraw their free electricity?
01:11 Was there any criticism of the IMF on this?
01:12 The IMF would be happy that you are closing a source of bleeding.
01:16 These are all their excuses and intentions.
01:18 Here they have a very serious issue.
01:19 This is the wonder because this is the claim that Mr. Bukti made
01:22 that they will forgive free electricity for everyone above the 16th grade.
01:25 But here, the claim of the IMF is bad.
01:27 The President is also trying to increase his salary in these circumstances.
01:30 I mean, it's amazing.
01:31 But shouldn't the Finance Minister take people in confidence?
01:35 No policy statement came before this.
01:38 There were just two press releases.
01:39 No communication was made.
01:41 We are seeing a lot of uncertainty in the markets.
01:45 It is increasing.
01:46 The dollar has crossed the triple century.
01:48 The spread in the interbank open market has reached almost 20 rupees.
01:51 Dr. Waqar, the Finance Advisor, is also not on the same page as the Finance Minister.
01:55 I mean, what is going on?
01:57 We were told that the government of the caretakers or technocrats is getting ready very well.
02:05 For many months, even when the government was of the PTI,
02:09 the technocrats were making noise.
02:11 When the government was of the PDM, the technocrats were making noise.
02:13 So, they have done what their best technocrat team could have done.
02:17 Now, what has come to light in all these circumstances,
02:20 is that on Saturday, the announcement comes from the Prime Minister that I have to take action.
02:26 On Sunday, the PM meets.
02:29 On Monday, he meets.
02:30 On Tuesday, the Cabinet meets.
02:32 Nothing happens.
02:33 So, that shows that either they lack the experience which they lack,
02:38 or they lack the capacity to take those decisions.
02:43 I am not advocating here at all that you should take any kind of IMF program.
02:48 Absolutely.
02:49 We cannot do it.
02:50 We are in very bad condition.
02:51 So, why do you give hope to these artificial people?
02:56 Your job is not to do politics.
02:59 You are a caretaker set up.
03:00 You run your caretaker set up as a caretaker.
03:03 On the other hand, you pointed out that our Finance Advisors and the Federal Minister for Finance,
03:09 who is in the interim, they also have very serious issues.
03:11 This is the reason that the Finance Advisors,
03:14 on the first day, they have to sit for a couple of hours in the office of the Minister of State,
03:19 because the status of Dr. Bakar's M.O.S. is on the third floor.
03:22 He cannot sit in his room later.
03:25 So, after that, he has to sit in the PM's office.
03:28 So, when these kinds of situations arise,
03:30 then a vacuum is created in the market.
03:34 You have seen that vacuum.
03:36 That vacuum is now appearing in the form of Rs. 323 and Rs. 325.
03:39 Because of that vacuum, many other problems are emerging.
03:42 So, I hope that the best team that has been formed,
03:46 I hope that they will do their house in order within two weeks.
03:49 But sir, it is a big problem.
03:51 We will see the house in order, but at least do the efficiency improvement.
03:54 All 400 billion rupees of losses have been briefed to the government.
03:59 Losses, theft, can this be stopped again?
04:03 The circular aid plan that they have built in themselves,
04:06 has a loss of Rs. 464 billion.
04:09 It is like that.
04:10 Losses of theft, inefficiency, and less recovery.
04:13 Start reducing that.
04:15 The power secretary himself told us that day,
04:19 in the background briefing of the media persons on Saturday,
04:22 when the Prime Minister took this notice,
04:24 he himself said that there are almost Rs. 2500 billion in past recoveries,
04:28 in which the government departments said,
04:30 try to do something there,
04:32 so that if you get some space from there,
04:34 and if you are going to do their bills together,
04:37 then take the money from there and give it to the power companies.
04:41 You are going to take more loans.
04:43 And the past loans that have been taken,
04:45 to end the circular debt,
04:46 they have given Rs. 3.23 per unit debt service in surcharge.
04:50 I don't understand how this system will work.
04:53 Their intention is also to correct it or not.
04:55 One, they are going around the circular area,
04:57 and at some point they come back.
04:58 You have mentioned the circular area, sir.
04:59 You are right about the circular area.
05:00 Because the interest rate goes up, the dollar goes up,
05:02 and then the electricity prices go up,
05:04 and then the interest rate goes up.
05:06 Then we chase the interest rate,
05:08 and then it goes up, and the dollar goes up.
05:10 As soon as the dollar goes up, people are buying more.
05:13 We are seeing that even if the interest rate is increasing,
05:15 people are still buying the dollar with such uncertainty,
05:17 because no one believes in the purchasing power of rupees.
05:20 So an increasing dollar is also increasing the energy prices.
05:23 And the way the electricity prices are going up,
05:25 more theft is happening, more defaults are happening,
05:27 so you are seeing that the consumption of electricity is going down,
05:31 the money is being collected less,
05:32 the capacity payments are increasing,
05:34 higher electricity bills are coming,
05:35 people are committing suicides,
05:37 they are cutting down their faqs,
05:38 even today ISCO has announced that it is the last date to pay.
05:40 So these additional costs are also being passed on,
05:42 which are honest and truthful bill payers.
05:46 So energy bills push inflation,
05:48 and also increase the interest rates.
05:50 It is a vicious cycle, sir.
05:52 It is going around in circles.
05:53 The whole economy is caught up in it.
05:55 We are seeing an infinite loop.
05:56 What is the solution to this?
05:58 You have finished everything here.
06:01 We are stuck in a cycle.
06:03 There is something bigger than this,
06:04 which we are not realizing.
06:06 And the people who are running the country are not realizing it.
06:08 The team that they have put together to run this country,
06:12 in probably the worst ever economic times,
06:16 they are probably not geared up to do all this.
06:21 The cycle that you are telling us,
06:23 we should talk openly,
06:25 our people are on the streets,
06:27 and literally suicides have happened.
06:29 In this situation, we have been given this solution,
06:31 that those people who have been put together to run the economy of Pakistan,
06:35 who are not ready to talk to each other,
06:38 those people who have doubts on each other,
06:40 how will this system work?
06:41 And the doubts are not just on the ministers and advisors,
06:45 there is also a doubt on the ministers' bureaucracy,
06:47 whether they do this work with us or not.
06:49 So my humble submission is,
06:52 that whoever is running this country at the moment,
06:55 they should understand that we are not working in normal circumstances.
07:01 They should really understand that this is the time,
07:04 where you really have to protect the national interest in real terms.
07:08 Thank you very much, Shabaz Rana was with us.
