00:00All right.
00:02I'm not here yet.
00:04This is a little, this is adjacent to the Deshaun contract conversation.
00:09Like if you made me decide yes or no on a Deshaun contract extension today,
00:14you would be a no.
00:14But understanding there's at least a pathway forward now to flip me to a yes
00:20at some point, given the circumstances around him.
00:25I feel like in the same vein, if you said right now,
00:30Shador is your developmental quarterback of the future,
00:32or you go get a quarterback in the 2027 draft.
00:35I think I'm still 2027 draft,
00:38but I think it's becoming a much more even handed conversation for a myriad of
00:43reasons.
00:44All right.
00:45Lay this out for me because are you implying that?
00:49So if you don't keep Deshaun Watson, that's the first part of that, right?
00:53So Deshaun is not here.
00:54Oh no.
00:54Deshaun would be here in this scenario.
00:56Deshaun's your bridge quarterback.
00:57Okay.
00:58Deshaun's the bridge quarterback.
00:59So you still want Shador here is the point.
01:00Yes.
01:01Yes.
01:01I would look at this and go, you've got Shador, you've got Dylan Gabriel,
01:05you've got Deshaun.
01:06Do you also have this new rookie quarterback or does he not exist?
01:09Well, no, no.
01:10That's what I'm saying.
01:11I'm saying it's keeping Shador as your backup and the heir to Deshaun Watson,
01:18or it is drafting a quarterback early next year.
01:20Okay.
01:21All right.
01:21I got you.
01:22Yeah.
01:22I mean, isn't that, I mean,
01:23that's just laid out simply what the parameters are.
01:25Is it not?
01:26What do you mean?
01:27Like you basically have two roads you can go down.
01:28You're either drafting a quarterback and then basically this entire quarterback room is going
01:32to be gone.
01:32Maybe you keep one.
01:33So maybe you keep Shador, maybe you keep Dylan Gabriel, but we can talk about the importance
01:37of that later.
01:38Or you go down the path that you're going down.
01:40I don't know that there's another alternative here.
01:42No, no, no.
01:43But I think my point is at some point you've got to identify this is our developmental quarterback,
01:47quarterback of the future.
01:48And if you had asked me seven weeks ago, I would have said, well, Shador is going to
01:53get his chance to be your starter and you might still draft the quarterback next year,
01:57but it's boom or bust.
01:59Either Shador proves that he's got enough in the tank to be at worst the bridge quarterback,
02:05or he's not here next year.
02:06And that's more in deference to Shador, finding another spot for him to get other reps because
02:12once you move on, you're not going back, right?
02:15I feel differently now.
02:16Like if Shador never sees the field this year and Deshaun plays all 17 games and you go into
02:22this off season, I don't think you should just throw Shador away.
02:26If you look at that quarterback class and go, well, we're not really in love with any of
02:31these guys.
02:31I think you could do a lot worse than Deshaun's your starter.
02:34And maybe at some point you, you reevaluate Shador halfway through next year, or maybe
02:40you never get to Shador, but this idea, I no longer feel beholden to drafting a quarterback
02:45at all costs, no matter what in 2027.
02:50Cause even though I still think they're going to be four or five first rounders in this draft,
02:54cause I think there's enough talent that that's going to bear that.
02:57I think they're all risks.
02:59I don't, I don't look at any of the quarterbacks as of right now.
03:02You mentioned Mestamaker and your comp for him.
03:05Mensa.
03:06I actually probably feel the best about him cause he's played the most football and I
03:09think he's very similar to Deshaun in terms of what he can do.
03:12Your point is, is there's no slam dunk the way that it, and we've had this now for the
03:15previous couple of seasons and doing draft prep and getting ready for these quarterbacks.
03:18There's no, Arch Manning was supposed to be it.
03:21Arch Manning is supposed to be Caleb Williams.
03:22He's supposed to be Trevor Lawrence.
03:23He's supposed to be any of these quarterbacks.
03:25We've always, Andrew Luck always discussed as the guys that are unequivocally number one,
03:30one, one, and no debate about it.
03:33And it didn't materialize.
03:34Yeah.
03:34And even Dante Moore, I thought was going to be one of those guys.
03:36I still think he'll be a first rounder, by the way.
