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00:15Hi, I'm Carolyn Assome and I live in London.
00:18Well, here we go.
00:20And this is my business partner, Phil Moore, who lives in Warsaw.
00:23So we'd better get into formation.
00:25I'm terrified because I'm a journalist and I'm usually on the other side of the camera.
00:30OK, green light, here we go.
00:31I'm terrified also, but equally excited to be pitching our exciting new product to the dragons,
00:36which we really hope they enjoy.
00:39Adding to Carolyn and Phil's nerves, there'll be an extra dragon to pitch to tonight
00:44as Emma Greed makes a welcome return.
00:48Look who's back, missus. Nice to see you again.
00:51Nice to see you, lovey.
00:52I guess you couldn't get enough of us.
00:55Honestly, I couldn't get enough of you.
00:57We're just too much fun, aren't we?
00:59You guys are just amazing.
01:02Thank you again.
01:03Good to see you.
01:09Bye-bye.
01:54Hello, Dragons. I'm Carolyn Assome, and this is Phil Moore. We are co-founders of LaHood, and we are here
02:02today to pitch for £150,000 in return for 15% equity.
02:10LaHood is a brand which offers a patented, portable, hands-free alternative to an umbrella, which ensures your head and
02:18your hair stays dry.
02:19It was conceived by Elliot Taylor, a hairdresser at one of London's top salons, who often noted his clients came
02:27into the salon but then got caught in a downpour when they left.
02:30Why, he wondered, was there no modern, stylish version of the plastic rain bonnet his grandmother might have wore?
02:38And so he came to me. I'm a design journalist and also a former fashion editor at the Times newspaper.
02:44I loved the functionality of Elliot's idea. I also began to think of the scalable global market potential, and it
02:53was enormous.
02:54It wasn't only for women leaving the hairdressers. His idea was for my 80-something mother-in-law on the
03:00golf course.
03:01It is for queuing at theme parks or not poking people in the eye. It is for Wimbledon spectators, Glastonbury
03:08festival-goers, or just simply protecting those prone to frizzy hair.
03:13Industry colleagues were enthused immediately, notably Anya Hein-March and Jimmy Choo-Sandra Choi.
03:21We secured press in 15 UK titles, all within the first month of launch.
03:28And we also achieved an outreach of over 2 million on Instagram, which was organic and unpaid.
03:34We've been trading for 20 months. We've had £73,000 worth of sales.
03:40Well, with exciting and innovative products in the pipeline, including sun hats, bags and ponchos and outerwear to follow, we're
03:48really ready to grow our brand.
03:50Thank you, models.
03:53A modern twist on the classic rain bonnet is the offering from Carolyn Asome and Phil Moore.
04:04They're looking to secure £150,000 for 15% of their company.
04:11I think you've found your influence, sir.
04:15Peter Jones is first to question whether the business proposition looks as good as the Behatted Dragons.
04:24Carolyn, Phil, hi.
04:26Hi.
04:28So, just to clear up this issue, did you buy the rights from the inventor?
04:33No.
04:34Actually, Elliot, whose idea it was, is my nephew.
04:37OK.
04:38And he pitched the idea to me over Christmas dinner.
04:41And you just nicked it?
04:44No, no.
04:44He's part of it.
04:45He's a shareholder in the business.
04:46Oh, he is?
04:46Yes.
04:47No, OK.
04:47So, over the last 12 months, just 12 months, what have been the sales of the product in total?
04:54The last 12 months would have been 18 turnover.
04:5818,000?
04:58Yeah.
04:59So, you're selling about £1,500 a month worth of the product?
05:02Yeah.
05:03OK.
05:04And what's the reason for that?
05:06We're a lean team of three, and we've been challenged on the funding front.
05:11We really believe we have a great brand, but at the moment, it's been challenging trying
05:17to execute social media outreach and with different tribes.
05:22I mean, there are so many different demographics that, you know, this would appeal to, and I
05:28feel this is where we need more funding, social media expertise to really, you know, target
05:32those key demographics and get work with influencers and collaborate with them to really, you know,
05:39explode it, hopefully.
05:41Carolyn, Phil.
05:43Hi.
05:43Hi.
05:44So, how much do they sell for?
05:46£49.99.
05:47And how much do they cost you to make?
05:49They cost £12 to make.
05:50£12.
05:51So, there's pretty good margin in there.
05:54You just said something about there are so many arenas to go for, and you need more funds
06:00to attack those arenas.
06:01I guess the most important thing for me to understand is, what's your primary arena?
06:07Because without focusing and understanding your first and keyest market, you are going
06:15to spend a fortune and make a little bit of difference across a lot of marshals.
06:20So, what would you say is the strongest selling point into the strongest market?
06:26I think the strongest selling point is really to protect your hair.
06:31But that's a hat, isn't it?
06:33It is a hat, but it's also, it's the functionality that you can just run around town and you don't
06:39have to carry around an umbrella.
06:41You can just wear it around your arms.
06:43But I've got a bag.
06:45Mm-hmm.
06:45And I've got a hat.
06:47Why wouldn't I just put my hat into my bag?
06:49Well, I think it was, I think you could put it in your bag.
06:57There are times when you might not be carrying a bag.
07:00Utility stuff seems kind of inconsequential to me.
07:03I think when I looked at this, I thought this is fashion or it's not.
07:07What do you think?
07:08How did I?
07:08I mean...
07:09What did you think?
07:10I'm obviously...
07:10To be honest.
07:11I'm obviously going to say...
07:13Actually, I think what?
07:14You look good, isn't it?
07:15If you just...
07:15You look ridiculous.
07:16Let me just adjust it.
07:17Yeah.
07:20Is that better?
07:20That's a much better look.
07:21That's better?
07:23Is that a better look?
07:25Honestly, it's very...
07:26Phil and Caroline.
07:26Yeah.
07:26OK, you want to build a brand.
07:30Correct.
07:31OK, so I'm looking at this now.
07:33And with my manufacturing hat on, I'd say to you, you've got lots of different designs.
07:39You've probably got to buy 1,000 metres of each design, which will probably make about 4,000 hats.
07:45You're not going to sell 4,000 hats of a design.
07:47Who's thought this through?
07:49So this sort of core primary collection was from our proof of launch concept.
07:53And so very much...
07:54That's what worries me.
07:55I don't think you've thought this through, because what I'm looking at is a load of samples as a concept.
08:02You've got little revenue, and you've got a valuation of about a million pounds.
08:08I mean, what I would have done, picked one fabric, eight colours, logo, and say, that is it.
08:14It's a novelty hat that does this job.
08:17You know?
08:18At the moment, it could be anything.
08:19And I would have thought, with your experience in fashion, you would have seen that.
08:23But, yeah, I mean, I might disagree with you.
08:29I think what we have created is, well, I've obviously talked about the functionality and how practical it is to
08:36wear.
