00:00Rajkumar Panji, you've seen how this has played out over the last 48 hours.
00:05Where does the faculty now stand?
00:07Are you firmly behind Professor Dula?
00:09Are you going to protest against the manner in which he is being suspended or targeted
00:15as the Dean Administrative Affairs over the tragic death of young Sahil, death by suicide?
00:22Sir, we have been firmly behind Professor Dula and we are also behind him as ever
00:28because we have been proved right.
00:30Today, we received information that the crime branch has released some information
00:36that indeed Sahil was indulging in academic malpractice.
00:41That information has now been confirmed.
00:44And also, right from the beginning, we have been saying that without proper investigation,
00:49without proper inquiry, our colleague has been vilified merely for performing his duty.
00:57As a faculty member, he is supposed to ensure that there is no academic misconduct in the classroom
01:06and any malpractice has to be reported to the authorities, which he has done.
01:10And without really finding out the situation, people have vilified him.
01:15His family is in tremendous amount of turmoil.
01:19People have reached his ancestral village in Andhra Pradesh and they are trying to spoil his name.
01:25So, we are very deeply anguished on this and we have communicated this to the institute authorities
01:30on behalf of the Faculty Forum.
01:31We have also released a couple of press releases where we have made our stand very clear.
01:35We stand by very strongly with Professor Suranaran Dula.
01:39There was a march yesterday in the campus and interestingly,
01:42there were more students and staff members and faculty members in that march.
01:48You are saying you stand firmly behind Professor Dula, but the university itself had apologized for having
01:56prematurely put out information in the public domain.
02:00The university itself had taken this action against Professor Dula.
02:04So, I want to understand, the university administration on its part put out a note
02:09saying they apologized for the fact that they had put out information without going through
02:14the due process, which had led to misgivings, particularly about the allegations of cheating
02:21and using AI tools.
02:23So, I want to understand, is the university administration with the faculty or not?
02:27No, they are with the faculty, sir.
02:29Look, the statement which has been given out by the university or the institute authorities
02:34is that they are responsible to answer that.
02:37We as Faculty Forum have a very clear stand that our colleague was merely discharging his
02:42duties as laid down by the institute senate approved rules.
02:46When he found a student indulging in an academic malpractice, he has reported the matter to the
02:52head of department and that is exactly what the procedure is.
02:56So, we are just saying that as teachers, our job is to ensure that we look at the academic
03:02integrity of the students and it will be unfair to the other majority of the students who
03:07are sincere, hardworking and appear in the exams without indulging in any malpractices.
03:12If I don't take an action or if I don't report the matter, I am being very unfair to them.
03:17So, that is all our stand is.
03:19We are saying that our colleague has done nothing wrong.
03:22He has completely followed the rules of the institute.
03:25You know, but the fact is, Professor Pan, now there is an allegation under the SCST
03:31Atrocities Act.
03:32Sahil's parents, his father in particular, has suggested that Sahil was being targeted
03:37for his caste, that he was a Dalit, that there were casteist remarks made against him,
03:41not just recently but over the last three, four months and therefore a case needs to be
03:47filed, FI needs to be filed under the SCST Atrocities Act.
03:50This caste angle has cast a shadow over this entire episode as well.
03:55Okay, so let me clarify our stand on that.
03:58So, yesterday I received information from our Deputy Director, Professor Ravindra Gudi,
04:04that the SCST cell of IIT Bombay has issued a statement that there has been no complaint
04:13on record by Sahil against any faculty member.
04:17Forget about Professor Dula.
04:18He has never in the last three, four months put up any mention.
04:23So, there is an institute SCST cell which the students know is for the welfare of the
04:27students and whenever they face any issue, they definitely report it to the cell.
04:32Now, there has been no record of any report and if there is an allegation by somebody that
04:37he was harassed, that allegation has to be backed by proof.
04:40We are waiting for the proof.
04:42So, you are saying, you are denying that any casteist remarks were made to Sahil Dula,
04:48not just over the last three, four months, but even after this incident happened, that
04:53could have led to his tragic death by suicide.
04:55Sir, I am in no position to say whether anything has happened or not.
04:59I am only saying that on record, there is absolutely nothing against Professor Dula which says that
05:05he has indulged in any activity like this.
05:07Professor Dula has been the Dean of Student Affairs for more than six years.
05:11And he is known in the institute for bringing out measures for the welfare of the student.
05:16In fact, he was the one instrumental in ensuring that the All India rank of a student is never
05:21disclosed in any discussions because that leads to caste discrimination, possible caste discrimination.
05:27So, against a person who is so much pro-student, he is known to have financially helped students
05:32when they are in distress.
05:34Against such a person, people are making comments that he has indulged.
05:38So, why did the student, if Professor Dula enjoys such a fine reputation in the university
05:44among students, why did students come on the campus and protest in the initial phase itself?
05:48Why were there student protests?
05:50The student protest is basically to communicate their frustration that without any inquiry,
05:56without any procedure being followed, a statement has come out saying that so and so things
06:02have happened.
06:03And if you look at the, see, there was an open house yesterday, which the director has
06:09attended, along with all the other senior professors and students.
06:13After that, there is a demand or there is a charter of demand by the students.
06:17There is no mention of any caste angle in that.
06:19And now it has become very, very clear that he indulged in academic malpractice.
06:24So, we are only limiting ourselves to the academic malpractice.
06:28That's what we as professors can do.