03:38He just is now going to have to answer questions the right way if he comes out in the draft.
03:43But if you had told me seven weeks ago, it just would have been, it's a new quarterback
03:48room next year.
03:49At best, Shador's the bridge quarterback, I think Deshaun playing the way that he has
03:54and staying healthy might afford you the ability to just stay padded quarterback.
04:00And I probably, by the way, would still be looking for a 2028 first rounder to keep your
04:04options open to have another one.
04:06I think you have to.
04:06If Deshaun is your quarterback next year, I think you have to constantly be wondering
04:09at what point do we have to get off of Deshaun because of the idea that he does come with
04:14so many injuries.
04:15And you don't know that this is long term yet.
04:17I told you earlier, I'd make him prove it for another season if we get to that spot.
04:20But I think I still would leave the door open that I don't feel forced to draft a quarterback.
04:26And I think that is a, as much as me entertaining the Deshaun conversation today is a huge change
04:32for me, me entertaining the idea that Shador could be here and Dillon could be here.
04:36At some point, we've got to narrow it down to three quarterbacks, but Talon could be here.
04:40I think any one of those four guys can be here next year.
04:44And I think you could do a lot worse than just running it back if things continue to
04:49proceed the way they have with Deshaun the first, the final 10 games of the season.
04:53So the difference for myself in this conversation, and obviously it's way different than let's
04:57say even just three weeks ago, where now I'm entertaining Deshaun Watson as the quarterback
05:00for next year, where that was just not a, it was a non-starter for myself a few weeks ago.
05:05I'm less looking at the quarterback class for next year.
05:07And I'm trying to figure out which quarterbacks out there can be the plug and play we put in
05:11there and all of a sudden is better than what Deshaun Watson had been doing right now.
05:15And so we're talking about trading within the league and quarterbacks that are on other
05:19teams right now, and then trying to see what materializes.
05:22So like in the beginning of the year, we would bring up names like CJ Stroud.
05:25It doesn't seem like Houston's going to do that, but we never know.
05:28Names like that, that we're talking about, where if you really feel like you're a quarterback
05:31away and his defense is humming and all the skill position players are there, this guy
05:35is going to be unequivocally better than what Deshaun Watson has been this year, this season.
05:39So it's interesting.
05:41I think if Deshaun makes it through the season, I don't think Herbert's going to be there.
05:45You mentioned Stroud's probably not going to be there.
05:48Darnold might be there, but even that just feels like, why don't you just pay the guy
05:52and move on with him?
05:53Like, I don't think there's going to be the veteran guy available.
05:56So to me, it becomes, all right, what do you need out of the backup quarterback spot?
06:02And I do like, there is something to be said of, hey, yep, we thought Shadova was going
06:07to play this year, but if he doesn't, maybe he would benefit from some sort of prolonged
06:12situation where you sit and learn and the pressure kind of goes off of you, right?
06:18Like, if you don't play this year and you're back next year, the Deshaun Shador conversation
06:23is not going to be any part of the offseason unless Todd Munkin comes out and says there's
06:28another quarterback battle.
06:29And just giving, sometimes, and I think we're seeing this with mostly first rounders, right?
06:34Yeah.
06:35But again, sometimes young players just need time in the NFL.
06:39You could sell me on a scenario, and again, this is brand new.
06:42Like, this is happening in real time over the last week or two.
06:47You could sell me a worse scenario for Shador as a quarterback trying to develop of just getting
06:54reps in practice, getting time with this coaching staff, and just kind of getting time without
07:00the pressure of immediate expectation.
07:02So are you building a succession plan?
07:03Is that what you're trying to build?
07:04Or are you building an idea where he just is the backup quarterback and never appears?
07:08Oh, no, no, no.
07:08I mean, I think the point is Shador has got to stay ready, but I think it buys him time
07:14to continue working with the coaches on the side.
07:16I know they talk all the time about having time on the side for their young players, especially
07:20their quarterbacks.
07:21I think eventually, if let's say next year, Shador is basically your break class in case
07:27of emergency.
07:28If Deshaun can't follow it up, well, then all of a sudden you've got a quarterback to go
07:33to and see what he has.
07:34And all of a sudden, you're getting a third-year quarterback that has had time to develop as
07:41opposed to now we've got to put the 10th pick or the 5th pick or whatever immediately
07:46into the NFL.