08:37But I think, visually, this hat, David Zito, who designed it, was based the hat on the architectural silhouettes of
08:46a 1967 Cristobal Balenciaga hat.
08:49And so he really thought about that.
08:52You know, well, let's be finished.
08:54And I think, you know, initially, there were too many colours.
08:57That was a mistake.
08:58Also, while trying to be sustainable, we have made, it was about 30% of our range from LVMH dead
09:06stock.
09:07You know, one challenge we came up against was, obviously, dead stock, once it's gone, it's gone.
09:12And if you've created marketing imagery to, you know, support that, when you then do another collection, you need to
09:19do, you know, new marketing.
09:20So, Carolyn, you're actually just proving Mr. Rastrader, Tuka over here, 100%, right, you didn't think it through.
09:27You've just said it yourself.
09:29Like, you created a product with dead stock, not thinking how you would get all of that traction and then
09:35be able to gain an image.
09:36But just let me finish speaking for just a second.
09:37I think what he's saying, because this is a matter of choice and style, and I see it.
09:42As soon as you said Balenciaga, Cristobal hat, I was like, oh, yeah, I get that slant.
09:46I, like, I totally have the vision.
09:48I think what Tuka's saying is it probably would have been better as a novelty product, because the way you're
09:53using something like this actually isn't as, like, a stylistic choice.
09:58You're picking this up at Disneyland when your hair might get wet and whacking it on, because there's no other
10:02choice.
10:02And one of the things that I already is kind of giving me, like, pause for thought is that you
10:08have got one product here that, quite frankly, after 20 months isn't getting a lot of traction.
10:13And you're already talking about a sun hat, outerwear, a bag.
10:18It's like you've got to do one thing well.
10:20And at the moment, like, you haven't even got out.
10:22No.
10:23So you're adding complexity to something that you haven't figured out by your own admission, right?
10:28And you're already trying to think about what's next, what's next.
10:31That, to me, is, like, a huge red flag right now.
10:34Okay.
10:34So, for all of the reasons that I've said, I'm out, but I honestly wish you the best of luck
10:39with it.
10:41How do I make it go round?
10:43Like, so when I'm trying to wear it like this, it doesn't seem to bend and hold.
10:47I don't want it.
10:48No, shall I say?
10:49And this is another, can I do this?
10:51Yeah, go ahead.
10:51Okay.
10:53So you just have to bend it over once.
10:55I think that's your thing.
10:57Look, let's be perfectly honest.
10:59This type of product is out there.
11:01You know, you can buy these type of packs, right?
11:03They're quite...
11:03Your ultimate USP is the fact that you've added this click at the bottom, don't you?
11:08So you end up basically looking like that.
11:11Quite cool.
11:11Which is why we all would like to make you an offer, because we all love it.
11:15Your hair's looking good, Stephen.
11:17Your hair's going to be looking good when you get to do it.
11:19I think on the right person, this...
11:21Look at that model there.
11:24That's cool.
11:24Sorry.
11:25That's what I'm saying.
11:27What do you mean?
11:28I assume I'm pulling someone else and have it on.
11:30Is it cool or not?
11:32No, it's not.
11:32No, it's absolutely not.
11:33It needs to go...
11:34Like, the brim is too small.
11:35You don't look cool.
11:36The brim is too small.
11:37Well, there's...
11:38It's obviously...
11:38This must be good, right?
11:40Because you've got debate going on of whether it's good or whether it's bad.
11:43So that's a good thing.
11:44People are going to talk about it.
11:45But in terms of an opportunity in a business, it's not something I can see that I would
11:51certainly be able to add the value that I would expect and the return I want to get.
11:55So I'm going to say that I'm out.
11:57But thanks for coming in.
11:58No, thank you for your comments.
12:01Caroline, Phil, I actually do think it's cool.
12:05But for me, cool is a really...
12:06Cool is a hard thing to bet on, because it comes in and out of season.
12:10And that's a really hard business to invest in, in my view.
12:13So I'm going to say that I'm out, but I think it's cool.
12:19Caroline, Phil.
12:20Hi, Sarah.
12:21I actually really like it.
12:23Okay.
12:23As soon as the models came in and showed me, and then you explained it was to protect my hair,
12:29I was in.
12:30It's just the problem is...
12:32£49.99.
12:34I just think.
12:36You had me until you said it was £50.
12:38We really see the sweet spot for this at being £19.99.
12:42I'm pleased you've said that, because make this for $4 or $5, sell them at £19.99.
12:47Yeah.
12:47In the shops at Disneyland or anywhere else, when people just need to buy something,
12:52I actually think it could work.
12:55So the other thing I'm concerned about is, you've asked for a lot of money,
12:59and I'm suddenly thinking, I'm passionate enough that I would buy one.
13:02Not at 50 quid, but I would buy one.
13:05So, I'm not passionate enough that I'd put £150,000 of my own money in.
13:08I'm not quite there.
13:11So, I'm in on the product front, but on the investment front, I'm sorry, I'm out.
13:16Caroline, Phil, I think you've got a decision to make.
13:20I actually worry about a £20 mark, because I think it's neither here nor there.
13:26I think your decision, is this a high-end fashion brand, or is this a cheap as chips?
13:33We're going to grab it when we're going around Disney World, because it's raining,
13:36and £19.99 is too expensive for that.
13:39So, I think you've got a big decision to decide which rate you're going to go,
13:43but I'm afraid I won't be investing.
13:45Time out.
13:49Look, guys, you've got one thing going for you.
13:53You've got the design, and that's what I would start with.
13:57Then I would say to myself, how do I get this product out there where it draws attention?
14:03So, what I would do is I would collaborate with famous people,
14:10and you do limited editions, and you become a must-have hat.
14:17Rather than trying to build a whole mumble-jumble of product that doesn't mean anything,
14:22what I'm trying to get to is use what you've got before you do anything else.
14:27OK.
14:28So, for that reason, I'm out.
14:32Thank you all for your time.
14:34No problem.
14:36Carolyn and Phil leave the den without an investment.
14:41But the duo aren't planning to let the rejection of their business deter them from their mission.
14:46I think the Dragons have missed an opportunity because I do feel it resonates, you know.
14:52We've definitely met enough people that have said, we like it, it's cool.
14:59It's been fascinating.
15:01A huge learning curve, but the curve's not over.
15:04So, watch this space.
15:20Hi, I'm Sarah-Louise Fairburn.
15:23I live in Lincolnshire.
15:24I have four amazing children, and I'm 40 years old.
15:28I started the business in September 2020.
15:31I started it on my own, and at that time, I even had my children coming up with ideas
15:36for gift boxes and helping me pack.
15:40The modern way to diamond gift.
15:43It's hampers, isn't it?
15:44Yeah, I love a hamper.
15:49It's been incredibly challenging to get the business where it is, but I'm not one to quit.
15:55And my daughters, they keep telling me, come on, Mum, you can do this.