06:30We are here to teach.
06:31I understand, Professor.
06:33But the point is, you see, there is this pattern that has developed in IITs.
06:39171 suicides over an extended period in the last 10 years, about 120.
06:44In IIT, Bombay alone, three.
06:45Naturally, every suicide leads to question marks about the mental condition of some of the students,
06:51whether the faculty is equipped to handle this.
06:54Some faculty, 70% had earlier said to the Supreme Court that many, there was a need for
07:01the faculty to also understand the mental health of students in a very competitive atmosphere.
07:06That's the bad prop against when a suicide takes place.
07:10Naturally, there are concerns raised by student bodies.
07:14Agreed.
07:14See, we are deeply saddened by what is happening over the last few years.
07:18The number of unfortunate lives lost is increasing.
07:23We are completely concerned about that.
07:25But the point is, the Institute has done whatever it can.
07:28They have set up a cell.
07:29There is a student wellness center.
07:31There are counselors available.
07:33Students have access to many, many ways of letting out their frustration.
07:40And we have mentorship programs.
07:42So, the Institute is doing a lot of sensitization, even for the faculty.
07:47So, we are all aware.
07:49And if there are suicides happening, it is not just happening in IIT, Bombay.
07:54It's not just that this is a place where there is a problem.
07:56See, this is a problem in the society.
07:58It is happening.
07:59I mean, I'm given to understand that even after the unfortunate death of Sahil, there was another
08:04suicide in IIT, Jammu.
08:06I don't know whether it is confirmed or not.
08:08So, this is a problem which is in the society.
08:11And you cannot say that IIT, Bombay has this problem.
08:14This is there in…
08:15You don't agree that Dalit, you know, Dalit activists tell me a disproportionate number
08:19of the students committing suicide are Dalits.
08:22And therefore, they feel a sense of even greater mental pressure.
08:25You disagree with that.
08:26You deny that there is any kind of caste bias or discrimination on IIT, Bombay campus or
08:31any IIT campus.
08:32See, I can tell you that based on my own personal 39 years of service in IIT, Bombay, I personally
08:39have not seen any clear-cut or visible bias against any student.
08:47When we meet a student in the classroom, we don't know his or her caste.
08:50Okay?
08:51We don't deal with them on the basis of the caste.
08:53In the society that we live, there are already deep-rooted, you know, there are very, very
09:01large number of deep-rooted issues which are there in the whole society.
09:06We are not proactively indulging in any kind of casteist behavior on the campus.
09:11I can tell you that for sure, based on my own experience.
09:15So, therefore, in conclusion, do you believe, do you believe, therefore, in conclusion,
09:18Professor Pant, that Professor Dula should be reinstated, should carry on as Dean of Administrative
09:23Affairs, should not be suspended, and that the inquiry and its findings should be done
09:27in a time-bound manner and the findings released at the earliest to ensure that everyone knows
09:33what really happened?
09:34Okay, so let me clarify one more point here.
09:36It's a minor point, but it's an important point.
09:38Professor Dula has not been suspended.
09:41Professor Dula has merely been relieved of his duties as the Dean of Academic, sorry,
09:47Administrative Affairs, because an inquiry is into place.
09:50Okay?
09:51So, the Board of Governors of IIT Bombay have met yesterday, and the minutes have just been
09:55released today.
09:56They are saying that the deanship of Professor Dula is being kept in abeyance for some time,
10:03and he has been asked to go on a one-week leave.
10:06There is absolutely no action against him to suspend him.
10:10He still is and will be a professor of the Institute in good standing.
10:14That is number one.
10:15The second point is that allegations of caste-based discriminations have always been there, and
10:23I am not saying that it cannot happen, there are no people on campus who indulge in casteist
10:29behavior.
10:30I'm sure there are, there might be, but I can vouch for Professor Dula because we have seen
10:37him in Institute's positions of importance and in administrative capacity.
10:43So, he has been asked to set aside his deanship because it's fairness of things.
10:48There is an investigation which is going to go, and as a head of the administration, he
10:52cannot be in position.
10:54So, he has been asked to step aside from the deanship, but it is only a temporary abeyance.
10:59He has not been suspended.
11:01And you maintain this case of an examination malpractice, and that you are convinced that
11:07that is what had happened in this particular case, and therefore any other factors which
11:12are being brought in, you believe, are unfair, unproven, and do no, and do only harm to the
11:21reputation of IIT.
11:22Am I correct?
11:24That you are very clear in your mind that this was a case of an examination malpractice, and
11:28Professor Dula was only doing his duty.
11:31Am I correct?
11:31Exactly.
11:32So, the faculty forum firmly believes that our colleague was simply discharging his duties,
11:38and he has been vilified for no reason.
11:40There is absolutely no proof.
11:42There is absolutely no confirmation of any caster's remarks made by him anywhere.
11:48So, in the absence of that, I think we should not pronounce him guilty of something.
11:54He is innocent until proven guilty, but you are also willing to wait until the entire
11:58inquiry is over before prejudging even what happened.
12:02Am I correct?
12:03As of now…
12:04From the beginning, the faculty forum is saying only this, that let the inquiry be completed,
12:08let the facts come out, and then everything will be automatically clear.
12:12Why are people taking sides and creating these, you know, binaries?
12:17Students and faculty are a family on campus.
12:20So, I don't think we should drive a wedge between our students and our students.
12:24They are like our children, sir.
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