07:47Yeah, so your answer is basically run the same thing back this year that you did.
07:50Yeah.
07:51That you did this year, next year.
07:52Yeah, and I'm sorry.
07:54Same setup, same everything.
07:54Even Dylan Gabriel.
07:55Like, sure, why not?
07:57Dylan's a third-round pick.
07:58You know, as long as we're understanding that the guy with the best chance to start long-term
08:03is Shador Sanders, we're fine.
08:06Well, would Shador take it that way?
08:08It doesn't matter.
08:09He's under contract.
08:10No, he's under contract, sure.
08:11But, I mean, it does kind of matter.
08:12If Shador gets impatient and decides that he wants to play somewhere else or wants to
08:16do something else, then he'll force his way out.
08:18My response to – I think Andrew Barry's response would be, we drafted you, we believed
08:23in you, hang in there.
08:25I mean, unless somebody's going to give you something, I don't see why – and by the
08:30way, Shador forcing a trade will get out.
08:34He has to understand how disastrous.
08:36Like, if the whole knock on Shador this entire time has been, you're not a team player,
08:42you're a selfish guy, you're eccentric, whatever, you're a me-first player, being a fifth-round
08:48pick that forces his way out of Cleveland after two years because you haven't got a chance
08:52to start is not going to help his image around the NFL, whether I agree with that image or
08:56not.
08:56Sure, but I would see him growing impatient, but I would also see him looking around and
09:00saying, wait, so the plan is Deshaun starts until he either gets injured and then just
09:04going to be this backup quarterback and be happy about it the entire time.
09:08Like, I think if you're starting a plan with a succession plan in place – because think
09:11about it, Deshaun's not going to do these contracts with the idea that one more year
09:16is all he's got in the NFL.
09:17He's 31 years old.
09:18Like, Deshaun Watson, in his eyes, he missed a lot of football and obviously he had a lot
09:21of injuries, but he missed a lot of football.
09:23He's going to want to play for 10 more years.
09:25This is not Deshaun Watson saying, next year, 2027 is my final season.
09:28So if you're Shador, why would you take 2027 as the final year for Deshaun as gospel in
09:33this succession plan?
09:35It's not a – a succession plan, every team I think has young developmental quarterback
09:39in the hopper.
09:40Not every team, but a fair amount of teams have young developmental quarterback, break
09:43glass in case of emergency.
09:45We'll go to him and see what he is.
09:46A succession plan I think is too heavy-handed.
09:49And by the way, Shador goes along with it because it's an NFL job.
09:53And I don't know if the Browns decide, you know what, Shador, why don't you go explore
09:58your value?
09:59I don't know there's a better scenario opening up for Shador Sanders in the NFL right
10:04now.
10:05No, he doesn't know that either.
10:06He has no idea if the market thinks anything of him from that way.
10:09And so I think, you know, if Shador has a problem with that, I understand it.
10:13You don't have to like it.
10:14But Cleveland probably still does remain your best option there because you know Todd
10:18Monk and you have experience here.
10:20You know your teammates.
10:22And there still will be the what if with Deshaun's health going into next year.
10:25If we go to Deshaun next year and you run this whole thing back, it is way less about
10:30who's in the backup quarterback role or way less in the it's now we have Dylan or now we
10:34have Taylor Green or any of these guys.
10:36It really is.
10:37That's Deshaun Watson's job.
10:38And then he has it.
10:39And there really should even there should be no looking in the rearview mirror.
10:42There's behind your shoulder or any of that stuff like that's your gig.
10:45And if everything goes right and continues to go right, then the idea would be is that
10:50he's your franchise quarterback and he would take the ball and run with it.
10:53I don't know that I believe in him enough for that right now, but that's why he's got
10:56the next, I don't know, 10 weeks to try to showcase that he can be that guy.
11:00If it had to be decided upon today, I'd still lean finding your quarterback in the first round
11:06of the 2027 class.
11:08But if Deshaun continues to stay healthy and the quarterback class continues to look as
11:13iffy as it is, I definitely see a world in which I can say, you know what, Shador is your
11:18long-term developmental quarterback and we'll maybe cross that bridge in the future.