15:59And they always tell me just to never give up.
16:01So, I can't, can I?
16:10Hi, Dragons.
16:13I'm Sarah-Louise, founder of Input Maker, mum to four amazing children.
16:19And I am so excited to meet you all today.
16:23Input Maker is the modern way to dine and gift.
16:27We're revolutionising the food and drink gifting sector, creating memories for our customers,
16:33whether it be for a corporate client or for a loved one.
16:37So, Dragons, I'm sure you've received corporate food gifts over the years.
16:41And I bet if you're being honest, the loose leaf tea is still sat in the back of your cupboard,
16:46and the chutney has probably made its way to the Harvest Festival.
16:51I wanted a gifting experience that would be really personalised for the customer,
16:55that would really make them feel something about the product.
17:00Our journey began in September 2020.
17:03In our first year, we shipped approximately 1,400 parcels.
17:09This year, we're on track to deliver 31,000 parcels, and we are forecasting a shipment of 100,000 parcels
17:21by 2028.
17:24I'm looking for £100,000 for a 10% equity share of Input Maker.
17:31I've got some little gifts for you.
17:35Food and drink gift hampers for a multitude of occasions...
17:39They're a little bit heavy as well.
17:41..is the proposition from Sarah Louise Fairbairn.
17:47She's seeking £100,000 in return for a 10% share in her business.
17:53I love this brand.
17:57Tuca Suleiman is first to lift the lid on the details of the enterprise.
18:06Right, Sarah Louise.
18:08Hello.
18:09Well, that was a good pitch.
18:11So, prior to 2020, what were you doing?
18:14So, I ran a really big food and farming business with my husband.
18:18Right.
18:19We were supplying products to all the big supermarkets in the UK,
18:23and I headed up brand and sales.
18:26Hence the fact that you could source all these products...
18:29Yeah.
18:30..through your connections.
18:31Yeah, exactly.
18:31So, sadly, myself and my husband separated.
18:34Oh, I'm sorry to hear that.
18:35So, I had to leave the business, and it had been my life for so long.
18:38But the gift was I had so many amazing connections,
18:42and I know food really well.
18:44Right.
18:44OK.
18:45Well, that gives you credibility.
18:48OK.
18:49So, give us a pattern of your years of trading and your gross profit and your net profit
18:53to get some idea of profit.
18:55So, just to give you a flavour, so, year ending 22, we turned over £89,000, and our net profit
19:06was minus £168,000, and then end of February 23, we turned over £360,000.
19:16Net profit?
19:17It was minus £360,000.
19:21And 24?
19:23It gets worse before it gets better.
19:25I've heard that before.
19:26So, it does.
19:27So, year ending 24, we turned over £1.15 million,
19:33and we made a net profit of minus £800,000.
19:40So, the next year?
19:41So, this coming year, we're projecting we're going to turn over £2.28 million.
19:46Yeah.
19:47And we're going to have a net profit of £277,000.
19:51OK.
19:52So, where did the money come from?
19:54Yeah, so, the money is all from personal reserves,
19:56so I was quite successful in what I did supplying to all the retailers,
20:00so that's my personal...
20:02Million pounds?
20:02That's my personal cash,
20:04and it has taken a lot for me to invest in that personally,
20:08but I believe in this business, and I know it's going to grow.
20:13OK.
20:14OK, so, how are you tracking for this year, then?
20:17Because you've predicted you're going to do roughly £2.3 million this year?
20:20Yeah, so, we're tracking really well.
20:22So, so far up to May, we've turned over £300,000.
20:25Yeah.
20:27And net margin is minus £168.
20:29So, you've lost £168,000 so far.
20:32We have, Stephen, but that is all forecasted in the model,
20:34and the losses have greatly reduced from last year.
20:38It's interesting, because when I look at those numbers,
20:40if I didn't know the industry,
20:41I would assume I was looking at, like, a technology company or something.
20:45So, over the last few years,
20:47that is the way I've sort of seen the business,
20:49as an online business,
20:50and we've just pushed so much money into marketing,
20:54brand, website, e-commerce.
20:55I have spent thousands.
20:58I had a few different agencies and people into the business
21:01that told me they could do so much on Google Advertising,
21:05and it cost me dearly to acquire a customer.
21:09So, back when I first started,
21:10cost to acquire a customer sometimes was £110.
21:15Oi, oi, oi.
21:16It was absolutely bonkers.
21:18Looking at it this month,
21:19it's £37 to acquire a customer online,
21:22and I know I've built a brand
21:24that is gaining traction now as well.
21:28Your average basket is how much?
21:31Our average order value has been £65.
21:34It's now moved to £75.
21:36And your cost of acquisition is £30-odd?
21:38Yes.
21:39Yeah, so that's the difficulty.
21:41Do you know what I would do?
21:41I would basically turn off marketing.
21:44I would really go back to basics on this business,
21:47and that is going to mean rebuilding the business
21:50in a sustainable way from scratch,
21:51because you can't keep going on.
21:53That's a great advice.
21:54That's what you have to do in this stage.
21:56Everything you've just said, we've done,
21:59and we've started doing that in January.
22:01But you've made a loss this year.
22:02So far I have 168 already.
22:04But coming into October,
22:05we're going to start to make a profit,
22:07then coming into Christmas,
22:08we're going to make a really amazing profit.
22:11But the thing is, you shouldn't...
22:12I think that Stephen's advice is fantastic, by the way.
22:15I think that's spot on.
22:16It really is. You've got to listen to it.
22:18Because that will then immediately tell you
22:20whether you've got a sustainable business.
22:22Do you mean to turn the ads off, Peter?
22:23Yes.
22:24Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
22:25Turn it literally for one month.
22:26Yeah, but more than turn the ads off, Sarah Lewis,
22:28I think the big issue here
22:30is that you have well and truly drunk
22:33the start-up Kool-Aid, right?
22:35It's like you have told yourself
22:36that, like, just ploughing money into this
22:39with some kind of, like, idea of,
22:41you know, I'm on a growth journey.
22:43It's like you came out here
22:43and pitched it like a good'un.
22:45But your numbers exposed you entirely.
22:48And I'm sitting here thinking,
22:50you, like, are an incredible woman.
22:53You've clearly been very successful.
22:55But this ain't it.
22:57And just because of everything that you've done
22:59over the last couple of years,
23:00ploughing money in,
23:01it's not going to suddenly just wake up.
23:04That's not going to happen.
23:05What you're going to do
23:06is get further and further and further into debt.
23:08And you just have to wake up.
23:09You have to tell yourself the truth.
23:11Because what you're telling yourself at the moment
23:13is leading you down a path
23:15that is just, it's going to be disastrous.
23:16And it's all your own money right now.
23:18Yeah, of course.
23:19Everything you're saying to me,
23:21I hear you, I listen to you.
23:22I've had exactly the same feelings.
23:24But I genuinely believe
23:26there's a market for this product.
23:28Customers keep buying this product.
23:30We've got lots of other retailers as well
23:32that are asking us to go in
23:33and meet with them.
23:38It's difficult to sit in this chair.
23:40It's a little bit,
23:42it's a little bit heartbreaking in a way.
23:44And I'd like to help but feel for you
23:46because I do sense
23:48that you're a bit of a runaway train.
23:51But in terms of a business,
23:52you've come in to pitch today for this business.
23:54And I think you've got some amazing advice.
23:57Turning all those things off
23:58just to see if you've got a business
24:00and get yourself back on your feet,
24:02you're there.
24:03But at the moment,
24:05it's just,
24:05it's not an investable opportunity.
24:08So I'm going to say that I'm out.
24:10Thank you, Peter.
24:14Sarah, can I ask you,
24:15are you going to turn the ads off?
24:18I'm going to really turn them down.
24:21Why wouldn't you turn them off?
24:23Just to see if the organic comes through.
24:24No, just there's,
24:26because you really,
24:27yeah, you need to figure out
24:28if this is a sustainable business
24:29underneath there.
24:31Yeah.
24:31Do you know what it was?
24:32It isn't that I had loads of cash in the banks.
24:34It frightens me so much personally
24:36that I've put so much in.
24:37And it's not as if I'm sat on abundance of cash
24:39because I really am not.
24:42It's more a case of,
24:43it's that you start to see things growing
24:45and then, you know,
24:47you start to then put,
24:48you want to put more in, don't you?
24:49Because I was like,
24:50I feel like I'm just on the edge
24:51of it being amazing.
24:53You're maybe the most resilient entrepreneur
24:56that I've ever seen.
24:58Because you can take,
24:59you can take a lot,
25:00you've been through a lot,
25:01I can tell.
25:02But sometimes that resilience
25:03can also just wane over a little bit
25:06into delusion.
25:07And there's a very fine line.
25:09And we all,
25:10as founders,
25:11we live there.
25:12We have to.
25:13We have to believe something is possible.
25:15But at the same time,
25:17that delusion can cost us.
25:22You inspire me as a human.
25:25But yeah,
25:26this is not an investment for me.
25:28So I'm going to say that I'm out.
25:30Okay.
25:32Sarah Louise,
25:33I can see how passionate,
25:35how driven you are.
25:37You have all of the ingredients
25:39that will make a successful entrepreneur.
25:42Honestly,
25:42I don't believe this is ever going to work.
25:46So I can't invest today and I'm out.
25:49Okay, thank you, Sarah.
25:53You know,
25:54Sarah Louise,
25:55I think this must be like,
25:56quite a moment for you.
25:58Quite,
25:59quite a difficult moment.
26:01And this is going to feel like a,
26:03literally like a backhand.
26:04And it should,
26:05in so many ways,
26:06because in order for you to get back on track,
26:10you're going to need to do everything differently.
26:12Yeah.
26:13You've got to listen
26:14and take everything in
26:16and know that now is the moment
26:18to scale right down.
26:19No one's saying stop your business,
26:21but you've got to scale it down
26:22and you just fix the fundamentals.
26:25So for all those reasons,
26:26I'm out.
26:27I wish you the best of luck.
26:29And more than that,
26:30I just wish that you listen.
26:32That's it.
26:33I'm definitely listening.
26:39Sarah Louise,
26:41online is tough.
26:43Yeah.
26:44And I agree with what Stephen says.
26:47You may have to shut the online off.
26:49Yeah.
26:50You may have to bring it right back.
26:53And in this case,
26:55maybe less is more.
26:58Okay.
26:58But unfortunately,
27:00you know,
27:01the business today to me
27:03is uninvestable.
27:05So for that reason,
27:06I'm out.
27:07Okay.
27:08Thank you for your advice.
27:10So,
27:14it looks lovely.
27:16Thank you,
27:16I mean,
27:17it looks,
27:18if I receive that,
27:19I always,
27:20actually,
27:20I get more excited the moment
27:21before I open a box.
27:23You know,
27:23it's got to look from that moment
27:25that it arrives.
27:26Yeah,
27:26that's the point.
27:27Exactly.
27:28And I get it.
27:28So that's lovely.
27:29You have captured that completely.
27:33Can you feel the butt?
27:34I can feel the butt.
27:36You haven't worked.
27:37You don't have a,
27:38but this isn't a business.
27:40Okay.
27:40And I honestly can't get my head around
27:43how you had three years
27:45of it getting worse.
27:47Yeah.
27:48And I want you to stop making the mistakes
27:51that you're making.
27:52And I know you say,
27:54I hear you.
27:55I'm not sure it's going in.
27:57And don't walk out and think,
27:59right,
27:59I'm going to prove them wrong.
28:00Because I'm going to prove them wrong
28:02is not,
28:03and it's not a clever way
28:05of looking at your business again
28:07and changing the way you're doing things.
28:10So I won't be investing.
28:12I'm out.
28:14Thank you so much.
28:18Sadly for Sarah Louise,
28:20she must depart the den empty-handed.
28:26But despite the dragon's doubts,
28:28she remains upbeat about the future.
28:33Obviously, I'm really disappointed
28:35that we didn't get an investment.
28:37I'm hoping to prove them wrong.
28:39I don't think that's from a delusional perspective.
28:40I think it's because I can see a path,
28:43really, to greatness for the business.
28:59Hi, I'm Jay McGregor.
29:00I'm 26 years old,
29:01and I'm from Kent.
29:03You got this.
29:06Starting this business
29:07came out of nowhere.
29:11Just like when my dad passed away,
29:12we weren't expecting it.
29:13It was something that completely rocked our worlds
29:15and was probably one of the most traumatic things
29:17I've ever faced.
29:18Dad, please make sure that you are
29:20looking out for me.
29:22On my shoulder.
29:23Keep your pick up.
29:25But out of that pain grew a lot of purpose.
29:28I've got the heart and the grit and the drive
29:30to make sure that it succeeds.
29:32And because it is so personal,
29:33I've got a higher purpose
29:34and a higher energy that is guiding me.
29:42Hi, dragons.
29:43Hi.
29:44Hello.
29:45Hi, I'm Jay.
29:47Just so you know,
29:48I am very neurodivergent.
29:50I've got dyslexia and dyscalculia.
29:51So I will be using my iPad
29:53for the first part of the pitch.
29:54I really hope that English comes out of my mouth.
29:57Please bear with me if not.
30:03Okay.
30:05My name is Jay McGregor
30:06and I'm the founder of Graceful Graves.
30:09Today, I'm seeking a £70,000 investment
30:12in exchange for 10% equity in my business.
30:16We all face the inevitability of losing our loved ones.
30:19Despite the universal experience of grief,
30:21the aftercare of graves is often overlooked.
30:24Graceful Graves is set to change that
30:26by providing mobile grave cleaning
30:28and maintenance services via subscription packages
30:31to all those who need us
30:32to be able to help maintain your loved one's
30:34final rest in place.
30:36As a radio and TV presenter from South London,
30:39starting this business was not on my radar.
30:42But sadly, in March 2020,
30:43I lost my dad
30:44and I got real comfort
30:46in caring for his grave.
30:48Sorry.
30:48It's okay.
30:50Take your time.
31:04Sorry, I was holding that in all day.
31:07So I was at the cemetery so often
31:09that people thought I worked there
31:11and then strangers started asking me for help
31:13if I would clean their graves too.
31:14And it really inspired me to desire a service
31:16where I could provide the same level of care
31:18that I was giving to my dad's grave
31:19to all who needed it.
31:21Dragons, with your investment,
31:23I really want to scale this business.
31:24I want to improve my offering
31:25and bring nationwide coverage
31:27to all families who need us.
31:29And we're not only a transaction,
31:31we're building a community of grievers online
31:33through our viral videos
31:34and compassionate content
31:36through a founder
31:37who's literally been there
31:38and is still on her grief journey
31:39but wants to help others.
31:41Join us in making grief more graceful.
31:46An impassioned pitch from Jay McGregor,
31:49who's looking for investment
31:51in her mobile grave cleaning business.
31:54Well done.
31:55Well done, Jay.
31:57She's asking for £70,000
31:59in exchange for 10% of her company.
32:02And it seems Jay's pitch
32:04has already struck a chord
32:05with guest dragon Emma Greed.
32:10I mean, well done on that pitch.
32:12As a dyslexic, neurodivergent woman myself,
32:15I really admire the fact
32:17that not only did you just come out
32:18and address that immediately
32:20with all of us,
32:21but you just took the tools
32:23that you needed
32:23to make this pitch
32:24completely your own
32:25and it was perfection.
32:27Thank you so much.
32:28Congratulations there.
32:29You can take a big deep breath now, love.
32:30Just shake it out.
32:32Will you just tell me
32:33a little bit about your background?
32:34What were you doing
32:35before you started this business?
32:37So my background comes from
32:39Pirate Radio,
32:40Community Radio and Commercial.
32:41I worked behind the scenes
32:42in production
32:42and worked my way up
32:44to being a presenter.
32:45And now I'm the voice
32:46of Channel 4 and E4.
32:47So you may have heard me
32:48introducing some of your favourite shows
32:50like Gogglebox and First Dates.
32:52I love that.
32:53And do you still do that now?
32:54Yes, I still do that.
32:55But now I'm at the perfect point
32:57where I can use my media background
32:58and my training
32:59to really help with my business.
33:00So I'm working on cool things
33:01like documentaries
33:02and the grief space,
33:03looking at different traditions
33:03and cultures
33:04and the way we grieve,
33:06which nicely feeds into my business
33:07but also allows me
33:08to really connect
33:09with my audiences
33:10and my potential customers.
33:12So tell me,
33:13what does that actually look like?
33:14How do you find customers?
33:15Because I'm imagining
33:16that you are not just
33:17wandering around cemeteries everywhere.
33:19No, definitely not.
33:20You've still got to find a customer.
33:22Still got to find the customer.
33:23So a lot of it comes
33:23from word of mouth,
33:24but social media
33:25has been a catalyst.
33:26We have got over 1.8 million
33:29organic views
33:29across 24 videos
33:31and that was accidental.
33:32Me cleaning graves
33:33the same way
33:34you watch a viral pool cleaner
33:35or a viral carpet cleaner.
33:37People were really
33:38understanding the stories
33:39behind it
33:39and fascinated
33:40by the cleaning
33:41that I was doing,
33:42the different products
33:43that I was using
33:43and from that.
33:44Clean talk is a thing, right?
33:46So that's how you picked up customers
33:47and people are what?
33:48Like they're just DMing you
33:49and messaging you
33:50and then you're providing
33:51the service that way.
33:52Yeah, they're coming to us
33:53that way
33:53and then they refer them
33:54to the website,
33:54they choose the package
33:55that they think they want
33:56and then we go down
33:57and we assess the graves,
33:58make sure it's suitable
33:58and then we get clean
34:00within seven days.
34:01Wow.
34:02And one last question
34:03from me,
34:04how are you charging?
34:05How are we charging?
34:06So we've got three packages.
34:07Our violet package
34:08is at £110
34:10and that's for monthly
34:11grave cleans
34:11and tidied ups.
34:13Our willow package
34:14is £440 per year
34:16and that's quarterly care
34:17on four dates of your choice
34:18and then our lavender package
34:21is £120
34:22for a one-off
34:23grave clean
34:23and tidy up.
34:26How many customers
34:26have you got, Jay,
34:27at the moment?
34:28So we are pre-revenue
34:30at the moment.
34:30We have done this
34:31on a pool of
34:3210 recurring subscription customers
34:34and we've used
34:35all the data
34:35that we've been getting
34:36from social media
34:37to target the locations
34:38that we want to scale
34:39and reach nationwide
34:40once I can grow a team
34:42of grave guardians.
34:43We want to have
34:44a nationwide network
34:45of grave cleaners
34:46and you can do this
34:47part-time around your job.
34:49So is that going to be the model?
34:51You're not going to
34:51necessarily employ the cleaners?
34:53You're going to assign
34:54local cleaners
34:55to do the job,
34:56is that?
34:57Yes, the main aim
34:58is to scale
34:59so that we can have
35:00a network
35:00and regional hubs.
35:02Everyone will have
35:02the same training
35:03and the same sensitivity
35:05around what we're doing
35:06and then we'll be able
35:07to let them carry out
35:08the Graceful Graves work
35:09depending on their area.
35:12Interesting.
35:14Jay.
35:14Hi.
35:15I can remember
35:16when I was little
35:17and every month
35:19I used to take my grandma,
35:21she used to want to go
35:22and clean my granddad's grave
35:24and we used to pack
35:25the little kit
35:25and I used to walk her
35:27up to the cemetery
35:28because she couldn't
35:29walk very well
35:29and I used to have to link her
35:30and walk her up
35:31to the cemetery
35:31and it would take us
35:32a couple of hours
35:33to fill a pop bottle
35:35right up of washing up
35:36liquid water
35:36and scrub it all down
35:38and like you said
35:39it was a healing process
35:40for her.
35:41It meant a lot
35:42to my grandma
35:43to do that herself
35:44and a couple of times
35:45when she wasn't
35:46well enough to
35:47I went and did it
35:48for her
35:49but I don't feel like
35:51she would have ever
35:51wanted someone else
35:52to do that
35:53because it was a bit
35:53of a private family thing.
35:55Do you come across
35:55that barrier very much?
35:57We do come across that
35:59but that's when
36:00it gets to a point
36:01where those kind of
36:02older generations
36:03do have to come to a point
36:05and say look
36:05my health issues
36:06are not allowing me
36:07and they would rather
36:08it be done
36:08and know that
36:09their little flowers
36:10are there
36:10their note is there
36:11if there's anything
36:11personal they'd like
36:12us to include
36:13we can do that.
36:14Well that also speaks
36:16to my final concern
36:17on it is
36:18it felt really
36:19expensive to me.
36:21For somebody to commit
36:23£110 a month
36:24that's a lot of money
36:26annually
36:27for someone to be
36:28spending on this.
36:29Are you seeing that
36:30much as a barrier
36:30to people signing up?
36:32Not at the moment
36:33because we have had
36:34families ask to split
36:35the cost between
36:36themselves
36:36so for example
36:37if a parent dies
36:38and there are a couple
36:39of siblings
36:40a lot of them
36:40will spread that
36:41payment out between them
36:42so it doesn't feel
36:43like one heavy cost
36:44and for me
36:45it's like
36:46I see this as a gift
36:47you could buy somebody
36:48once they've had
36:49a loved one
36:50that's passed away
36:50like a practical gift
36:51and supports their
36:52flowers are great
36:53but here's something
36:54that might give you
36:54some peace of mind
36:55and you know
36:56we are going to cover
36:57this for you
36:58for your loved ones.
37:01Jay.
37:02Hi.
37:03Hi.
37:04I feel your pain
37:05because I lost my dad
37:06last year
37:07so I know that feeling.
37:10I'm sorry to hear that
37:10and thank you
37:11for sharing that
37:11with me.
37:14This is really
37:15difficult to invest in
37:17at the moment
37:17because what we want
37:19to see
37:19and I particularly
37:20would want to see
37:21is a little bit
37:22of a proof of concept.
37:23Yeah.
37:24I'd like to see that
37:25okay
37:25could this scale
37:27and what could
37:27that scale look like
37:28because that enables me
37:30then to get
37:30an understanding
37:31of where this business
37:32could go
37:32and if you're able
37:34to sort of have
37:34two to three hundred
37:35customers
37:36and you could see
37:37the regularity
37:38of those customers
37:39and then you could see
37:40how this could
37:40sort of grow out.
37:42Do you know what?
37:43I think this could be
37:44something that might
37:45be really interesting
37:46to invest in.
37:48At the moment though
37:49I do think
37:50it's just too early
37:51for me
37:52to come and
37:53jump in with you
37:54but the reason why
37:55I'm spending a bit of time
37:56telling you this
37:57is that
37:57I want to encourage you
37:59to keep going with this
38:02but
38:02as you've pitched today
38:04it's not something
38:05I can invest in
38:05I'm going to say
38:06that I'm out
38:06but I just wanted
38:07to share my thoughts
38:08and feelings
38:09because I was quite
38:10touched by your pitch.
38:11Thank you
38:12I really appreciate that
38:13and completely respect
38:14that you're out.
38:16Jay.
38:17Hi.
38:18The thing I'm really
38:19struggling to grapple with
38:21is
38:22it's okay for you
38:24to build a business
38:25because you're building
38:26a living
38:27out of doing this.
38:29As an investor
38:29all I am doing
38:31is making profit
38:33from a service
38:34connected with
38:35people's grief
38:36and that is something
38:37I'm really struggling with
38:38however
38:39I don't think
38:40that is a reflection
38:41on you as a fantastic
38:42entrepreneur
38:43on this
38:43as a very needed
38:45business model
38:45in the market
38:46and I don't think
38:47there is any reason
38:47why you shouldn't
38:48make money out of this
38:50because for you
38:51it is about
38:52earning a living
38:52doing something
38:53you're passionate about
38:54it just doesn't feel right
38:55as an investor
38:56to make money out of it
38:57does that make sense?
38:58Yeah that's fair enough.
38:59I hope that makes sense
39:00it's with a heavy heart
39:01but I have to say
39:02it just doesn't feel right
39:04for me so I'm going
39:05to say that I'm out.
39:06Okay thank you.
39:09I think you are
39:10definitely going to
39:11make a good business
39:12out of this.
39:13I question
39:15how big it is
39:16going to get
39:17because I think
39:17as you get bigger
39:18you're going to be loaded
39:19with a load of costs
39:20because you'll want it
39:21to be as good
39:22as every grave
39:24to be delivered
39:24in the same way
39:25that you deliver it
39:26and that is going
39:27to take a lot of time
39:28in terms of quality control
39:30and recruitment control
39:32so I'm really sorry
39:33although I applaud you
39:34for your thinking process
39:36and you are very impressive
39:37but I'm afraid
39:39it's not an investment
39:39for me
39:40I'm out.
39:42I appreciate that.
39:44Jay.
39:45Hiya.
39:46I'm questioning
39:48first of all
39:49when I invest
39:51normally I'm hands on
39:53and I get involved
39:55I don't know
39:56how I can get
39:56happy hands on
39:57how I can get involved
39:58however
39:59You're a pair of marigolds
40:00Yep
40:02However
40:02I think at the moment
40:03you're a bit early
40:05and I think
40:07it's been said
40:07you need to grow
40:09a little bit bigger
40:11but for me
40:13it's just
40:13I don't feel passionate
40:15about it
40:15so I'm out.
40:17No that's fair
40:18and thank you so much
40:19for sharing those thoughts.
40:22Oh Jay
40:23such a difficult one
40:24this one
40:25because like everybody said
40:27like you are
40:28phenomenal
40:29I've been sitting here
40:30listening to
40:30everybody give their feedback
40:33and
40:33you know
40:35it sounds awful
40:36it's like
40:37I have zero ambition
40:38to be in the cleaning business
40:40for graves
40:42for anything else
40:42I feel like I spent
40:43my whole bloody childhood
40:44like cleaning up
40:46I had a mum
40:46who was like a clean freak
40:48and I don't want to go back
40:48in any way
40:49shape or form
40:50it's just not
40:51where my head's at
40:52so I don't want to
40:53discourage you
40:54because I think
40:55that you have to
40:55follow your heart
40:57and do your own journey
40:58and I wish you
40:58the best of luck with it
40:59but for me
41:00I'm out.
41:05Jenny
41:05I don't think
41:07this is an investable
41:08business for me
41:10however
41:11when I look at
41:12how I would run
41:12this business
41:13if I was in your shoes
41:14I actually wouldn't
41:15be seeking an investor
41:16I'd go
41:17one grave at a time
41:19and I'd scale
41:20the business
41:21slowly
41:22because sometimes
41:23in business
41:24when you're at the start
41:24capital can be a curse
41:26because it means
41:27that you can rush
41:29and when you rush
41:30you overlook
41:30some of the things
41:32you have to figure out
41:32to ensure the business
41:33is solid and sustainable
41:35so I actually think
41:36you can do this
41:37without an investor
41:38and I actually think
41:38you should
41:38because I think
41:39if you do
41:40you'll build a much
41:41more sustainable business
41:42I'm going to say
41:43that I'm not
41:44but I wish you
41:44the very best
41:44Thank you so much
41:45I really appreciate that
41:47Good luck Jay
41:48Thank you very much
41:49Nice to see you
41:52Sadly for Jay
41:53she departs the den
41:55without a deal
41:56I think you're
41:57going to clean up
41:57Oh
41:58Good one
41:59Good one
42:01But she walks away
42:02with plenty of positives
42:04upon which to reflect
42:05I think there's always
42:07a level of disappointment
42:07when you don't get
42:09investment
42:09but how can I be
42:10disappointed when
42:11they believe so strongly
42:12in me
42:13and they believe
42:13in the business
42:27Hello
42:28my name is Francisco
42:30Jimenez
42:30I live in London
42:31and I'm originally
42:33from Mexico City
42:35Our product
42:36is the biggest innovation
42:37in the hairdressing world
42:40since the hairdryer
42:45It's paint
42:45It's hair dye
42:46It's mixing paint
42:48to create new colours
42:49I think it looks
42:50hair dye-ish
42:50I wonder if they can
42:52match my hair
42:54I'm not sure
42:55there's much going to be
42:55done with that
42:56to be fair
42:59Our business is
43:01pursuing a very large
43:02opportunity
43:03in a very large
43:04industry
43:05So obviously
43:07our ask is high
43:09but we believe
43:10that this will be
43:10a billion dollar company
43:22Hello dragons
43:23My name is Francisco
43:25Jimenez
43:25and I am the CEO
43:27and founder
43:27of Jupe Beauty
43:29Let me get you started
43:30by imagining
43:32the following
43:32You are a hairdresser
43:34in the salon
43:34and your client
43:36just showed up
43:37and then you have
43:38to prepare
43:39her perfect hair
43:39colour formula
43:40This is what Juve
43:42is going to solve
43:44How it works
43:45is you log in
43:48find your client
43:50put the ball
43:51in the hair colour device
43:56and start dispensing
43:57your hair colour
43:58for your client
44:00Very light blonde violet
44:02she's got good hair
44:03that client
44:03That's amazing
44:04Great hair choice
44:06Yeah
44:06So before you are
44:08actually laughing
44:09or thinking
44:10what am I hearing
44:11about a ball guy
44:12telling me about
44:13a hair colour business
44:14Let me tell you
44:16that this is my second
44:17beauty tech company
44:19in hair colour
44:19and the first one
44:21I successfully sold
44:22for more than
44:22200 million
44:26Francisco
44:27I'd like to make you
44:28offer
44:30I'll offer you
44:31I'll offer you
44:32all of the money
44:33you're about to ask me for
44:34for the percentage
44:35that you want
44:38So let me tell you
44:39about Juve
44:40It helps eliminate
44:41the waste
44:42that happens
44:43in the salon
44:44where the hairdresser
44:44has to open
44:45multiple tubes of colour
44:46to mix colour
44:47for a single client
44:48but it is
44:50a lot more than
44:50just a dispensing device
44:52it actually saves
44:53automatically
44:54all of your
44:55formula creations
44:56for your clients
44:57keeping the hair colour history
44:59it actually tracks
45:00all of the inventory
45:01that you have been using
45:02and it automatically
45:03restocks you
45:04so that you don't have
45:05to worry about ordering
45:06To tell you about
45:07the business model
45:08is quite straightforward
45:09it's very similar
45:10to that of the printer
45:11and ink business model
45:13where we are not
45:14selling the hair colour device
45:16we really are selling
45:17the proprietary hair colour
45:19that goes inside our system
45:22You as a salon
45:23will pay 49 pounds
45:24per month
45:25to list all of the
45:26equipment
45:27and then on top of that
45:29you pay for the hair colour
45:30that you actually use
45:31as you use it
45:33To put it in perspective
45:34a salon of 4 to 5
45:37hairdressers
45:37can use between
45:38800 to 1000 pounds
45:39in hair colour
45:40per month
45:41and we have
45:42an operating margin
45:43of 55 percent
45:45so a salon that uses you
45:47should contribute
45:48about 500 pounds
45:49per month
45:50in profit
45:51We have a couple of patents
45:52we have been working
45:53in this for three years
45:54we just launched
45:56literally just launched
45:57we have already
45:58a waiting list
45:59of about 500 salons
46:00so I am here requesting
46:03an investment
46:04of 250 000 pounds
46:07for one percent of the company
46:12one percent
46:14thank you for your consideration
46:21A tech platform
46:23intended to revolutionize
46:25the way professional
46:25hairstylists apply colour
46:27is the brainchild of
46:29Francisco Jimenez
46:31well done
46:31well done
46:32great coach
46:32thank you
46:36Francisco is seeking
46:38250 000 pounds
46:40in return for a one percent
46:42stake in his business
46:43I think peter is only
46:44half joking now
46:45I actually thought he was
46:46going to get up and shake
46:47your hand on an offer
46:49news of the entrepreneur's
46:50previous success
46:52appears to have softened up
46:53peter jones
46:55but can Francisco
46:56convince the dragons
46:57that his current enterprise
46:59has similar potential
47:04Francisco
47:06going back to what you said
47:08about
47:09you you give these to the salons
47:12and they pay a rent
47:14what is it 49 pounds per month
47:17just for the equipment
47:18just for the equipment
47:19that includes the ipad
47:20and what does all that cost you
47:22so the unit economics for us
47:24is that right now
47:25with low volumes
47:26we're paying 600 pounds
47:27per device
47:28so it pays for itself
47:29over a year say
47:30yeah
47:31now so the the actual dye
47:34now i'm assuming that
47:36you are challenging
47:38the big dye companies
47:39or are you buying this
47:40directly wholesale in bulk
47:42from the
47:44from the companies
47:45no we engineer our own formulas
47:47we work with a lab in
47:48Switzerland that specializes
47:49only in her color formulation
47:51right
47:51and that's where the business is
47:53like like doing it
47:55buying the product
47:56the highest quality so
47:58fine so i have a salon
48:00and i'm buying clarion
48:02or whatever the dye stuff is
48:05like for like
48:07what would your price be
48:09like gram by gram
48:10our product costs the same
48:11as the top
48:13luxury color
48:14professional color
48:15in our category
48:17but with our system
48:18we're reducing so much waste
48:20that you as a salon owner
48:21should see savings
48:23whatever you're spending today
48:24because think about it
48:26if you're in the salon
48:26a hairdresser would normally
48:28open two tubes of color
48:29to create a mix
48:31there's a really good chance
48:32that the second part of that
48:34tube of color doesn't get used
48:35and goes to waste
48:36right
48:37so then that's that
48:38we can be quality
48:40but you get to save money
48:45francisco
48:46i'm i'm a woman of a certain age
48:48i dye my hair pretty consistently
48:50but i'm extremely brand loyal
48:52and it's my understanding that most
48:54incredible stylists and even certain salons
48:57are they they have an affiliation
49:00with a certain brand
49:02so are you seeing any kind of pushback so far
49:06obviously there's legacy of the people
49:08who may be with brand a or b
49:09and then they're training that system
49:11so there's a little bit of friction
49:13but i will have to say
49:14when they see this they get it
49:17that's the incentive
49:17the machine is the
49:18but that's the entry
49:19the hardware is the incentive
49:20that's incentive to get them started
49:21and then after that
49:23then they want to test and make sure that it works
49:26and just about every single demo that we have done
49:29to the people that have requested one
49:30have switched
49:32so you're not getting a lot of resistance
49:34no but quite honestly i'm not
49:39francisco
49:40have you got revenue forecasts for the next couple of years
49:43yeah so for this year we should be doing slightly shy
49:45of like a million pounds
49:48and then next year we should do about six million
49:52you said your previous business was acquired for 200 million dollars
49:57euros yeah euros okay so um presumably you can fund this business yourself
50:01i could i have invested significantly into this
50:04yeah but i have two funds that are partners with me in this journey
50:08and how much have they invested in total
50:10so the total amount of investment to the business is north of five million pounds
50:16and in terms of the capital you've raised are you raising more money
50:19i'm raising more money so obviously like this is part of a larger fundraising
50:22um effort how how much so we're raising four million in total
50:27okay and how how much of that have you raised already
50:31we are three quarters of the way through
50:34there's a million pounds left in this round
50:37okay and who are those investors what what kind of investors is
50:40so i have a couple of high network individuals
50:44they have a connection to the bb industry as well
50:47and then the existing investors are participating
50:50and they've they've they've all invested at a pre-money valuation of 25 million
50:54yes they're this part of the round
50:56it's really like having more smart people working and being my partners that make it successful
51:02you're the smart one asking for 250 for one percent
51:07look i think you're great however if i have to stick to my true rules
51:14i don't get out of bed for one percent yeah i get it so for that reason i'm out
51:21well i appreciate it thank you very much for the honest feedback
51:26francisco you're very very good but you don't need any of us to tell you that you know that you've
51:31got a proven track record you've put your own money you've just got everything going for you and i'm
51:36guessing the offer that's on the table is kind of like this is what i'm offering are you in or
51:40are you out
51:42quite honestly it is the case because most of the people who are participating in the run have
51:46been the previous investors and then the ones who like helped me from the beginning have believed
51:50in this since i said hey like are you willing to come with me on this ride
51:54i cannot feel that i could shortchange them
51:57because you believe all investors are created equal
52:01no but everyone's money and then they will ruin my relationship with the other investors and
52:06it just creates a nightmare if it doesn't happen like that it's fine i'm in oh wow i'd be in
52:13on
52:13this and i understand it's just a small little seat on a big bus but i tell you what it's
52:18a good bus to
52:19be honest so yeah i would give you all that money the quarter of a million for one percent
52:26i'm very flattered
52:31francisco i just don't think that i can do a better deal for you than sarah's down here
52:35i would happily give you the 250 grand but i wouldn't do it for one percent i'd need three
52:40percent of the business so i'm just going to be really honest with you because i think what
52:44you're doing is great but i have the opposite that's an offer i mean it's a straight offer i'd do
52:48250 grand for three percent having said that my experience and i've raised a lot of money hundreds
52:54and hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars and not all of my investors are created equal
52:58no there are some that are more useful depending on the stage that i'm at and that's not about
53:02being disrespectful to anybody on your cap table it's just that different people are good at
53:07different times so i'd give you that offer you have a a different offer right next to me and i'm
53:13sure
53:13you'll get something else but you know where i stand at least at this thank you very much
53:17congratulations to you and francisco do you know what i could not have described that better than
53:22emma because i made you an offer before i even knew how much you wanted and what equity you wanted
53:27right so i'm going to keep to my honor there and keep that offer so my offer is there with
53:35a slight
53:35tweak okay and my tweak comes in the form of advisory shares to emma's point because i think
53:42that that is so true not everybody is equal on that cap table when you look through it you do
53:49always
53:49and often get avengers in investors and i feel that i'm also one of those so i want three percent
53:57advisory shares and the benefit of that is that you can keep your cap table without offending anybody
54:02at that one percent and nobody gets diluted the only person that dilutes is you because you believe
54:09in the value of having me so that's my offer thank you one percent plus three percent advisory
54:18so you are at four percent yes you are at four m is at three
54:30francisco i think i think you're great and i love the vision
54:35i i it doesn't bother me um whether it's a smaller percentage because if you've got a business that you
54:41expect is going to really really gun it then you know that's a great thing to be part of um
54:48um so i am going to make you an offer oh wow and i'm going to offer you all of
54:54the money
54:55i want two percent of the business
55:01thank you very much just steven left
55:09i i'm going to do something that i don't typically do
55:11i like to park myself above the other dragons when i make an offer typically but i actually believe
55:18that if you took an offer today that was outside of this ask it probably wouldn't happen it would
55:26annoy too much of the people that have supported you on the journey you've been on so i've sat here
55:31the reason i've paused is because i've come to a point where i realized that the offer is the offer
55:38and you are so fantastic that i am going to give you that i'm going to give you the 250k
55:46for one percent
55:46of the business yeah it's really really rewarding
55:55i mean this is really overwhelming it's been a surreal experience to be quite honest
56:03um and now definitely on on on on the on sarah and steven like john for like it is why
56:11i came here
56:11asking so what can i say you you want to raise a million don't you i want to raise a
56:17million but
56:18i'm very fixed about the valuation for the reasons what i said but you could always accept those two
56:23offers at 250 000 for one percent each and then you will get 500 000 for two percent yeah
56:34um i'm happy to accept both offers because there's still room in the in the round absolutely
56:39i had a feeling that's the only way i was getting on the journey
56:42thank you so much it's like wonderful thank you everyone you deserve it you really do say you've
56:53raised half a million yes
56:57a historic outcome for francisco thank you who earns his place in the dragon's den hall of fame
57:07leaving the den with a cool half a million pounds i couldn't be more thrilled about it what can i
57:13say
57:14it's unbelievable and a duo of dragons that can help him build a business even more successful than his
57:21last isn't that the biggest investment ever on dragon's den yeah biggest deal in the den half a
57:27million it is just like a this coffee machine that mixes it's not it's not that special can you feel
57:36that jealous i can feel that yeah
57:52next time i've got quite a huge level of humility the irony of saying i've got a huge level of
57:57humility
57:58so what do you say on dragons dan let's go tuka go on um go on that's your new slogan
58:07i do get out
58:08a bad for one percent like she's broken the curse
58:11so
58:38so
58:39so
58:40so
58:40so